W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-web-and-tv@w3.org > August 2011

Re: [HOME_NETWORK_TF] Comments on "Application Communication" requirement

From: Giuseppe Pascale <giuseppep@opera.com>
Date: Mon, 29 Aug 2011 15:30:13 +0200
To: "public-web-and-tv@w3.org" <public-web-and-tv@w3.org>, "Bob Lund" <B.Lund@cablelabs.com>, "Matt Hammond" <matt.hammond@rd.bbc.co.uk>
Message-ID: <op.v0y84nu86ugkrk@laptop>
I merged the new requirement
http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Requirements#Application_communication

/g

On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 12:58:47 +0200, Matt Hammond <matt.hammond@rd.bbc.co.uk> wrote:

> Ah, I see - yes discovery is probably already covered. I'm happy with what
> you propose.
>
> many thanks
>
>
> Matt
>
> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 11:15:02 +0100, Giuseppe Pascale <giuseppep@opera.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 11:59:30 +0200, Matt Hammond
>> <matt.hammond@rd.bbc.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> I think you are right - this needs separating into two requirements.
>>>
>>> I believe that what Bob originally suggested regarding "discovery" might
>>> apply "application communication" too.  For example:
>>>
>>> "Application communication: Conforming specifications should provide a
>>> means for applications running in different user-agents to discover each
>>> other and exchange messages directly via the home network."
>>>
>>>
>> There is a separate section/requirement for discovery.
>> As is phrased now the requirement about discovery mention both services
>> and "application exposing services":
>>
>> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Requirements#Service_Discovery
>>
>> ***
>> Service Discovery:
>> Conforming specifications should provide a means for applications to
>> discover devices and applications in the home network which advertise
>> services. Details of the advertising protocol are out of scope for this
>> document and the type and number of supported discovery protocols are
>> user agent dependent. Nevertheless conforming specifications should
>> provide a means for application to identify the type of discovered
>> services that are available and to search for services of a specific
>> type.
>> ***
>>
>> I think is just a matter of semantics here: is an application that is
>> discoverable implicitly "exposing a service"? If so, then we may not
>> need a new requirement; if not, we may want to separate
>> discovery/communication of applications from discovery/communication of
>> services.
>>
>> Honestly I don't have a strong opinion.  One reason why we may want to
>> split this in 2 requirements could be that app-2-app discovery and
>> communication could probably generate slightly different requirements if
>> compared to app-2-service discovery & communication when going into the
>> actual specification work.
>>
>> In short I see 2 options:
>> #1 we keep the requirement as quote above
>> #2 we add to the requirement above another one that could look like this:
>>
>> ***
>> Application Discovery:
>> Conforming specifications should provide a means for applications
>> running in different user-agents to discover each other directly via the
>> home network. Details of the advertising protocol are out of scope for
>> this document.
>> ***
>>
>> I would propose to go for option #2.
>>
>> /g
>>
>>>
>>> many thanks
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Matt
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 23:31:05 +0100, Giuseppe Pascale
>>> <giuseppep@opera.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 28 Aug 2011 21:49:33 +0200, Matt Hammond
>>>> <matt.hammond@rd.bbc.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Definitely agree with Bob that this requirement should be expressed in
>>>>> terms of how there needs to be discovery in order to initiate
>>>>> communication.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thinking about the use of the term 'services': should this be phrased
>>>>> in terms of 'applications' throughout, rather than 'services'?
>>>>> Communication with services is already covered by other requirements.
>>>>> This particular requirement originated from the "Local Link for Web
>>>>> Applications" use case[1]:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Requirements#U14:_Local_Link_of_Web_Applications
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Agree. It seems to me we need 2 requirements. We can leave the one
>>>> about
>>>> "service communication" as phrased below, plus I would add the
>>>> following:
>>>>
>>>> "Application communication: Conforming specifications should provide a
>>>> means for applications running in different user-agents to exchange
>>>> messages directly via the home network."
>>>>
>>>> Bob, Matt, what do you think?
>>>>
>>>> /g
>>>>
>>>>> regards
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Matt
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 23 Aug 2011 16:08:04 +0100, Giuseppe Pascale
>>>>> <giuseppep@opera.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 22 Aug 2011 18:13:38 +0200, Bob Lund <B.Lund@cablelabs.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree but I think it should be stated in terms of access to
>>>>>>> services discovered on the home network:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Service communication: Conforming specifications should provide a
>>>>>>> means for a client to exchange messages directly via the home
>>>>>>> network
>>>>>>> with services discovered in the home network."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> As discussed I changed this into
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Service communication: Conforming specifications should provide a
>>>>>> means for an application to exchange messages directly via the home
>>>>>> network with services discovered in the home network."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Requirements#Service_communication
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /g
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: public-web-and-tv-request@w3.org [mailto:public-web-and-tv-
>>>>>>>> request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Jean-Claude Dufourd
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, August 22, 2011 9:05 AM
>>>>>>>> To: public-web-and-tv@w3.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [HOME_NETWORK_TF] Comments on "Application
>>>>>>>> Communication"
>>>>>>>> requirement
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I strongly support this clarification about direct communication.
>>>>>>>> Best regards
>>>>>>>> JC
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 22/8/11 16:44 , Giuseppe Pascale wrote:
>>>>>>>> > On Sun, 21 Aug 2011 20:20:43 +0200, Matt Hammond
>>>>>>>> > <matt.hammond@rd.bbc.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >> Hi all,
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Apologies for this being a little later than I originally
>>>>>>>> intended:
>>>>>>>> >> as I mentioned in last week's conf call, I have a comment
>>>>>>>> regarding
>>>>>>>> >> the "Application Communication" requirement.
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Would it be helpful to clarify that this requirement is
>>>>>>>> specifically
>>>>>>>> >> intended to enable direct communication between applications?
>>>>>>>> This
>>>>>>>> >> would be to distinguish it from an implementation that (for
>>>>>>>> example)
>>>>>>>> >> sent all communications through a cloud based relay or proxying
>>>>>>>> service?
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> For example: "Conforming specifications should provide a means
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> >> applications to exchange messages directly via the home network
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>> >> other applications running on a different user agent in the home
>>>>>>>> >> network."
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Hi Matt,
>>>>>>>> > thanks for raising this in writing.
>>>>>>>> > I agree that several (all?) of the use cases we have discussed
>>>>>>>> require
>>>>>>>> > (preferably) a direct communication. I think this is pretty
>>>>>>>> > uncontroversial and could add it right away to the requirement
>>>>>>>> document.
>>>>>>>> > Some of the use cases could actually be covered by an indirect
>>>>>>>> > communication mechanism as well, so probably also that would be
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> > scope. On other end such a mechanism may either not need
>>>>>>>> (additional)
>>>>>>>> > standardization or fall back to the a different discussion about
>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>> > services could be standardized.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > So in short I'm fine to re-word the requirement as you suggested
>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>> > nobody objects.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > /g
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >> regards
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>> >> Matt
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> JC Dufourd
>>>>>>>> Directeur d'Etudes/Professor
>>>>>>>> Groupe Multimedia/Multimedia Group
>>>>>>>> Traitement du Signal et Images/Signal and Image Processing Telecom
>>>>>>>> ParisTech, 37-39 rue Dareau, 75014 Paris, France
>>>>>>>> Tel: +33145817733 - Mob: +33677843843 - Fax: +33145817144
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


-- 
Giuseppe Pascale
TV & Connected Devices
Opera Software - Sweden
Received on Monday, 29 August 2011 13:30:52 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.4.0 : Friday, 17 January 2020 17:57:07 UTC