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RE: How to attract new members to the WoT IG?

From: Roes, J.B.M. (Jasper) <jasper.roes@tno.nl>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2016 10:47:49 +0000
To: Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org>, Soumya Kanti Datta <Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr>
CC: "public-wot-ig@w3.org" <public-wot-ig@w3.org>
Message-ID: <2DEA4B0E4CE81549854B99619C8FE99CBA78C1F2@EXC-MBX01.tsn.tno.nl>
Hello Soumya and Dave,

I also agree on the need to have work items on semantics and security, as these seem to be most relevant topics at this moment in WoT and IoT. But what we have to keep in mind is that while on the security side it is normally fairly easy for people to understand why it is important and why work should be done, on the semantics side this is often much more difficult, especially when going into RDF/Linked Data and so forth. For most developers this is way out of their current activities and they cannot easily contribute to it, that is why in the Netherlands somebody proposed to extend the 5-star open data model, to a six star open data model, adding an additional step between the 4-star and 5-star level of the original model, being API’s. So what I think is important is to show how semantics can help making it easier for parties to being able to use data, and ensuring that they do not have to implement new API’s almost every day, as the data can be translated. The WoT group can then focus on have standards API descriptions (important for developers and them might want to provide input on this, or at least review), and focus on the semantics by creating domain models and constraints based on RDF/ontologies. This would benefit both parties as it solves issues that parties are currently facing with and endless amount of API’s that they need to implement that all work different, but the work on RFD domain models also paves the way for introducing more state-of-the-art techniques in the near future as the base has already been layed. This is at least what I am seeing with the work that we are doing around the Smart Appliances Reference ontology (SAREF) with ETSI. Most parties now interested in SAREF are not into ontologies, but are seeing that in the future the world of ontologies can help them in reaching interoperability and being able to sell their products in a broader market.

Best regards,


From: Dave Raggett [mailto:dsr@w3.org]
Sent: vrijdag 13 mei 2016 17:40
To: Soumya Kanti Datta
Cc: public-wot-ig@w3.org
Subject: Re: How to attract new members to the WoT IG?

In my experience it is hard for SMEs to actively participate in W3C groups due to a lack of resources. The key people are already working flat out and have very little time to devote to standards groups.  This is where outreach to SMEs and developer communities would be helpful, including semi-permanent plugfests available over the Internet. In return, we could seek ways to solicit feedback from developers in a way that isn’t too time consuming for them. Requiring github pull requests would be an example of raising the bar way too high.

I am hoping the we can apply the outstanding pull requests so that we have a better picture of what the IG charter draft currently says and where we could strengthen it, e.g. in respect to SMEs.

Do we really have to wait for the Wednesday call?  That would see very slow and inefficient way to progress.

On 13 May 2016, at 09:38, Soumya Kanti Datta <Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr<mailto:Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr>> wrote:

Don't forget SMEs not having a big team and doing a lot of innovation in IoT and WoT spaces.


Research Engineer, EURECOM, France | +33658194342 | @skdatta2010
https://sites.google.com/site/skdunfolded | Skype id: soumyakantidatta

On 12/05/2016 15:09, Dave Raggett wrote:

On 12 May 2016, at 13:46, Soumya Kanti Datta
<Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr<mailto:Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr> <mailto:Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr>>


I agree that we need work items on semantics and security.

Great - I will put some thoughts together for these to stimulate
discussion, including people at potential member organisations.

But from my exp, not a lot of developer can create software modules
for semantic computing. So, with a colleague of mine, I worked on
creating a framework trying to hide semantics from developers. It was
the same I talked about during the last f2f open day.

I feel best practice guidelines are highly necessary to give
guidelines to developers.

Most people are specialists in some area or other. This is why teams are
important as a way to bring together people with complementary skills.
Guidelines that can help different kinds of developers would indeed be
useful, but as Alan says, not sufficient to convince people to come and
be part of the Interest Group and help us progress.


Research Engineer, EURECOM, France | +33658194342 | @skdatta2010 |
https://sites.google.com/site/skdunfolded | Skype id: soumyakantidatta

Quoting Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org<mailto:dsr@w3.org> <mailto:dsr@w3.org>>:

Hi Soumya,

Do  you think that a ?best practices? document will be sufficient to
attract new members?  Wouldn?t it be much weaker than having
explicit work items on semantics and security?

On 12 May 2016, at 03:20, Soumya Kanti Datta
<mailto:Soumya-Kanti.Datta@eurecom.fr>> wrote:

I agree that semantics and security are really vital for WoT. At
the same time, we must keep in mind that WoT or IoT is highly
interdisciplinary. Therefore, it would be good to create a best
practices deliverable/document (showing guidelines for global
interoperability) to attract the developers.
Research Engineer, EURECOM, France | +33658194342 | @skdatta2010 |

<https://sites.google.com/site/skdunfolded> | Skype id:
On 11-05-2016 19:49, Dave Raggett wrote:

What do we need to do in the IG charter to make it easier to
attract new members?  Before writing a pull request, it makes
sense to first discuss this challenge and see what ideas emerge
and where we have a rough consensus.

When talking with people in IoT alliances and other standards
development organisations, I have seen that there is general
agreement on the importance of semantic interoperability and
security.  W3C is respected for its work on standards relating to
RDF and linked data, and is expected to take the lead on enabling
declarative domain models and constraints.

For security, so far each organisation has approached this
independently. This risks problems for end to end security for
services that span platforms specified by different organisations.
 Without shared trust assumptions, parties will only be able to
share data that is marked as being publicly accessible.  By
focusing on inter-platform standards for the IoT, W3C has a
mission to work with the IoT organisations to encourage alignment
over trust assumptions for security and how to describe this in

We have very few people currently in the IG with the requisite
experience. What do we need to do in the new IG charter to help
attract such people?

Do you agree that semantics and security are critical to realising
the potential for the Web of Things?

One idea would be to add explicit deliverables on semantic
modelling and end to end security, what do you think?

 Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org <mailto:dsr@w3.org<mailto:dsr@w3.org%20%3cmailto:dsr@w3.org>> <mailto:dsr@w3.org>>

 Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org<mailto:dsr@w3.org> <mailto:dsr@w3.org> <mailto:dsr@w3.org>>

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   Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org<mailto:dsr@w3.org> <mailto:dsr@w3.org>>

   Dave Raggett <dsr@w3.org<mailto:dsr@w3.org>>

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Received on Monday, 16 May 2016 10:48:23 UTC

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