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[minutes] Timed Text call June 20, 2013

From: Philippe Le Hegaret <plh@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 10:18:29 -0400
Message-ID: <1372342709.5599.440.camel@chacal>
To: public-tt <public-tt@w3.org>
Available at
 http://www.w3.org/2013/06/20-tt-minutes.html

Text version:

   [2]Agenda

      [2]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tt/2013Jun/0110.html

   See also: [3]IRC log

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2013/06/20-tt-irc

Attendees

   Present
          Sean, Plh, mijordan, pal, mike, Andreas

   Regrets
          Glen

   Chair
          Sean

   Scribe
          plh

Contents

     * [4]Topics
         1. [5]Update from the AC
         2. [6]Modification in team contact
         3. [7]New work methods. Work Packages and transition to
            Bugzilla
         4. [8]Issue 252
         5. [9]Issue 157
         6. [10]Issue 163
         7. [11]Issue 166
         8. [12]Issue 171
         9. [13]Issue 172
        10. [14]Issue 173
        11. [15]Issue 180
        12. [16]Issue 184
        13. [17]Issue 189
        14. [18]Issue 197
        15. [19]Issue 199
        16. [20]AOB
     * [21]Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________

   [22]http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/Publications

     [22] http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/Publications

   <tmichel> Ok then it should be change on the TTWG page
   [23]https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/Group/

     [23] https://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/Group/

   <Sean> Yes, we are discussing how to update the web page

   TT/Group is deprecated

Update from the AC

   plh: we had a good discussion but it looked to me that we
   should stay on track

   pal: there was a question from timbl asking for a high level
   view of the workflow for timed text to be shown in a browser
   ... might be good for us to do as well
   ... it's on my TODO list to put something together
   ... starting in Web&TV IG

   sean: worth coordinating with the IG

   pal: will depend on the energy
   ... the web is the last link in a very long chain

   sean: would be good to get everybody position down
   ... depending where you're in the chain, the view is different

   pal: yes, the complexity of the chain is itneresting indeed

   sean: ok, we'll look for it

Modification in team contact

   Sean: welcoming Thierry back in the group

   plh: I'll stay around but Thierry will be more reliable

New work methods. Work Packages and transition to Bugzilla

   Sean: thinking to use bugzilla from now on. tracker is good a
   tracking action and issues, but not good for tracking bugs

   plh: will break your flow of communication between mailing list
   and bugzilla

   sean: work will also continue in the wiki. but don't think
   we'll have discussion in the database
   ... might become too painful
   ... so would like to keep using the mailing list for discussion
   on bugs
   ... any objection?

   [none heard]

   Resolved: the TT Group will start using bugzilla

   Sean: in the first week of July, we'll make a big push for TTML
   1.1
   ... we'll need to accelerate the activity rate

Issue 252

   issue-252?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-252 -- Prose defining mutual exclusive uses of
   <metadata> should use must keyword. -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [24]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/252

     [24] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/252

   sean: my reading was that you can use metadata on the same
   element, but Glenn read it differently

   pal: let's give more considerations in 1.1

   Resolved: issue 252 is delayed until TTML 1.1

Issue 157

   issue-157?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-157 -- transformation profile -- pending
   review

   <trackbot>
   [25]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/157

     [25] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/157

   sean: didn't make it what a transformation profile does
   ... Glenn made a clarification
   ... any objection to close this issue?

   Resolved: Issue 157 is closed

   close issue-157

   trackbot, close issue-157

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-157 transformation profile.

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-157 transformation profile.

Issue 163

   issue-163?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-163 -- Clarify use of cell units in certain
   properties -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [26]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

     [26] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

   close action-147

   <trackbot> Closed ACTION-147 Create definitions for
   presentation and transformation in Section 2.2 to handle
   Issue-157..

   Sean: again, Glenn did the edits. objection to close this
   issue?

   ?: this seems a substantive change

   Sean: the proposal is to clarify what the use of cell units

   mike: oh, thought it was different
   ... never mind

   Sean: no, we're not forbidding it

   [no objection to close issue]

   trackbot, close issue-163

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-163 Clarify use of cell units in
   certain properties.

   close action-84

   <trackbot> Closed ACTION-84 Create clarifying text for 2nd
   edition for cell units.

   issue-163?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-163 -- Clarify use of cell units in certain
   properties -- closed

   <trackbot>
   [27]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

     [27] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

   oops

   <tmichel> I must leave for about 15 minutes, and I will be
   back.

   pal: would be nice to put a link to the document

   sean: agreed
   ... we need the link from the issue and from the mercurial
   comment

Issue 166

   issue-166?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-166 -- authoritative schemaLocation for
   authoritative schemas like TTML -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [28]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/166

     [28] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/166

   Sean: again, any objection?

   mike: that's fine

   trackbot, close issue-166

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-166 authoritative schemaLocation for
   authoritative schemas like TTML.

Issue 171

   issue-171?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-171 -- need to clarify meaning of "prune" in
   9.3.2 -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [29]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/171

     [29] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/171

   close issue-171

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-171 need to clarify meaning of "prune"
   in 9.3.2.

Issue 172

   issue-172?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-172 -- REGION-OF(E) pseudo-code doesn't match
   prose -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [30]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/172

     [30] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/172

   trackbot, issue-172

   <trackbot> ISSUE-172 -- REGION-OF(E) pseudo-code doesn't match
   prose -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [31]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/172

     [31] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/172

   trackbot, close issue-172

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-172 REGION-OF(E) pseudo-code doesn't
   match prose.

Issue 173

   issue-173?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-173 -- presentation semantics of control
   characters and other unmapped characters -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [32]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/173

     [32] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/173

   Sean: it tuns out XSL-FO does tell you what to do
   ... so there is a clear mapping

   mike: doesn't seem intuitive..
   ... what's the bahvior for cariage return and line feeds in the
   content?

   sean: yes, trimming, etc is addressed

   mike: do we point to the proper section in XSL FO since it
   wasn't obvious?
   ... would help to have it in the doc

   sean: happy to leave it is open
   ... since we need a clarifying note in the doc

Issue 180

   issue-180?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-180 -- regions relative to the root container
   -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [33]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/180

     [33] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/180

   Sean: fixed by new text in 8.2.7: where, if either width or
   height is negative or zero, then extent must be considered zero
   in both inline and block progression dimensions

   issue-180:
   [34]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-
   dfxp.html#style-attribute-extent

     [34]
https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-dfxp.html#style-attribute-extent

   <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-180 regions relative to the
   root container.

   mike: what about the language quoted in the issue?
   ... it's ambiguous

   sean: I opened a different issue for that
   ... we would be changing the meaning for auto
   ... I asked Glenn to be more explicit in the mapping

   mike: the text has carfted today doesn't clarify this issue
   ... and when should we fix it?
   ... let's leave the issue for now until we clarify this

Issue 184

   issue-184?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-184 -- set animation is not taken is not
   account in the computed style set -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [35]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/184

     [35] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/184

   Sean: wasn't clear when the set animation happens
   ... fixed by new [animation styling] step 5 in 8.4.4.2
   specified style set processing

   issue-184:
   [36]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-
   dfxp.html#semantics-style-resolution-processing-sss

     [36]
https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-dfxp.html#semantics-style-resolution-processing-sss

   <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-184 set animation is not taken
   is not account in the computed style set.

   close issue-184

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-184 set animation is not taken is not
   account in the computed style set.

Issue 189

   issue-189?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-189 -- do regions scroll their flowed content?
   -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [37]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/189

     [37] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/189

   sean: removed: there is no longer an "overflow: scroll"; see
   also note at end of 9.3.2

   issue-189:
   [38]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-
   dfxp.html#semantics-region-layout-step-1

     [38]
https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-dfxp.html#semantics-region-layout-step-1

   <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-189 do regions scroll their
   flowed content?.

   [[

   Where an implementation is able to detect significant
   similarity between two adjacent synchronic Document Instances,
   DOCinterN DOCinterN−1, then it is preferred that the
   implementation make the transition between presenting the two
   instances as smooth as possible, e.g., as described by
   [CEA-608-C], § C.3.

   ]]

   plh: does it make 608 a normative ref?

   sean: nopee

   close issue-189

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-189 do regions scroll their flowed
   content?.

Issue 197

   issue-197?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-197 -- charset/encoding unconstrained --
   pending review

   <trackbot>
   [39]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/197

     [39] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/197

   issue-197:
   [40]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-
   dfxp.html#concrete-encoding

     [40]
https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-dfxp.html#concrete-encoding

   <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-197 charset/encoding
   unconstrained.

   [[

   In the absence of other requirements, it is recommended that a
   Document Instance be concretely encoded as a well-formed XML
   1.0 [XML 1.0] document using the UTF-8 character encoding.

   ]]

   sean: anything else would be a breaking change
   ... we'll come back on this in TTML 1.1

   close issue-197

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-197 charset/encoding unconstrained.

   mike: ok with a should
   ... should we leave the issue open or close for 1.1?

   <tmichel> I am back ...

   sean: rather have a new issue 1.1

   mike: ok, Id like to consider a stronger language in 1.1

   sean: sure
   ... please open a new issue for 1.1

   mike: ok

   Resolved: we need a stronger resolution in exchange formats in
   1.1

   <scribe> ACTION: Mike to open issue for 1.1 regarding encodings
   [recorded in
   [41]http://www.w3.org/2013/06/20-tt-minutes.html#action01]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-166 - Open issue for 1.1 regarding
   encodings [on Mike Dolan - due 2013-06-27].

Issue 199

   issue-199?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-199 -- timeExpression to video frame
   calculation is unclear in some cases -- pending review

   <trackbot>
   [42]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/199

     [42] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/199

   issue-199:
   [43]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-
   dfxp.html#time-expression-semantics

     [43]
https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml10/spec/ttaf1-dfxp.html#time-expression-semantics

   <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-199 timeExpression to video
   frame calculation is unclear in some cases.

   sean: addr4essed by appendix N

   mike: didn't look at it lately and was happy with it

   sean: I'm pretty sure he didn't change it lately

   close issue-199

   <trackbot> Closed ISSUE-199 timeExpression to video frame
   calculation is unclear in some cases.

AOB

   Sean: glenn suggested to do a new snapshot for the 2nd edition
   ... including resoltuion for 210 and 217
   ... any objection?

   [none heard]

   [adjourned]

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Mike to open issue for 1.1 regarding encodings
   [recorded in
   [44]http://www.w3.org/2013/06/20-tt-minutes.html#action01]

   [End of minutes]
Received on Thursday, 27 June 2013 14:18:46 UTC

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