[minutes] 2014-08-01 Webizen task force teleconference

Hi all,
cc: Julian (for action item)

Belatedly, the minutes of the Webizen task force teleconference of last  
Friday, 1 August 2014:
   http://www.w3.org/2014/08/01-webizen-minutes.html

There was one action item:
ACTION: Julian will determine whether colleagues from market research  
firms could help with the market research study.

The minutes are linked from the wiki:
   https://www.w3.org/wiki/Webizen#Meeting_records_and_actions

Cheers,
Coralie

Text snapshot:
--------------
                       Webizens project discussion
                               01 Aug 2014
    [2]Agenda
       [2]  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webizen/2014Jul/0000.html
    See also: [3]IRC log
       [3] http://www.w3.org/2014/08/01-webizen-irc

Attendees
    Present
           Jeff Jaffe, Veronica Thom, Georg Rehm, Léonie J. Watson,
           Christophe Guéret, Julian Harriott, Mark Crawford,
           Kimberly West, [IPcaller]
    Regrets
           JC Verdié, Ann Bassetti, Daniel Glazman, Coralie
           Mercier, Michiel Leenaars, Armin Haller
    Chair
           Jeff Jaffe
    Scribe
           veronica, cgueret

Contents
      * [4]Topics
      * [5]Summary of Action Items
      __________________________________________________________

    <cgueret> Hi there! Zakim tells me I'm the first one on the
    phone, is that normal ?

    <jeff> yes, Christophe, most people will dial in a minute
    before the hour, until 5 minutes after.

    <cgueret> ok! :)

    <cgueret> ^_^

    <veronica> audio is good for me

    <veronica> scribenick: veronica

    jeff: history of this project...
    ... about 9 months ago, based on input from Alex Russell at
    TPAC meeting
    ... Tim asked we design a program for the broader world
    ... presented to recent AC meeting in June
    ... but the specific program we designed did not meet approval
    ... some on AC thought we were offering too few, too much, not
    right benefits
    ... so here we are, working on a new program

    [kimberly west just joined]

    jeff: so that was the background
    ... we had some brainstorming on email list
    ... this is the first call
    ... intent to meet half a dozen times
    ... agenda - we should agree on goals of the program
    ... this is important to get lined up in the beginning
    ... success criteria; we need to know what that means
    ... hopefully first 3 agenda items can be accomplished quickly
    ... any questions before we start?

    [no responses]

    jeff: hearing no questions or comments
    ... start with goals of program
    ... in email discussion prior to this call
    ... one of the challenges [TV Raman], what is the goal?

    <jeff> A. W3C wants to establish itself as the primary steward
    of the Web, and toward that goal wants to have individuals
    participate.

    <jeff> B. Countries grant citizenships -- W3C wants to create
    Webizens a la Citizens

    <jeff> C. W3C wants to involve the wider community -- rather
    than be seen as a place where only companies play

    <jeff> D. W3C wants to create an additional revenue stream

    <jeff> E. Degrading further: W3C wants to sell t-shirts and
    coffee-mugs that are "branded".

    jeff: on email chain, we want to involve a wider community

    <jeff> The idea of the program is to allow individuals to
    affiliate with the Web standards community ... we seek to make
    available a new means to congregate as a community.

    jeff: allow individuals to engage
    ... so I'm interested on POV from those on call

    <LJWatson> +1 for C

    jeff: from T.V.'s list, what I've mentioned or something else

    Christophe: I really like this idea for wider community to join
    ... not fond of B

    <MarkCrawford> Several member companies run ecosystems. These
    ecosystems consist of customers, partners, etc and provide a
    forum for discussing issues around using products, sharing
    solutions, providing feedback to the host company, and for the
    host company to share information out. Was this type of
    approach considered in the original group

    jeff: thanks for that input
    ... I like Mark' comments
    ... in my view, probably a broader and more complete; gives it
    more meat
    ... conceptually, we were thinking of something like C
    ... but I like Mark's language
    ... goes beyond high level goal

    <MarkCrawford> SAP for example offers recognition for top
    participants

    jeff: more into the expected activities

    <Julian-Nominet> Q

    <Zakim> cgueret, you wanted to comment

    <Kimberly> It seems to me that A and C are related

    julian: I think what Mark put down is interesting
    ... do we need to look at this from a specific mission?
    ... for instance, there are lots of profit organizations that
    concentrate on professionalism
    ... are we trying to educate?

    jeff: I think that's a great comment
    ... initially the mission defined was weak
    ... enhancing affiliation less defined than what you described

    Julian: greater creativity

    jeff: that's a good add; we should have a mission
    ... let's take more comments on mission

    <MarkCrawford> Not to get too pedantic, but if we have a
    mission, then we should have a vision of where we want to be

    <jeff> Mission candidates: Affiliation, Professionalism,
    Education, Creativity

    jeff: affiliation, professionalism, education and creativity
    ... so let's get comments on Mission

    <cgueret> MarkCrawford: wouldn't that be what was listed as
    goal A ?

    Leonie: our mission is to create a more inclusive standards
    community

    <MarkCrawford> In answer to Christophe - I would say that A is
    the vision

    jeff: I would identify that as similar to a stronger
    affiliation; let's replace with Inclusion
    ... we don't have to decide everything on today's call

    <cgueret> MarkCrawford: +1

    jeff: criteria next
    ... 1. we shouldn't lose money
    ... 2. should be a sizable number of people in program
    ... don't have a number in mind
    ... let's have input on Criteria for Program
    ... should relate to eventual Mission

    <MarkCrawford> There is a dichotomy between wanting to increase
    participation to traditionally unengaged folks and charging for
    the privilege

    jeff: what should be other criteria?
    ... or +1 to what Chaals provided
    ... ok, let's accept Chaals

    <bkardell_> There are other ways to increase participation
    which don't involve membership

    Christophe: getting more people to participate is good
    ... @@@ privilege

    <bkardell_> The benefit of membership is a voice in an and tag
    and more generally because that is how w3c is structured

    Christophe: if webizens could help us @@@ in other groups @@

    jeff: i think Christophe said that one key point is to have
    some expectation that most IEs chose to be a webizen

    Christophe: also get new people

    <cgueret> [6]http://manu.sporny.org/2014/json-ld-origins-2/

       [6] http://manu.sporny.org/2014/json-ld-origins-2/

    <jeff> [7]https://www.w3.org/wiki/Webizen

       [7] https://www.w3.org/wiki/Webizen

    jeff: let's move to Target Market
    ... there was a lot of confusion about the marketing study
    ... when we presented the previous version of the webizen
    proposal
    ... some of the feedback from AC was 'you invented something;
    don't know who would sign up'

    <inserted> scribenick: cgueret

    veronica: some key points, number of "invited expert ->
    webizen" as criteria but also number of webizen who would not
    have otherwise been invited expert or members. As pointed out
    by Manu Sporny in his blog, the work on JSON-LD benefited from
    such participation

    <inserted> scribenick: veronica

    veronica: so you should know who might be joining
    ... decided not to go back to AC without marketing info
    ... in email thread, begging some of our organizations to
    perform marketing study
    ... but it was not successful
    ... Ian from Communications team suggested this task force
    design a survey
    ... to send out to everyone what the new program is
    ... as ask what they think
    ... this isn't a formal study unfortunately

    <Julian-Nominet> q

    veronica: we can create the survey, create the questions
    ... do we as task force think this would be sufficient [no
    input received from emails]

    julian: I have a very good relationship with CEO of a market
    research company
    ... I could ask her if that's of interest?

    jeff: yes, let's ask

    <jeff> ACTION: Julian will determine whether colleagues from
    market research firms could help with the market research
    study. [recorded in
    [8]http://www.w3.org/2014/08/01-webizen-minutes.html#action01]

    julian: this plus Twitter could work

    leonie: market research is really good, any data from community
    at large is valuable

    <bkardell_> Is the problem how to get people to answer or what
    to ask?

    jeff: so I hear +1

    <cgueret> +1

    leonie: anything we can get will help

    <Julian-Nominet> +1

    <MarkCrawford> +1

    <LJWatson> +1

    jeff: please type +1 that it fulfills or -1

    <Kimberly> +1

    +1

    <cgueret> +1

    <Georg> +1

    jeff: so we have consensus
    ... now the fun part
    ... Brainstorming: the design of the program
    ... to recall, previous proposal we had a market basket of
    goodies
    ... cost was $100 to join to help defray some costs and also
    get some goodie, mug, shirt ...

    <bkardell_> As I said previously... We have enough swag

    jeff: But, Webizens collectively could somehow have some
    limited powers to participate

    <bkardell_> The benefit is membership and representation

    jeff: AC opinions: too many goodies cheapened the program

    <bkardell_> I agree with ACS on this

    <cgueret> +1 too

    jeff: since then, we shouldn't have the goodies, that people
    want to join
    ... on giving webizens power to review, participate
    ... AC wasn't crazy about that
    ... some felt Webizens needed more power
    ... so question for us for this new task force
    ... what should fee be? $100 right? variable? min/max, $0?

    <LJWatson> Think the fee will depend on the member benefits.

    jeff: what benefits should there be?

    <MarkCrawford> At one time OASIS charged $100 individual
    membership. Do we have any insight into how many individual
    members they were able to garner?

    <bkardell_> Correct me: invited experts have no ac
    representation, right?

    <Zakim> cgueret, you wanted to speak about goals for people
    that will become webizens

    <jeff> brian, Correct.

    Christophe: maybe we could have goals on why someone would want
    to join as Webizen

    <Julian-Nominet> +1 to CV

    <cgueret> example:
    [9]https://www.aaai.org/Membership/membership.php

       [9] https://www.aaai.org/Membership/membership.php

    <bkardell_> So, again, I think this is the primary goal of a
    Webizen program.

    Christophe: maybe to get entry line on CV
    ... maybe get discount to conf

    <bkardell_> A way to collectively create "unions" with ac reps

    Christophe: mostly gain benefits from activity

    <MarkCrawford> I would suggest that we consider the benefit to
    be participation in the webizen ecosystem, TPAC attendance
    privilege with a discount to offset their membership fee, and
    recognition on a special W3C web page.

    jeff: rather than decide as TF; create market survey and ask
    people why combination of this would encourage you to join
    program

    julian: Christophe, where I was going, I think Christophe has
    picked on 'why would I want to join?"
    ... maybe someone who had useful input, they could be
    recognized for their contribution; could recognize on their CV

    <bkardell_> Responsibilities is a funny word.. What
    responsibilities do any members have in prestige

    <bkardell_> Practice

    jeff: answering kimberly's question
    ... what must you? no formal responsibility other than pay the
    fee
    ... as julian pointed out, once you have an organization and
    there's activity
    ... you volunteer, that's how it grows
    ... may be consistent with Brian's comments

    leonie: question then becomes how does webizen participate
    ... agree line on CV is key
    ... but what capacity does webizen have to participate

    <bkardell_> Fwiw, I am launching efforts on participation soon

    jeff: general public has broad possibility to participate

    <bkardell_> I think we can achieve that without Webizen

    jeff: any other comments on design on program?

    jeff summarizes

    Jeff: in terms of goal, we had good discussion

    <bkardell_> But participation stops at feedback to a WG without
    some legit way to participate in w3c including vote

    Jeff: sweet spot centered on C of Raman's list
    ... I will take action to summarize input from this call
    ... julian pointed out we need a Mission
    ... maybe on next call we'll discuss more
    ... 3 success criteria
    ... Marketing study; generic approach approved
    ... hopeful Julian's friend and colleague will have an add'l
    option
    ... so for next meeting we need to spend more time on Mission
    Statement
    ... I will also outline more on Marketing Study for TF to
    review
    ... next call not yet defined
    ... maybe week of Aug 18 for next call

    <cgueret> +1 for a doodle

    Jeff: we'll do another Doodle poll

    <scribe> ... done with agenda for today

    <MarkCrawford> thanks Jeff

    <Kimberly> Thank you!

    jeff: Thanks everyone for participating today.

    <Georg> Thanks! Bye!

    <cgueret> thx, bye bye everyone! :)

    Bye!

    jeff: can you open link for minutes? I don't have access
    privileges

    <michiell> Hi, trying to dial in but need password

    sorry michiell, the call has ended already

    <michiell> veronica: sorry to hear that, I thought 8 AM ES =
    now.

    thanks koalie for cleaning up my minutes!! I missed u on the
    call!

    <koalie> yeah, sorry I missed it :(

    <koalie> and thanks for scribing, veronica!

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: Julian will determine whether colleagues from
    market research firms could help with the market research
    study. [recorded in
    [10]http://www.w3.org/2014/08/01-webizen-minutes.html#action01]

    [End of minutes]
      __________________________________________________________


     Minutes formatted by David Booth's [11]scribe.perl version
     1.138 ([12]CVS log)
     $Date: 2014-08-01 14:49:33 $

      [11] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
      [12] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/



-- 
  Coralie Mercier  -  W3C Communications Team  -  http://www.w3.org
mailto:coralie@w3.org +336 4322 0001 http://www.w3.org/People/CMercier/

Received on Tuesday, 5 August 2014 12:22:00 UTC