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[FYI] WebEx for T2TRG/WoT workshop remote participation (was: RE: [wot-ig/wg][plugfest] minutes - 6 November 2019)

From: 東村邦彦 / TOUMURA,KUNIHIKO <kunihiko.toumura.yv@hitachi.com>
Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 10:11:14 +0000
To: Kazuyuki Ashimura <ashimura@w3.org>, Public Web of Things IG <public-wot-ig@w3.org>, "public-wot-wg@w3.org" <public-wot-wg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <TY2PR01MB2106D28777CE8B6E5379CA48B57B0@TY2PR01MB2106.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com>
>   McCool: logistically, need to go back to the IRTF guys
>   ... but WebEx should be available
>   ... for my part
>   ... other parts to be covered by Jitsi
>   ... Kaz, can you provide a WebEx?
>   Kaz: yes

According to recently updated agenda page, T2TRG will provides WebEx for remote participation.


> Remote participation
> WebEx: https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m535485b7ca1a0bb1ccf9a4b983a9d898
> Call-in toll number (US/Canada): 1-650-479-3208
> Meeting number (access code): 319 927 920

TOUMURA Kunihiko - kunihiko.toumura.yv@hitachi.com<mailto:kunihiko.toumura.yv@hitachi.com>
Connectivity Research Department,
Center for Technology Innovation - Electronics,
Hitachi, Ltd.

From: Kazuyuki Ashimura <ashimura@w3.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 7, 2019 10:48 PM
To: Public Web of Things IG <public-wot-ig@w3.org>; public-wot-wg@w3.org
Subject: [!][wot-ig/wg][plugfest] minutes - 6 November 2019

available at:

also as text below.

Please note that this time some discussion about the IRTF/IETF
collaboration in Singapore next week is included in these minutes.

Thanks a lot for taking the minutes, Taki!



      [1] http://www.w3.org/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/322kB4ryPMhEkmEehtSSpBx7Vc?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F>

                               - DRAFT -


06 Nov 2019


      [2] https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_WoT_WebConf#6_Nov_2019<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3GdbnxDsY9p3KpEKWcXdegb7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWoT%2FIG%2Fwiki%2FMain_WoT_WebConf%236_Nov_2019>


          Michael_McCool, Kaz_Ashimura, Dave_Raggett, Ege_Korkan,
          Kunihiko_Toumura, Michael_Koster, Taki_Kamiya,
          Takahisa_Suzuki, Tetsushi_Matsuda, Tomoaki_Mizushima,
          Zoltan_Kis, Ryuichi_Matsukura

          Sebastian_Kaebisch, David_Ezell




     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]Agenda
         2. [5]New security slot
         3. [6]IRTF/IETF collaboration
         4. [7]Joint call with MEIG
         5. [8]Transportation workshop report
         6. [9]WG Charter
         7. [10]Publications.
         8. [11]Academics
         9. [12]Future F2F plan
        10. [13]Marketing
        11. [14]Scripting
        12. [15]Security
        13. [16]Binding
        14. [17]Plugfest/Workshop/Hackathon
     * [18]Summary of Action Items
     * [19]Summary of Resolutions

   <kaz> scribenick: taki

   <scribe> Scribe: TK


   McCool: Logistics
   ... I put schedules in wiki.
   ... the current WoT WG charter ends in December.
   ... updated CRs for TD and Architecture published - would aim
   18 of December for PR transition; so PR transition schedule is
   ... any changes to agenda?

New security slot

   McCool: new time slots for security call
   ... old time slot works better for most people. Elena also can
   make it.
   ... starting next week, 10pm Japan, 2pm Europe for security
   call on Monday.

IRTF/IETF collaboration

   McCool: next week, I will go to Singapore. 11/15 is workshop.
   ... I plan to setup remote access.

   McCool is showing workshop Agenda...

   [20]IRTF T2T Workshop page

     [20] https://github.com/t2trg/2019-11-singapore<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3JHaCuAZTuaPVBAsTZPDnxE7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Ft2trg%2F2019-11-singapore>

   McCool: focus is on semantic tools.
   ... OneDM, etc.
   ... time is assigned for WoT in workshop.
   ... Toumura-san also have something about Discovery to present.

   Koster: We should learn how to extract terms from OneDM in WoT.

   McCool: I'd be happy to do that if everyone is ok.

   Koster: It is also related to semantics.

   McCool: Discovery also includes aspects of semantic discovery.
   ... search for capability etc.
   ... seaching with criteria, constraints.

   Koster: people should learn those things during workshop.

   McCool: Did you work on translator to generate OCF(?) ?

   Koster: Not yet.

   McCool: Workshop registration due is Nov 1.
   ... registration was only for food.
   ... You can still register.
   ... Hackathon registration is also necessary.
   ... We will have PlugFest call after this call.

Joint call with MEIG

   McCool: Media and Entertainment IG joint call might be
   ... Maybe in January or February.

   Kaz: They meet the first Tuesday of every month.

   McCool: We should decide schedule soon.
   ... We should have doodle to see how many people can make on
   Dec 3.
   ... I think we can use their time slot.

   Kaz: 10-15 usually join in their meeting.
   ... I can create doodle including December, January and

   McCool: We can discuss result next week.

   Kaz: We also include our WoT slots?

   McCool: Yes.
   ... starting Dec 3 and 4.

   Kaz: Note that there are many US participants in MEIG, so they
   might prefer their own slot on Tuesday.

Transportation workshop report

   <inserted> scribenick: kaz

   Taki: right before TPAC, there was a workshop
   ... Ted Guild from the W3C Team organized it
   ... 60-70 people there
   ... some were local
   ... majority from outside US
   ... nobody from Asia
   ... probably many went to TPAC
   ... how WoT would be related to transportation data model
   ... their purpose was automotive wg
   ... one big milestone for their deliverable
   ... and aiming new topics for standardization
   ... with new stakeholders like Uber and BMW
   ... didn't see the minutes yet
   ... not sure about the final conclusion about the next step
   ... but my feeling was collecting new themes on transportation
   data model

   McCool: are they rechartering?

   Taki: didn't mention any concrete plan there
   ... there are links to presentations
   ... like Uber's ones
   ... still have issue on common data model
   ... presentations from ISO, etc., as well
   ... upper level ontology for city indicators (ISO 21972), etc.
   ... related to our WoT work
   ... in the future, we should be able to collaborate

   McCool: this is the Automotive WG
   ... wondering about smart transportations
   ... different from usual cars?

   Taki: a couple of presentations to integrate different kinds of
   transportation modalities
   ... bus, car, train, etc.
   ... some university also presented some ideas
   ... Univ. Tronto, Ghent Univ and Southampton Univ
   ... there are also some privacy issues there
   ... would be interesting

   McCool: right. not only for vehicle services
   ... link to the whole workshop?

   [21]workshop agenda page

     [21] https://www.w3.org/auto/events/data-ws-2019/schedule.html<https://clicktime.symantec.com/33CZtYTBtvDaLAc1npf1kJ77Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fauto%2Fevents%2Fdata-ws-2019%2Fschedule.html>

WG Charter

   <scribe> scribenick: taki

   McCool: We submitted draft charter to W3M.
   ... It has to go through AC review.
   ... We are waiting for review results from W3M.
   ... I am a bit concerned about the AC review after that. We
   need to be more proactive to get votes.
   ... We need 20 AC votes.
   ... All active WG members should vote.
   ... Make sure AC votes.
   ... before ThanksGiving, we should get at least 10 votes.
   ... Nov 29 is ThanksGiving.
   ... We should get votes before that.
   ... Vote Deadline would be around Dec 18 (given the procedure).
   ... It is the same day as our expected PR transition deadline.
   ... If we need to make changes to charter, we again should have
   charter call to address them.
   ... We get feedback by next Wednesday from W3M.

   Kaz: People should start talking to their AC reps.


   McCool: Architecture and TD have just been published.
   ... Security and privacy guidelines Note has been also
   ... today on November 6.
   ... the current WoT WG Charter ends the end of December. Please
   plan to be prepared to address CR feedback in early December.

   McCool: Publication URLs are available in agenda (and copied

   <kaz> [22]wot-security (Note)

     [22] https://www.w3.org/TR/2019/NOTE-wot-security-20191106/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3JMVEanUFLRJVMmFsxrWh167Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2F2019%2FNOTE-wot-security-20191106%2F>

   <kaz> [23]wot-thing-description (updated CR)

     [23] https://www.w3.org/TR/2019/CR-wot-thing-description-20191106/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3T5U9Jr2R7MhxqUJQ3C85rj7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2F2019%2FCR-wot-thing-description-20191106%2F>

   <kaz> [24]wot-architecture (updated CR)

     [24] https://www.w3.org/TR/2019/CR-wot-architecture-20191106/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/32GkrvW1AnE8qxG6pLytSkS7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2F2019%2FCR-wot-architecture-20191106%2F>

   McCool: Thank you everyone for contribution, and Kaz's effort
   for publication.


   McCool: Lucas Bonvin. We may want to invite him.
   ... I'd like to check the basic procedure.
   ... Chairs can invite guests according to Kaz.
   ... They are not a W3C member.

   Ege: I am also being asked in the next charter.

   Kaz: I think there are at least two levels of participation,
   (1) Participating in telecons, etc., and (2) creating library
   and toolkit, etc.
   ... This person is developing libraries about binding, etc. It
   would be nice addition for PlugFest.

   McCool: contribution to specification. and contribution to
   PlugFest. there are those two.
   ... Spec contribution involves IP issues.
   ... contribution to PlugFest, bar is lower.
   ... Do we have policy available?

   Kaz: W3C patent policy. People need to agree on this before

   McCool: We can invite academics for 5 minutes presentation.
   ... for introductory presentation first.

   Kaz: W3C allows chairs to invite guests.

   <McCool> proposal: chairs can generally invite external guests,
   but the group agrees that academics interested in participating
   should be invited, as long as they agree the W3C Patent Policy

   McCool: any comments?

   Kaz: fine.

   <inserted> [25]fyi, policy for inviting guests

     [25] https://www.w3.org/2003/12/22-pp-faq.html#guest<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3PbZtLqNZo1VhBHNp9yakoB7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2003%2F12%2F22-pp-faq.html%23guest>

   RESOLUTION: chairs can generally invite external guests, but
   the group agrees that academics interested in participating
   should be invited, as long as they agree the W3C Patent Policy

Future F2F plan

   McCool: We should plan for F2Fs next year.
   ... March 2020. We should decide before end of 2019.
   ... Helsinki is one candidate. Munich is also.
   ... I am going to look into Helsinki.

   Zoltan: Helsinki is an option. There is a local university.

   McCool: Charter says June. March may be difficult in Helsinki?

   Zoltan: Not best month but not a big problem.
   ... July in Helsinki is perfect.

   McCool: June?

   Zoltan: should be OK.

   McCool: Intel may be able to host a meeting around June.
   ... If Helsinki in June, what is the plan for March? Munich?
   ... September in Vancouver.
   ... Maybe Asia for March.
   ... any idea for location?
   ... Sebastian talked about having a launch event. London was a

   Zoltan: Easy to fly to there.

   McCool: June Asia is also fine.
   ... Next week we will discuss further.
   ... We should plan ahead of time.


   Ege: agreed to create issues on GitHub and then discuss with
   the W3C Team.

   <ege> [26]https://danielpeintner.github.io/wot-pages/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3JJTC49sTwPp2u4zQPhmMzG7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fdanielpeintner.github.io%2Fwot-pages%2F>

     [26] https://danielpeintner.github.io/wot-pages/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3JJTC49sTwPp2u4zQPhmMzG7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fdanielpeintner.github.io%2Fwot-pages%2F>

   Ege: Initial Web site idea. I can send you a link.
   ... Done by Daniel using a template provided by W3C.

   Kaz: I asked Naomi to join the Marketing call.
   ... I will ask her to join tomorrow's call again.

   Ege: There is a marketing call tomorrow.

   McCool: We should make a progress in tomorrow's call.
   ... any reports from the other TFs?


   Zoltan: We have an issue. We discussed in the Architecture
   call. We should discuss in the TD call too.
   ... Content type and schema, and streaming use cases.
   ... It is not well specified how content type and schemas are
   related to each other.
   ... Deployment with demo. Using manifest. Web Assembly is
   ... WASM is getting popularity in automotive area.
   ... It aligns with Edge.


   McCool: Security call. We decided schedule. We did some edits
   for publication.
   ... Privacy risks and mitigation part is outdated.
   ... Best practices document has not been published yet.
   ... Oliver from Siemens will join us for contribution.


   Ege: Idea of publication of Binding Templates.
   ... We still have old examples.

   McCool: We should publish an updated Note.
   ... TD needs to be made consistent, and the Editors draft is
   already consistent.

   Kaz: We can publish an updated group Note.

   McCool: A month from now is good.

   Ege: I cleaned up already.

   McCool: Incomplete is ok as long as correct.

   Ege: We can decide in TD/Binding Template call.

   McCool: Regarding the collaboration with IRTF/IETF, Toumura-san
   created a presentation.
   ... Let's come back 15 minutes past the hour.

   Toumura: I only have iPad today but can join the meeting

   McCool: can show your slides for you then.

   [Main call discussion ends]

   [Some more discussion on collaboration with IRTF/IETF in
   Singapore in 5mins]


   <scribe> scribenick: kaz

   Present-for-this-session: Kaz, McCool, Toumura, Suzuki,

   McCool: several things on the agenda
   ... one is workshop
   ... one hour slot
   ... half on wot intro
   ... and another half on interesting topics
   ... leading to Koster's One Data Model talk

   [27]Toumura-san's presentation

     [27] https://github.com/k-toumura/document-for-wot/blob/master/20191106-wot-coap.pdf<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3EwcA1qcuywFDV3m4QKWro47Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fk-toumura%2Fdocument-for-wot%2Fblob%2Fmaster%2F20191106-wot-coap.pdf>

   McCool: a lot of stuff on semantics during the workshop

   Toumura: just ideas at the moment
   ... [Working Items...]
   ... how to collaborate with the IRTF T2TRG
   ... how to connect with devices using REST or CoAP
   ... [Complex Interactions]
   ... complex interaction by current TD vs CoRE/CoRAL
   ... how to handle state information?
   ... CoRAL document may contain interactions meaningful in the
   current state
   ... [Complex Interactions (2/2)]
   ... possible approach
   ... how to interact with pure RESTful-style from WoT consumer?

   McCool: there are 2 approaches, static TD / Dynamic TD
   ... and possibly a third approach
   ... instead of updating TD, could have an explicit state model
   ... returning document fragment would be the third approach
   ... including information on the next steps

   Toumura: [Discovery]
   ... CoRE proposes several mechanisms for discovery/directory
   ... discovery by CoAP multicast
   ... IPv6 authoritative border router option

   McCool: basically use the existing mechanism
   ... and provide a link
   ... register address of the directory service with new link
   ... would find the directory service
   ... require authentication
   ... searches are done by standard way
   ... if my queries are visible from others, there are privacy
   ... need to have authentication for query
   ... level of authentication provided now is not that good
   ... something like google search might be good
   ... we should allow many different kinds of interactions
   ... directory services should have standard I/F
   ... we should not directly point TDs
   ... but should get TDs via directory
   ... I'll add Toumura-san's contents to my slides
   ... for the WoT keynote speech
   ... personally think discovery service and directory service
   should be separate
   ... but definitely agree we should handle the existing

   Toumura: yes
   ... this is a starting point
   ... [Ideas for IETF Hakathon]

   McCool: it's nice to have self-hosted services
   ... how resource directories would work
   ... need to see if CoRE-RD would be enough

   Toumura: any implementations so far?

   McCool: no

   Toumura: CoRE-RD is not so powerful (like Google search)

   McCool: do you have time for prototyping something?

   Toumura: might be able to generate something for
   register/retrieve using CoRE-RD

   McCool: could list several possible approaches with pros/cons
   ... are you coming?

   Toumura: will be there in Singapore

   McCool: great
   ... we could have clearer views as outcome from Singapore
   ... anything else?


   McCool: logistically, need to go back to the IRTF guys
   ... but WebEx should be available
   ... for my part
   ... other parts to be covered by Jitsi
   ... Kaz, can you provide a WebEx?

   Kaz: yes

   [28]T2T workshop agenda

     [28] https://github.com/t2trg/2019-11-singapore<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3JHaCuAZTuaPVBAsTZPDnxE7Vc?u=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Ft2trg%2F2019-11-singapore>


Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

    1. [29]chairs can generally invite external guests, but the
       group agrees that academics interested in participating
       should be invited, as long as they agree the W3C Patent

   [End of minutes]

    Minutes formatted by David Booth's [30]scribe.perl version
    1.152 ([31]CVS log)
    $Date: 2019/11/07 13:38:26 $

     [30] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3WB78L64mEDJfCANxp9bBF47Vc?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdev.w3.org%2Fcvsweb%2F~checkout~%2F2002%2Fscribe%2Fscribedoc.htm>
     [31] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/<https://clicktime.symantec.com/3PsjzAZmFMD3e3Mnfu1fLxr7Vc?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdev.w3.org%2Fcvsweb%2F2002%2Fscribe%2F>

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