Re: webtv-ISSUE-24 (igarashi): Local Link of web applications [HOME_NETWORK_TF]

On Tue, 21 Jun 2011 12:40:45 +0200, Mark Watson <watsonm@netflix.com>  
wrote:

> This is an interesting issue, but I would say that it is essential to  
> distinguish connectivity from application protocols.
>
> Establishing connectivity between applications is one thing. There are  
> problems here of application discovery over the local network, security  
> and connection establishment that will need to be addressed.
>
> The actual protocol which is then used over this connection is a totally  
> orthogonal concept. It's application-specific and those application  
> protocols may be used in other contexts as well (for example, the smart  
> phone quiz app might use the same quiz protocol to interact with the  
> quiz app on the TV as it would use to interact with the broadcaster's  
> servers, in the case that the TV does not support that quiz app).
>
> I'm not saying that the group should not work on both - though I'd be  
> skeptical about standardizing a universal quiz protocol - but they  
> should certainly be handled separately.
>
Agree and in fact I don't think the use cases is suggesting this (but Matt  
can confirm).
In general we seems to have 2 general use cases:

- communicate with services using existing and established protocols  
(UPnP, Bonjour, etc)
- enable communication between 2 applications with a "proprietary" protocol

Both are of interest, The challenge here is we can identify a common  
architecture to cover both.

On top of this some specific services/usecases may suggest the creation of  
a more specific API/protocol well integrated in the web platform while  
some other (like the quiz example) nwill probably never require an ad hoc  
solution.

My proposed way forward is to start the first part (general framework)  
leaving the discussion on add hoc protocols/APIs for specific services as  
a second stage discussion.

/g


> ...Mark
>
> On Jun 21, 2011, at 10:11 AM, Matt Hammond wrote:
>
>> Hi, I have attempted to reformulate the 'quiz' use case as you  
>> suggested:
>>
>> """
>> User Scenario: Interactive quiz
>>
>> Alice and Bob operates the TV device to watch a quiz programme, from  
>> live
>> broadcast.
>>
>> Alice and Bob also operate their smart phones to access a quiz  
>> application.
>>
>> The smart phone quiz application knows that the quiz programme is being
>> watched on the TV and establishes communication with an interactive
>> application on the TV that is active during the quiz programme.
>>
>> The TV application overlays on-screen information informing Alice and  
>> Bob
>> that they are now taking part in the quiz.
>>
>> As a question is asked in the quiz programme, the interactive TV
>> application instructs  Alice and Bob's smart phone quiz applications to
>> ask Alice and Bob the same questions. Alice and Bob enter answers to the
>> questions using their smart phones, which are relayed back to the
>> interactive TV application.
>>
>> Between quiz rounds, Alice and Bob's scores are displayed on their smart
>> phones and overlayed on screen by the TV interactive application. Scores
>> are compared to those of the contestants featuring in the programme.
>> """
>>
>> Regarding need/justification: Using local-link communication to an
>> interactive application provided as part of a broadcast stream provides  
>> a
>> way around scalability concerns if participation is substantial for a
>> particularly popular programme.
>>
>>
>> regards
>>
>>
>> Matt
>>
>>
>> On Wed, 08 Jun 2011 06:12:35 +0100, Igarashi, Tatsuya
>> <Tatsuya.Igarashi@jp.sony.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Matt and Scott,
>>>
>>> I am happy to include more user scenarios in the use case description.
>>> (I meant "use case" as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_case )
>>>
>>> Would you re-write it as a scenario from user perspective? This makes  
>>> us
>>> easy to understand.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>> -***---***---***---***---***---***---***---***---***--***---***---***-
>>> Tatsuya Igarashi (Tatsuya.Igarashi@jp.sony.com)
>>> NS Development Dept. Technology Development Group
>>> Sony Corporation
>>> (Voice) +81-3-5435-3252 (Fax) +81-3-5435-3274
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Scott Wilson [mailto:scott.bradley.wilson@gmail.com]
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2011 11:06 PM
>>>> To: Matt Hammond
>>>> Cc: Web and TV Interest Group WG; Igarashi, Tatsuya
>>>> Subject: Re: webtv-ISSUE-24 (igarashi): Local Link of web applications
>>>> [HOME_NETWORK_TF]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2011, at 14:29, Matt Hammond wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> This is an interesting use case and set of scenarios. I believe it
>>>> will
>>>> be important to enable communications between interactive
>>>> services/applcations on a TV and other devices in a manner perhaps  
>>>> along
>>>> the lines you suggest.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have an old-style use case that perhaps could be incorporated into
>>>> your
>>>> list of scenarios (with a little rewriting):
>>>>
>>>> I quite like these old-style use-cases as they make a lot more sense
>>>> when
>>>> explaining what we are trying to achieve.
>>>>
>>>> Quiz programmes are one example, as are competition shows of the  
>>>> "-idol"
>>>> variety - though today many of these make use of text
>>>> messaging/telephony
>>>> charges for their business model, and so to replace this functionality
>>>> with
>>>> web APIs would also require either access to micropayment  
>>>> functionality,
>>>> or a bridge from TV to telco services.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> """
>>>>> Scenario: enabling interaction between companion content and
>>>> television
>>>> interactive services
>>>>>
>>>>> One or more companion devices can communicate with an interactive
>>>> widget,
>>>> application or service on the television. For example: a quiz  
>>>> programme
>>>> may feature an interactive service to allow users to play along. Users
>>>> each
>>>> use their own individual companion device to participate in the quiz,  
>>>> in
>>>> time with the programme as broadcast. As the programme progresses,
>>>> questions
>>>> are presented to the users on their companion device at the same time  
>>>> as
>>>> the contestant in the programme has to answer them. Scores are  
>>>> compared
>>>> and collated on the television screen at points throughout the quiz.
>>>>> """
>>>>>
>>>>> There may be some overlap between this and issue-4 or issue-12;
>>>> however
>>>> I believe there is probably a difference, since the scenarios focus on
>>>> applications spread across several devices working together, rather  
>>>> than
>>>> migration, or the wholesale remoting of a UI.
>>>>>
>>>>> From our perspective at the BBC, it would be great if the scope is
>>>> widened
>>>> such that one of the applications may not necessarily be a web
>>>> application
>>>> but which still, in some way, exposes a service with which web
>>>> applications
>>>> could communicate. In the UK for example, interactive applications
>>>> delivered as part of the TV broadcast on many of the platforms these
>>>> will
>>>> not be web based for the forseable future.
>>>>
>>>> I think being able to support the migration of current "red button"
>>>> interactive content to the open web and web applications/widgets is an
>>>> excellent objective to work towards.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> regards
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Matt
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 07 Jun 2011 11:11:28 +0100, Igarashi, Tatsuya
>>>> <Tatsuya.Igarashi@jp.sony.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry for the bad link.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here is the correct link to the use case description.
>>>>>>
>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Discussions/Loc
>>>> alLink#Use_Case:_Local_Link_of_Web_Applications
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> -***---***---***---***---***---***---***---***---***--***---***---***-
>>>>>> Tatsuya Igarashi (Tatsuya.Igarashi@jp.sony.com)
>>>>>> NS Development Dept. Technology Development Group
>>>>>> Sony Corporation
>>>>>> (Voice) +81-3-5435-3252 (Fax) +81-3-5435-3274
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: public-web-and-tv-request@w3.org
>>>>>>> [mailto:public-web-and-tv-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Web and TV
>>>> Interest
>>>>>>> Group Issue Tracker
>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2011 7:05 PM
>>>>>>> To: public-web-and-tv@w3.org
>>>>>>> Subject: webtv-ISSUE-24 (igarashi): Local Link of web applications
>>>>>>> [HOME_NETWORK_TF]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> webtv-ISSUE-24 (igarashi): Local Link of web applications
>>>>>>> [HOME_NETWORK_TF]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/24
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Raised by: Tatsuya Igarashi
>>>>>>> On product: HOME_NETWORK_TF
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is a proposal about the use case "Local Link of web
>>>> applications".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> See: http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/24
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> | Matt Hammond
>>>>> | Research Engineer, BBC R&D, Centre House, London
>>>>> | http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> | Matt Hammond
>> | Research Engineer, BBC R&D, Centre House, London
>> | http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/
>>
>>
>


-- 
Giuseppe Pascale
TV & Connected Devices
Opera Software - Sweden

Received on Tuesday, 21 June 2011 13:22:47 UTC