- From: Li, Alex <alex.li@sap.com>
- Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 11:31:34 -0700
- To: "David MacDonald" <befree@magma.ca>, "Gregg Vanderheiden" <gv@trace.wisc.edu>, "Ben Caldwell" <caldwell@trace.wisc.edu>
- Cc: <public-wcag-teama@w3.org>
The term "component" is used all over 3.2 sc. I can't see how graphical
components, such as gif, could be excluded from L2 SC3. But we have no
definition of component. I suppose if it can receive focus, it should be
a component.
-----Original Message-----
From: David MacDonald [mailto:befree@magma.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 10:20 AM
To: 'Gregg Vanderheiden'; 'Ben Caldwell'; Li, Alex
Cc: public-wcag-teama@w3.org
Subject: RE: FW: combining 3.2 L3 SC1 and L2 SC3
Hi Team
I agree that we combine 3.2 L2 SC3 and L3 SC1. The implication is that
the
requirement of text alternatives being consistent moves from level 3 to
level 2. But that does not bother me. I think a component is a catch
word
for anything that the user focuses on.
Cheers
David MacDonald
.Access empowers people
.barriers disable them.
www.eramp.com
-----Original Message-----
From: public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org
[mailto:public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Gregg
Vanderheiden
Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 1:16 AM
To: 'Ben Caldwell'; 'Li, Alex'
Cc: public-wcag-teama@w3.org
Subject: RE: FW: combining 3.2 L3 SC1 and L2 SC3
Here are the two in question
3.2 L2 SC3. Components that have the same functionality in multiple
delivery units within a set of delivery units are labeled consistently.
(Guide to 3.2 L2 SC3)
3.2 L3 SC1. Non-text content that appears on multiple delivery units and
has
the same function has consistent text alternatives. (Guide to 3.2 L3
SC1)
I think the question is "what are components?"
If they are only 'active' things then the two are different. If any
gif or
jpg is a component and all non-text content is considered a component
then
L2SC3 covers L3SC1. But if a gif or movie is NOT a component - then we
need both. I think we could define component and delete L3SC1.
What do others think? What is included in component? What would the
definition be? (where else do we use component?)
Gregg
-- ------------------------------
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
Professor - Ind. Engr. & BioMed Engr.
Director - Trace R & D Center
University of Wisconsin-Madison
-----Original Message-----
From: public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org
[mailto:public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Ben Caldwell
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 3:40 PM
To: Li, Alex
Cc: public-wcag-teama@w3.org
Subject: Re: FW: combining 3.2 L3 SC1 and L2 SC3
I think option A is the way to go. Can't see a reason to require that
non-text always have the same text alternative.
Alex's traffic light example is a good one and so is the one about
previous/next icons. To me, as long as the function is conveyed in the
alternative, there's nothing wrong with providing additional details.
(ex. a next page icon appears on multiple pages within a collection and
includes alt="Next - page 2" alt="Next - page 3" etc.)
This isn't something I think we should be prohibiting at level 3, so I
would suggest combining whatever relevant portions of the L3 SC1 guide
doc with what we've got for L2 SC3.
-Ben
Li, Alex wrote:
> Forgot to send to all.
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Li, Alex
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 25, 2005 11:46 AM
> *To:* 'Gregg Vanderheiden'
> *Subject:* RE: combining 3.2 L3 SC1 and L2 SC3
>
> Hi all,
>
> I went back to the original text of the SC to examine the difference.
> According to the June 30th draft, L3 SC1 says "Graphical components
that
> appear on multiple pages, including graphical links
> <http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-WCAG20-20050630/#linkdef>, are
associated
> with the same text equivalents wherever they appear.". The biggest
> difference between the proposed SC and the June SC is that we changed
> from "same" to "consistent".
>
> That leaves us with two options:
>
> Option A-varify that there is no way to fail L3 SC1 if L2 SC3 is
> fulfilled and delete L3 SC1. I don't think it is possible to fail L3
> SC1 if L2 SC3 is met, given that the SC are written in its current
forms.
>
> Option B-change L3 SC1 to "Non-text content that appears on multiple
> delivery units and has the same function
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#samefunct
iond
ef>
> has the same text alternatives." This option implies that we demand
the
> "same" text alternative or equivalent in level 3, given that we know
> that the sc won't be applicable in some fairly common situations where
> icons are used.
>
> I don't see any appropriate technique to help web designers meet the
L3
> sc1 in option B in those situations where icons are used for multiple
> purposes for good reasons (traffic lights and document download
icons).
> Assuming no technique is found, then we are still back to where we
> were--no real difference between the two SC. I would argue that there
> is no reason to selection option B because L2 SC3 guide doc contains a
> common failure that says labelling "search" and "find" for the same
> function and icon would fail L2 SC3. Assuming that we keep the common
> failure in place, I think the only logical decision is to remove L3
SC1.
>
> All best,
> Alex
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org
> [mailto:public-wcag-teama-request@w3.org]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 25, 2005 7:51 AM
> *To:* public-wcag-teama@w3.org
> *Subject:* combining 3.2 L3 SC1 and L2 SC3
>
> 1.) David, Alex, and I have an action item to look a SC1 with 3.2
> L2 SC3. (Last week, we couldn't come up with any techniques for
> the L3 item that wouldn't already be covered by the L2 SC.)
>
>
>
> Everyone - can you think of anything that would be covered by L3
> SC1 that isn't covered by L2 SC3 (that isn't made up or
trivial)??
>
> I'll post a separate email that you can respond to on this. Then
> Alex, David and I will finish this up.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> For your info - here is Level 2 and Level 3 of 3.2
>
>
>
> Please send your thoughts
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *Level 2 Success Criteria for Guideline 3.2 *
>
> 1. Changing the setting of any input field does not
automatically
> cause a change of context
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#context-c
hang
edef>.
> (Guide to 3.2 L2 SC1
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guide_to_3.2_L2_SC1>)
>
> 2. Components that are repeated on multiple delivery units
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#deliveryu
nitd
ef>
> within a set of delivery units occur in the same relative
> order
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#relorderd
ef>
> each time they are repeated. (Guide to 3.2 L2 SC2
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guide_to_3.2_L2_SC2>)
>
> 3. Components that have the same functionality
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#samefunct
iona
litydef>
> in multiple delivery units
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#deliveryu
nitd
ef>
> within a set of delivery units are labeled consistently.
> (Guide to 3.2 L2 SC3
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guide_to_3.2_L2_SC3>)
>
>
> [edit
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2&action=ed
it&s
ection=4>]
>
>
> *Level 3 Success Criteria for Guideline 3.2 *
>
> 1. Non-text content that appears on multiple delivery units and
> has the same function
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guideline_3.2#samefunct
iond
ef>
> has consistent text alternatives. (Guide to 3.2 L3 SC1
>
<http://trace.wisc.edu/wcag_wiki/index.php?title=Guide_to_3.2_L3_SC1>)
>
>
>
>
>
> Gregg
>
> ------------------------
>
> Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D.
> Professor - Depts of Ind. Engr. & BioMed Engr.
> Director - Trace R & D Center
> University of Wisconsin-Madison
> _<http://trace.wisc.edu/>_ FAX 608/262-8848
> For a list of our list discussions http://trace.wisc.edu/lists/
>
> <http://trace.wisc.edu:8080/mailman/listinfo/>
>
>
>
>
>
Received on Wednesday, 26 October 2005 18:35:33 UTC