Minutes auto-wcag meeting

[16:01] <cpandhi> looking for webex password
[16:02] <agarrison> Is the telecon bridge not open yet?
[16:02] <shadi> sorry, just getting setup from the airport
[16:03] <@Wilco> charu, you joining us?
[16:04] <agarrison> Could be this one -
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/about/conferencing-global-access-numbers.html
[16:05] <agarrison> Whats the password
[16:05] <agarrison> for webex
[16:06] <shadi> auto-wcag
[16:06] <MoeKraft> What's the WebEx password?
[16:06] <shadi> auto-wcag
[16:07] * shadi having technical issues locally :(
[16:08] <@Wilco> shadi, can you get the bots in here?
[16:09] <shadi> yes, type: /invite zakim #auto-wcag
[16:09] <shadi> and rrsagent too
[16:10] <@Wilco> - Rule template update
https://github.com/auto-wcag/auto-wcag/pull/15
[16:10] <@Wilco> topic: template update
[16:10] <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/11/17-auto-wcag-irc
[16:11] <agarrison> Wilco - Hope you have had a chance to look at the page.
[16:11] <agarrison> Wilco - There have been several changes to the template.
[16:12] <agarrison> Wilco - investigate implementation section in template.
[16:12] <agarrison> Wilco - change log has been added.
[16:12] <agarrison> AG - Where can we see the final version of it?
[16:12] <@Wilco>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-design.md
[16:13] <@Wilco>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-template.md
[16:15] <agarrison> AG - I notice user input placed within rules.
[16:16] <emmajpr_bbc> Sorry I'm late
[16:17] <agarrison> Wilco - Some you can automatically test up to the human.
[16:18] <agarrison> AG - Some rules include / need human input.
[16:19] <agarrison> Katie - Under test subject - in yesterday's meeting we
talked about WCAG meeting.  Do we want to add the subject of packaged set
of documents.
[16:19] <agarrison> Katie - as a space-holder.
[16:20] <agarrison> Katie - we now should be addressing publications.
[16:20] <agarrison> Katie - test cases - we should add document package.
[16:20] <@Wilco>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-template.md
[16:20] <agarrison> Wilco - is that the old version.
[16:20] <agarrison> Wilco - it's under environment.
[16:21] <Ryladog>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-design.md
[16:21] <agarrison> Wilco - up to now we haven't written rules for that,
but it makes sense.
[16:21] <Ryladog>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-design.md
[16:22] <agarrison> Wilco - this isn't the one that has been updated.
[16:22] <agarrison> Wilco - we'll need to update some of the terms on this
page.
[16:22] <@Wilco>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-template.md
[16:22] <agarrison> Katie - we'll need to include a document package as an
option for testing.
[16:23] <agarrison> AG - now how broad are we looking.  It was previously
web content.
[16:23] <agarrison> Katie - It is wel content - like a Daisy book.
[16:24] <agarrison> Katie - It has a navigation system inside a book
package.
[16:26] <agarrison> Katie - it's the same rules, just has to go inside the
document package.
[16:27] <agarrison> Katie - it should just be included in rule design.
[16:27] <MoeKraft> Katie, can you repost the link? I'm not seeing it.
Thanks, Moe
[16:28] <agarrison> Emma - we would only need to state there is a package
if there is something different about the package.
[16:28] <agarrison> Emma - is there anything about a web package that would
need additional pieces of tests rules to be run.
[16:28] <agarrison> Katie - don't know.
[16:29] <agarrison> Katie - just trying to be inclusive of new part of W3C.
[16:29] <agarrison> Emma - we should keep it in mind.
[16:29] <agarrison> Wilco - agree
[16:29] <@Wilco>
https://github.com/WilcoFiers/auto-wcag/blob/b0442b231adc1f6308623ee25f924690b6d0e792/pages/rule-template.md
[16:30] <agarrison> Wilco - any further comments.
[16:31] <cpandhi> can you hear me?
[16:31] <agarrison> Emma - it's quite a different structure.
[16:32] <agarrison> Emma - step 2 would be for more manual testing.
[16:32] <agarrison> Emma - background in middle is a little odd.
[16:33] <agarrison> Wilco - the background was dropped down, as it was less
important.
[16:34] <agarrison> Charu - background and assumptions - I'm a little
confused about the two - is there overlap.
[16:34] * jemma can anyone let me know webex pw?
[16:34] <agarrison> Wilco - no.  No overlap.
[16:35] <agarrison> Charu - Limitations / false positives in assumptions.
[16:35] <agarrison> Charu - Step 1 fail / pass - do we need to do both?
[16:35] <jemma> present+ JaEunJemmaKu
[16:35] <jemma> rssagents, make minutes
[16:35] <agarrison> Wilco - there can be multiple reasons why something
passed.
[16:36] <agarrison> Wilco - to know at which point something exited the
procedure.
[16:36] * jemma webex pw please?
[16:36] <agarrison> Charu - we don't have any where that says pass.
[16:37] <agarrison> Charu - an example would be good to make it clear.
[16:37] <agarrison> Wilco - in what way?
[16:37] <agarrison> Charu - not saying we should change things.  Just
having a problem understanding it.
[16:38] <agarrison> Emma - if its passing they don't need to know much.  If
they are failing they need more information.
[16:38] <agarrison> Wilco - the default is non-applicable.
[16:38] * shadi jemma auto-wcag
[16:38] * jemma thanks ;-)
[16:38] <agarrison> Charu - won't that always be the case if they don't
fail.
[16:39] <agarrison> Wilco - you just change the interface to say you only
want to see fails.
[16:39] <shadi> q+
[16:40] <agarrison> Emma - should we not concentrate on non-applicable or
fail.
[16:40] <MoeKraft> have to drop. Good work everyone.
[16:40] <agarrison> Emma - not thinking about a rule test as a whole. Step
is only applicable to the content that is found.
[16:44] <agarrison> AG - the tests are very complicated.  That is why you
need to supply information about a pass.
[16:45] <shadi_> q- shadi
[16:46] <agarrison> Wilco - there are loads of rules with one exit point.
[16:50] <agarrison> Charu - you might want to filter out the interview
questions.
[16:53] <agarrison> Charu - we are looking at DevOPs so we need more
automation.
[16:55] <agarrison> Emma- we are looking at color contrast.  Were do we
split things.
[17:00] <agarrison> Emma - we have tests with config.
[17:01] <agarrison> Charu - could we focus on simpler tests firsts.
[17:01] <agarrison> Emma - suggestion for template.
[17:02] <agarrison> Emma - need to make it clear that step one and step two
don't need to be together.
[17:03] <agarrison>
https://www.w3.org/community/auto-wcag/wiki/SC1-1-1-text-alternative
[17:03] <agarrison> Emma - assumptions - not knowing what goes into an
assumption.
[17:03] <agarrison> Emma = we need to clarify.
[17:08] <agarrison> AG - If you look at the rule you can see they are very
complicated.
[17:10] <agarrison> Emma - could we place the existing rules into templates.
[17:10] <agarrison> AG - We should also aline test suites.
[17:11] <agarrison> Wilco - we can pool aXe test suites.
[17:11] <agarrison> Wilco - what would a template for a test suite look
like.
[17:13] <agarrison> Wilco - we need to take a step back and look at what we
are doing - there is a bunch of baggage that came with the EIII.
[17:14] <emmajpr_bbc> #notmyrule ... LOL
[17:14] <agarrison> Charu - looking at the complex rule, we would create
atomic tests instead.
[17:14] <@Wilco> https://github.com/auto-wcag/auto-wcag/tree/master/_rules
[17:14] <agarrison> Wilco - I have work to do on the template.
[17:14] <agarrison> Wilco - for you - we need to look through our existing
rules.
[17:15] <agarrison> Wilco - give us a list of changes which we could make
to these.
[17:15] <agarrison> Charu - I'll take lang rule.
[17:16] <agarrison> Wilco - issues need to be created for each action item.
[17:18] <agarrison> Charu - I'll take 1.1.2
[17:19] <agarrison> Emma - 4.1.1s - I'll take all of them apart from tag
nesting.
[17:20] <agarrison> Katie - Focus on viewport.
[17:20] <agarrison> Wilco - Takes on 1.1.1.
[17:21] <agarrison> Wilco - create an issue for the one you took on in
GitHub.
[17:21] <agarrison> Wilco - Aggregation work.
[17:23] <agarrison> AG - Approach is outlined in email sent a while ago.
[17:24] <agarrison> Wilco - Rule Aggregation on GitHub.
[17:24] <agarrison> Katie - what do I do with 1.4.7.
[17:24] <agarrison> Wilco - review it, and try and fit it into new template.
[17:25] <agarrison> Wilco - we need to reflect on the work we've done so
far.
[17:25] <agarrison> Wilco - next meeting Dec 15th 2016
[17:26] <agarrison> Wilco - Emma would you be able to send an update for
colour contrast test.
[17:26] <agarrison> Emma - Rob and I are very busy.
[17:26] <agarrison> Emma - We took a lot in from the last meeting.
[17:27] <agarrison> Emma - we'll try and do it by the preceding Tuesday.
[17:27] <agarrison> Charu - let's get the atomic rules in.
[17:27] <agarrison> Charu - I'll try to get the pull request for next
meeting.
[17:28] <agarrison> Shadi - all for atomic.

-- 
*Wilco Fiers* - Senior Accessibility Engineer