[Minutes] GGIE (Glass-to-glass internet ecosystem) Task Force meeting, 22nd April 2015

Hello all,

Here are the minutes for today's GGIE Task Force conference call:

and pasted in full below.
Thanks to Bill Rose for scribing again.

Also, please note that the next call will be on Wednesday 20th May (NOT
6th May due to the W3C AC meeting).

With regards,
Daniel Davis


                Web and TV Interest Group Teleconference

22 Apr 2015

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-webtv-irc


          glennd, Bill_Rose, paul_higgs, azamlerc, ldaigle,
          digitaldale, NiloMitra, MarkVickers, ddavis





     * [3]Topics
     * [4]Summary of Action Items

   <ddavis> trackbot, start meeting

   <glennd> thank you

   <trackbot> Date: 22 April 2015

   <ddavis> Grrrr

   Glenn called the meeting to order at 11:04

   Glenn did a role call.

   <azamlerc> Hi everyone! Andrew Zamler-Carhart at Cisco.

   Bill Rose taking notes

   <ldaigle> maybe did not leave last time?

   <glennd> [5]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/08-webtv-minutes.html

      [5] http://www.w3.org/2015/04/08-webtv-minutes.html

   <ddavis> scribenick: Bill_Rose

   Glenn posted link to the notes. Minutes were approved without

   <glennd> Use Review:


   Glenn led a discussion on Content Capture Use Cases (see link)

   Question: Discussing professional, non-prof or both?

   Glenn: Lines are blurred. There are still differences but hard
   to draw a line between.

   Dale: IDs are generated for downstream consumption and there
   are differences in consumption between pro and amature.

   Glenn: Looking at YouTube there is no hard line in consumption
   and workflows to post and consume.

   Dale: The identifiers are produced for a usage. The association
   of that data may be heavier in pro compared to consumer.

   Glenn: Proposed approach - lump together until/unless a
   difference is identified.

   Dale: Good approach.

   Glenn: Review Content Capture UCs
   ... UC-1 Basic Video Asset Capture

   Assumes fixed bit-rate and resolution; stored on device; single
   file or container with both audio and video with metadata about
   video, camera, capture event, user, etc.

   Glen: Step 5 in description is a mistake and should not be

   Glenn: Typically ID is added (e.g. YouTube) at time of
   publication. Similar to adding SKU # by the store before
   ... Some services can capture live video, upload to service for
   posting. ID is added by service.

   Correction: Some "users" can capture live video +"e.g. on a

   Glenn: This happens in near real time.

   Dale: Can see this happening in ad insertion situation.

   Glenn: Can also happen in social environment - e.g. a sports
   event, etc., where each stream uploaded by individuals are all
   associated with the same event but get different IDs added due
   to different user captures.
   ... Capture-UC-2 Assigning a unique content identifier at asset
   ... User captures a/v scene. Device obtains a content ID from
   an issuing service.

   Dale: Might the ID add an ID (if it does not have connection to
   an issuing service) and later get a unique ID from the service?

   Glenn: A UUID could be issued to the camera by an issuing
   authority that is used by the camera to generate a unique
   content ID for each video it records.

   Dale: There could be multiple delegations - YouTube, Facebook,
   EIDR, etc. Device could be pre-registered for each service it
   posts to.
   ... Could this be extended to assemblages of content -
   associated text, etc., which becomes part of the "content".

   Glenn: That might be an extension, more sophisticated use case
   ... Think of this as a network of associated content where
   multiple streams can be assembled into a composite stream for
   final consumption

   Dale: All of the various streams are associated through the IDs
   for potential use in a composite - e.g. tributary streams that
   can be assembled into final composited stream - potentially at
   the end under direction of some actor - client, etc.

   Glenn: New actor for the extended discussion above - the
   composer, sponsor, user, etc., that does the composing function
   to collect and bundle the tributary streams for consumption.

   <scribe> ACTION: Item to Create new UC for the composite stream
   concept discussed above. Include new actor. [recorded in

   <trackbot> Error finding 'Item'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[8]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users>.

      [8] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users

   Andrew: Do we need to describe how the compositing process
   would work including the Identifiers that allow different
   composites to be uniquely identified

   Glenn: Think it is necessary to identify the composites

   Andrew: 2 ways to look at it: Things useful to editor(s) and
   those that are useful to the user.

   Glenn: gets into rights management which is out of scope.

   Bill Rose: User could subscribe to a particular social user's

   Glenn: Could be done by using a prefix associated with that
   social user.

   <scribe> ACTION: Item to Dale, Andrew, Bill - write UC to
   describe the scenarios we discussed [recorded in

   <trackbot> Error finding 'Item'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[10]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users>.

     [10] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users

   Leslie: Do we need to have a concept of an identifier of a
   user/composer versus the identifier of a composite. Seem to be
   mixing the two.

   Glenn: Can have multiple prefixes for multiple '


   <ldaigle> agree re. privacy

   Glenn: Need to look at privacy here as well. How do we describe
   this to include privacy. Instinct is there will be 2 concepts -
   globally unique prefixes (permanent) and locally unique
   prefixes that can be 'thrown away"


   Glenn: Think of it as the difference between a cell phone that
   is bound by phone # to the user and a throw away phone that is
   only loosely bound to the user not the users permanent phone #.

   Andrew - Que: How do you distinguish between several "takes" of
   the same scene versus different events on the same camera?

   Glenn: Opportunity to explore how this could be handled but it
   is out of scope for GGIE.

   <scribe> ACTION: Item to Andrew - write up the question (above)
   for posting. [recorded in

   <trackbot> Error finding 'Item'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[12]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users>.

     [12] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/users

   Glenn: Capture-UC-3 Fingerprinting and associating a content
   identifier at asset capture

   <ldaigle> @Bill — are you unmuted?

   I am muted

   <azamlerc> Folks, I need to run... I'll write up some of the
   questions that I've raised. Cheers!

   <ldaigle> who just sneezed....

   <digitaldale> I will work to document the use case

   <ldaigle> and sniffed

   Glenn: UC-3 expands on UC-2 by generating a digital fingerprint
   and registering it along with the unique content ID
   ... Content ID is obtained from the issuing authority which is
   accitated with the fingerprint. Not a simple hash.
   ... Can generate same video fingerprint even with different
   audio or video encodings
   ... Why not a watermark? For final products watermarks work
   well. But not appropriate for capture because watermarks can
   alter the original capture that could degrade the capture.
   Fingerprint does not.

   <digitaldale> watermarking may be better introduced downstream
   which is tied to a commecial registration authority such as
   EIDR or AD-ID

   Glenn: Downstream services can still add watermark for many
   reasons but for capture case a fingerprint might be more
   ... Gap identied in each UC is there is no issuing authority
   for the Content Identifier, prefixes, etc. that can be
   referenced for these purposes.

   <digitaldale> this way there would not need to be watermark
   extraction or rewatermarking if the watermark is introduced at
   the capture device and then reinserted later downstream

   Glenn: In UC-3, no standardized fingerprint algorithm for this
   purpose, and no issuing authority that can register the
   fingerprint with the content ID
   ... Any other business?

   Daniel: Want to encourage more participation in this work. If
   anyone has any ideas to improve/broaden participation let us
   know. Would like to do a monthly mailing on the activities

   Que: Can we alert User Groups (Community Groups) to this work?

   Daniel: Will look into how this can be done.

   Perhaps LinkedIn Groups?

   <ddavis> [13]https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/GGIE_TF

     [13] https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/GGIE_TF

   <ddavis> [14]https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Main_Page

     [14] https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Main_Page


     [15] https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/GGIE_TF#Participation

   Glenn: Next meeting is scheduled for May 6th which coincides
   with W3C meetings in Paris. Should we skip that meeting or
   ... Propose skip May 6th and schedule May 20th as next meeting.

   paul_higgs: If not addressing rights management, how about
   policy relating to RM?

   <ldaigle> LInked Content Coalition

   Glenn: If we describe how rich metadata could be associated
   with content, that could be used to point/link to RM services,

   Daniel: On administration, we will be shifting to WebEx
   sometime in June so the bridge will be changing around June.

   <ldaigle> thanks! bye.

   Glenn: Next meeting May 20th. Closed the meeting at 12:24 ET.

   <ddavis> Meeting: Web and TV Interest Group Teleconference:

   <ddavis> Meeting: Web and TV Interest Group Teleconference -

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Item to Andrew - write up the question (above)
   for posting. [recorded in
   [NEW] ACTION: Item to Create new UC for the composite stream
   concept discussed above. Include new actor. [recorded in
   [NEW] ACTION: Item to Dale, Andrew, Bill - write UC to describe
   the scenarios we discussed [recorded in

   [End of minutes]

Received on Wednesday, 22 April 2015 16:56:09 UTC