[HOME_NETWORK_TF] Minutes - 24 May 2011

available at:

Also as text below.

The next call will be May 31.  Regarding how to join the
call, please see also the Web&TV IG public wiki at:

BTW, some participants mentioned on the IG list [1] that
they preferred 13UTC instead as the TF call slot.  So
I'd suggest we talk about that as well if they still want
to change the slot.  As one of the Asian participants, I
also prefer 13UTC, though :)

[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2011May/thread.html#msg28




       [1] http://www.w3.org/

                                - DRAFT -

                Home Networking Task Force Teleconference

24 May 2011


       [2] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Agenda_Telco_24th_May_2011

    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2011/05/24-webtv-irc


           Kazuyuki, Mark_Vickers, Francois, JanLindquist,
           DongHyun_Kang, +, Matt_Hammond,
           Tatsuya_Igarashi, Giuseppe, Aizu, MattH, Clarke, Russel,
           David_Corvoysier, Panu_Markkanen





      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]requirements document
          2. [6]definition section
          3. [7]open actions
      * [8]Summary of Action Items

    <giuseppep> francois are you online?

    <giuseppep> actions?

    <giuseppep> issues?

    <francois> Hi giuseppe, playing with RRSAgent? ;)

    <trackbot> Date: 24 May 2011

    <scribe> scribe: Kaz

    <scribe> scribenick: kaz


       [9] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Agenda_Telco_24th_May_2011

requirements document

    giuseppep: how to structure?
    ... one proposal is from Jan
    ... Jean-Claude provided high-level ones
    ... while Russel gave rather specific ones

    igarashi: agree with Jan
    ... details and high-level topics should be discussed separately

    giugeppep: tx

    Matt: use cases I proposed is application level

    <giuseppep> ack

    fd: adding actual scenario would be useful

    <rberkoff> cant dial-in???

    giuseppep: would be useful to better understanding

    <rberkoff> no conf code was posted?

    giuseppep: let's continue

    giuseppe: (to Russel)
    ... we'll separate the use case document into two parts, generic
    part and specific part

definition section

    giuseppep: people have different image for some terms
    ... is our description generic enough?
    ... opinion?

    Clarke: application is a good term
    ... another for home network would be service

    giuseppep: HTML5 type of definition of "document" might be confusing
    ... we could use "web application" as a term
    ... we need to clarify what "application" means

    clarke: can try

    fd: we prefer to use "application"
    ... rather than "document"
    ... I personally prefer "web application"
    ... if we use the same definition (as HTML5), it would be easy to
    map our use cases to HTML5

    giuseppep: would suggest your definition to the ML and share your
    ideas with everybody

    [ +1 w/ giuseppep ]

open actions

    <giuseppep> [10]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/2

      [10] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/2


      [11] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Discussions/ServiceMigration

    <giuseppep> issue-7?

    <trackbot> ISSUE-7 -- Use case: Service Migration -- open

    <trackbot> [12]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/7

      [12] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/7

    giuseppep: Jean-Claude's use case
    ... "document" could describe "application"

    <inserted> giuseppep: this originally included two pieces, and
    another part is issue-15


      [13] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Discussions/DocumentMigration


    <trackbot> ISSUE-15 -- Document Migration -- raised

    <trackbot> [14]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/15

      [14] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/15

    kaz: regarding issue-7, the description is confusing
    ... "music" is rather capability/feature
    ... "device" should be Audio, TV, music player, computer, etc.

    giuseppep: agree the description is confusing

    jan: two questions
    ... 1 is example implementations
    ... 2 is that this is similar to multi-screen use case

    giuseppep: that's something "document migration" use case would

    russell: same concern as Kaz
    ... device capability like camera, etc. is captured by this "service
    ... how is application captured?

    giuseppep: "how" is not yet discussed

    russell: services use documents

    giuseppep: if your application use audio on some device which
    doesn't have audio capability, it doesn't work
    ... I proposed to JCD to rephrase the description

    MattH: concrete scenario would be useful to me

    <dcorvoysier> The way it is described, the web page itself seems to
    be transferred from one device to the other ...

    [ yeah... ]

    giuseppep: talking with radio could be one use case scenario

    <francois> [ The definition of "application state" looks very
    application specific and difficult to generalize. ]

    igarashi: relationship between 7 and 15
    ... now got it
    ... second question is that this is not migration, but just using
    multiple devices

    giuseppep: "widget running on some device and an application on
    another device" might be what JCD is thinking

    <inserted> ... how do you move state from device to device?

    <Clarke> Migration seems to be service delivery with "multiple
    devices" with state

    <Clarke> With a video, for example, you could retain the playback

    <giuseppep> ISSUE-16?

    <trackbot> ISSUE-16 -- Web and Device Interworking -- raised

    <trackbot> [15]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/16

      [15] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/16

    jan: (explains the use case)


    A personal device list available in the home is invoked on any web
    page and devices in the list can be used for consuming the contents
    on a web page, e.g. video clip on a page can be redirected to a TV
    or recorded on a network attached storage.


    <Zakim> kaz, you wanted to suggest "state transition from one device
    to another"

    jan: you can see some example JavaScript scripts
    ... comments welcome

    giuseppep: any comments?

    50.html Jan's message

      [16] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2011May/0050.html

    giuseppep: people need some more time
    ... my comment is that more examples are needed

    jan: ok

    fd: difference between device and service?

    giuseppep: some use case differentiate device and service

    jan: different devices have different capability

    fd: do you need list of devices?
    ... maybe we can say "this service and that service work on a

    <mav_> that was clarke

    clarke: don't think PCs care about "what capability is working on
    which device" but devices themselves do care
    ... "service" is more appropriate to "devices"

    <francois> [yes, we could use both "device" and "service" in the use

    clarke: not sure we have to have one specific word
    ... a "device" contains something

    <igarashi> +q

    giuseppep: UPnP like definition?
    ... use cases from user perspective

    MattH: user centric view vs. device centric view

    jan: how can we use the terms with technical consistency

    giuseppep: I can provide some initial idea, and you can provide

    igarashi: using "device" might be good
    ... but how to handle "service" on the Internet?

    giuseppep: it's important to have terms list to share people's views
    ... we'll use same terminology once we've got consensus

    <inserted> UPnP Home Network UA

    <giuseppep> ISSUE-17?

    <trackbot> ISSUE-17 -- Use Case: DLNA/UPnP Home Network Enabled
    User-Agent (Browser) -- raised

    <trackbot> [17]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/17

      [17] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/17

    giuseppep: more generic use case description would be better

    russell: reference to specific technology?
    ... can remove DLNA/UPnP

    giuseppep: this will go back to the previous discussion
    ... you need some generic framework to let devices interact with
    each other

    russell: ok. will restructure the description

    <igarashi> +q

    giuseppep: we've decided we'll split the use case documents into
    generic part and specific part, so you can say "we'd support this
    specific service"

    jan: several possible scenarios

    giuseppep: we could include both (1) list of generic use cases and
    (2) list of specific use cases

    <giuseppep> ?

    <inserted> ... you can generate another use case if you need

    jan: will restructure my use case

    igarashi: use cases should be use specific
    ... detailed procedure on each use case would be helpful for people
    to understand

    +q to suggest we have optional "concrete scenario" which includes
    detailed procedure on each use case description

    jan: if we adapt a specific use case, which includes user process
    steps, it would be fine

    <giuseppep> [18]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF

      [18] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF

    jan: btw, could you please send the conf code publicly?

    giuseppep: it's available on the Wiki page

    <giuseppep> [19]http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Telco

      [19] http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Telco

    jan: need info on IRC channel etc. as well

    giuseppep: also available on the Wiki page

    [ adjourned ]

Summary of Action Items

    [End of minutes]

Received on Tuesday, 24 May 2011 18:32:47 UTC