- From: Manu Sporny <msporny@digitalbazaar.com>
- Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2014 15:52:46 -0400
- To: public-webpayments@w3.org
On 04/24/2014 10:51 AM, Andrew Mackie wrote: > Following a conversation with Manu and Brent last week, I've started > the task of categorizing the use cases from a conceptual standpoint > in order to ensure that a) we include every use case that we need and > b) the final set of use cases is well structured to aid > understanding. Great first cut at refactoring, Andrew! > As you can see, I've added a number of comments and questions and > I've identified a number of gaps that we need to fill in. I will > continue to play with the structure - in the meantime I appreciate > your comments, answers, identification of gaps and so on. Responses to your questions (not gaps) below: > Identity / Trust: Is there any approval process / commons which will > allow users to identify which apps are safe? There definitely shouldn't be an approval process (centralization and provides a choke point for keeping competitors out). We could have nothing (which is the state of affairs today, nobody tells you which bank you should bank with). We could also have a blacklist (known phishing / scam sites - Google Chrome has a great implementation of this and it wouldn't require us to do anything extra). > Assessing payers / payees: These two tasks (1. verifying identity > and 2. Assessing trustworthiness) are distinct and important pieces > of work which IMO should be separated into separate use cases. The > latter (assessing trustworthiness) is a massive piece of work that > IMO should be outside the scope of this project. +1, agree completely. > Know Your Customer (KYC): [Question] What are our design criteria for > this element? The minimum would be to enable banks to share KYC clearing information. This would include, at a minimum, name, birthday, government ID, nationality. > Is there anything else that needs to be done to help users meet > their KYC obligations? Replace "users" with "payment processors", they're the ones that are on the hook to meet KYC obligations. > Identification Methods: Place identity in a decentralized network - > What other goals do we have here? That's not really a goal. The goal is "Provide an entity with a portable digital identity". One way to do that would be to store it in a decentralized database (good idea, but requires more work). Another would be to write a specification elaborating on how you would export your identity from one identity provider to another identity provider (bad idea, but easier to make incremental progress on). > App Stores - selling apps in mobile scenarios: What is unique about > this use case, that it's worthy of a specific mention here? Is it a > different form of identity (tied to the phone / SIM card / Accounts > on the phone)? There's nothing really unique about identity and app stores, the same identity mechanism should be used for all the payment use cases. It is important to be able to tie identity to a mobile ID number (phone number, UICC number, SIM number, etc) > [Rewrite] Knowing that data minimization principles are followed by > systems in a payment chain I don't really understand what this use case was intended to achieve. We'll have to ask the use case scribe that wrote it down. > Privacy / Anonymity: Is it enough to make this visible to users, or > should it be a minimum standard for participants in the payment > chain (apps and payment processors)? If so, how do enforce that > standard (my suggestion is to allow users to express demand for apps > and processors which meet these minimum standards)? This wanders into the policy space, which we will have very little control over. We can't really prescribe anything, and limiting the technical spec will just ensure that large implementers will ignore the advice. > Privacy / Anonymity Use Cases - Leveraging variable degrees of > identity/anonymity per requirements of the payment transaction. What > do we mean by this? This means that you don't need to provide your government ID number if all you are doing is buying a litre of milk or a single tank of gasoline. However, if you are buying a home, you will most likely need to provide your government ID to the financial crimes regulatory body in your country during the transaction because the financial exchange will trip an anti-money laundering regulatory event for your financial institution (your bank already does this). If you are buying a handgun, you will need to provide a different set of information (for a background check, for example). Even more information (like a government issued license and other digital paperwork) will be needed if you're buying enriched uranium, and so on. > Identity solution must not rely on passwords for primary > functionality. What should the identity solution rely on (if not > passwords)? This is a bit misleading, you will still have a password, most likely... but it will be hooked up to a two-factor authentication method. Ideally it would be based on public/private key cryptography, but even the keychain on the device you're using would most likely be protected by a PIN or password. > Identity solution must not rely on passwords for primary > functionality. What constitutes 'primary functionality'? "Primary functionality" would be, proving that you are who you say you are. We may not be able to get away with not using passwords until all of us are carrying around cheap public/private key hardware (most likely, our mobile phones). > Payee-Initiated payments- Use Cases - Payee initiates a request for > payment How do we prevent / limit unsolicited requests for payment > (a new type of highly profitable spam)? Is this a problem today? There's nothing preventing someone from requesting payment whenever you hit any website, but most don't because they know it'll almost ensure the visitor won't come back. There are concerns over triggering any kind of browser payment API. That will most likely use the same protections that are used today: Ensure that any trigger of the API would have to be initiated by the person browsing via a mouse click or tap. > Methods of Receiving Receipt - Use Case - Customer can receive > digital receipts (receipt POSTed to user's digital receipt storage) > Implies storage capacity for receipts within the payment app > (wallet) ... should this be a specification? If we decide to make it a use case we support, it will be a separate specification. > Where / how do we intend to set minimum specifications for payment > apps (wallets)? I don't know what you mean by where. "How" will be through the same process we set minimum requirements for all specifications created through the W3C. That process is collection of use cases, determining which use cases to support by building consensus, design of technology to meet the use cases, debate over the best mode of operation for the technology, and finally building consensus around the solution. We then iterate on the technology every few years until something better comes along. > Receipts - Possible Extensions - Payments / digital receipts should > be applicable to Encrypted Media Extension authorization to show > content. Does this really relate to contracts (discussed later) where > the EME is the software-based embodiment of a license granted to the > payer because of their payment? Yes, it's more contracts related rather than receipts related. That said, a receipt is a special form of contract/proof of purchase. I think you've proven that you understand the nuances here, so I won't elaborate unless you'd like me to. > Receipts - Possible Extensions - Secure Element-based offline > payment - By this do we really mean offering a receipt for a payment > that isn't a web payment (whether that's via NFC or something else, > e.g. cash)? What we mean is that two people should be able to meet far away from civilization and, using their mobile devices, agree to a transaction, counter-sign a contract using digital signatures, and sync that transaction w/ the global financial network when they come back online (even if they come back online years later). > Sale of assets - Use Cases - Managed access to personal > identity/attributes as economically valuable assets in a payment > system Notes: First iteration would probably not focus on the > "economically valuable" dimension of the personal identity attributes > What do we have in mind here, the ability to sell the right for third > parties to access your data (as proposed by Jaron Lanier in 'Who owns > the future?')? For the second iteration, yes, the Jaron Lanier view of this. However, for the first iteration, this merely has to do with the ability to prove that you are who you say you are by showing a website a digital ID card of sorts. For example, "I am Andrew Mackie because I have this token that was digitally signed by the Australian government proving that I am who I say I am." > Unsorted Use Cases [Rewrite] Knowing what info will be required to > supplement a transaction. [Question] What kind of info do we have in > mind here? What do we mean by 'supplement'? When you buy a firearm, as a merchant, you may want to supplement the receipt with a proof that you did a background check on the individual and it came back as authorized. By supplement, we mean "add information to the digital receipt in some way". > Unsorted Use Cases [Rewrite] Protect privacy when making purchases > using geolocation technologies. [Question] Do we mean protect people > *from* others who are using geolocation technologies? Yes, kinda. We mean "protect people that could reveal their geolocation to a party that does not have their best interest in mind". It's a slippery slope, very hard to classify "protect" and "best interest". > Unsorted Use Cases [Rewrite] [Not in initial scope] Realtime > purchases involving prerequisite reception of funds from > international sources (e.g. family). [Question] Do we mean some kind > of just-in-time system where we tie together two otherwise separate > transactions? I think we're going for something like the following: "I'm in Mexico and I would like to buy this mobile phone so I can call home, the funding source will be my mom in Canada." > Once I've cleaned it up some more and incorporated this initial > feedback I'll find a way to open it up for a more immediate / open > form of collaboration (and any suggestions on the best format are > welcome!). The Web Payments wiki has historically provided the best collaborative output in this group (most number of people contributing to a single document): https://www.w3.org/community/webpayments/wiki/ -- manu -- Manu Sporny (skype: msporny, twitter: manusporny, G+: +Manu Sporny) Founder/CEO - Digital Bazaar, Inc. blog: The Marathonic Dawn of Web Payments http://manu.sporny.org/2014/dawn-of-web-payments/
Received on Saturday, 26 April 2014 19:53:19 UTC