W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-tt@w3.org > February 2013

TTWG Meeting Minutes Feb 28

From: Monica Martin (MS OPEN TECH) <momartin@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 06:36:56 +0000
To: "'public-tt@w3.org'" <public-tt@w3.org>
Message-ID: <ecad137fd29d4f3d9922814964a2be7e@BY2PR03MB059.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>
See: http://www.w3.org/2013/02/21-tt-minutes.html
http://www.w3.org/2013/02/21-tt-minutes.html,text

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                              - DRAFT -

                Timed Text Working Group Teleconference

21 Feb 2013

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2013/02/21-tt-irc

Attendees

   Present
          +44.118.900.aaaa, Sean, +49.893.aabb, mmartin3,
          +1.858.847.aacc, glenn, mike, Andreas,
          Thomas_Bause_Mason, +1.408.515.aadd, Plh, pal

   Regrets
   Chair
          <mmartin3> Sean Hayes

   Scribe

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]Chair for next 2 weeks.
         2. [5]Issues
     * [6]Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________

   <trackbot> Date: 21 February 2013

   <mmartin3> trackbot, start meeting #tt

   <trackbot> Sorry, mmartin3, I don't understand 'trackbot, start
   meeting #tt'. Please refer to
   <[7]http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.

      [7] http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc%3E

   <glenn> i already started

   <mmartin3> invite trackbot #tt

   <mmartin3> trackbot, start meeting

   <trackbot> Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference

   <trackbot> Date: 21 February 2013

   <mmartin3> scribenick:

   <mmartin3> mmartin3

   <glenn> trackbot, status

   <glenn> monica, before you start meeting, check to see if it is
   already started

   <glenn> since i had started already

   <mmartin3> ok, thanks glenn

   <glenn> if you see zakim and rrsagent already online, then it
   has already been started

   <glenn> [8]https://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=34314

      [8] https://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=34314

   <mmartin3> sean: Get SE done.

   <glenn> the above link i added is the TTWG member database page

   <glenn> mike, you can edit there

Chair for next 2 weeks.

   <mmartin3> sean: Designate mmartin3.

Issues

   <mmartin3> Issue-156?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-156 -- semantics of missing #feature -- open

   <trackbot>
   [9]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/156

      [9] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/156

   <mmartin3> sean: Create a profile and don't mention a specific
   feature. Is it optional? Is it processed by the processor?

   <mmartin3> glenn: Don't have concrete text yet. Get in next 2
   weeks.

   <mmartin3> mike: Create full set based on profile. What happens
   with required and optional. Discuss 2 parts - author and
   implications to the player.

   <mmartin3> sean: Indication whether the processor should
   process the document. What happens if the processor doesn'
   implement a feature included.

   <mmartin3> glenn: How to designate on a feature that are not
   desired to process, they can reject.

   <mmartin3> mike: What happens if not designated at optional or
   required. What does silence mean?

   <mmartin3> glenn: What about prohibited value?

   <mmartin3> andreas: Features or attributes have initial values.
   Signal a feature is not intended to be used by the processor.

   <mmartin3> sean: Have prohibited feature. Take silence as
   optional.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Prohibited value mean document is not valid?

   <mmartin3> sean: Valid but not processed.

   <mmartin3> glenn: What happens if the processor makes indirect
   use of it, such as fontSize. Document has initial value that is
   used. Processor not use fontSize?

   <mmartin3> sean: Look at individual features to decide wether
   this applies.

   <mmartin3> andreas: Rigid behavior is not necessary. Signal
   this feature isn't processed not that the document is rejected.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Need reject, ignore.

   <mmartin3> sean: Clarifying language in SE.

   <mmartin3> ...New capabilities in TTML 1.1.

   <glenn> RESOLVED: in 1.1, add value of "prohibited" for feature
   definitions, also add attribute "disposition" with values
   "error" and "ignore"

   <glenn> RESOLVED: in SE, add text indicating that absence of a
   feature in profile means same as "optional"

   <mmartin3> andreas: Is feature prohibited if ignored?

   <mmartin3> sean: Have prohibited and ignore?

   <mmartin3> glenn: Feature is out of scope for prohibited. This
   is separate from ignore.

   <mmartin3> Action Glenn Draft text for 2 resolutions: RESOLVED:
   in 1.1, add value of "prohibited" for feature definitions, also
   add attribute "disposition" with values "error" and "ignore"
   and RESOLVED: in SE, add text indicating that absence of a
   feature in profile means same as "optional".

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-146 - Draft text for 2 resolutions:
   RESOLVED: in 1.1, add value of "prohibited" for feature
   definitions, also add attribute "disposition" with values
   "error" and "ignore" and RESOLVED: in SE, add text indicating
   that absence of a feature in profile means same as "optional".
   [on Glenn Adams - due 2013-02-28].

   <mmartin3> Issue-157?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-157 -- transformation profile -- open

   <trackbot>
   [10]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/157

     [10] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/157

   <mmartin3> glenn: Added some text in a note in SE. Need to
   check?

   <mmartin3> ...Add terms to Terminology. Add presentation and
   transformation.

   <mmartin3> ...Section 2.2.

   <mmartin3> Action Glenn Create definitions for presentation and
   transformation in Section 2.2 to handle Issue-157.

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-147 - Create definitions for
   presentation and transformation in Section 2.2 to handle
   Issue-157. [on Glenn Adams - due 2013-02-28].

   <mmartin3> Issue-179?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-179 -- Interpreting the pixel measure -- open

   <trackbot>
   [11]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/179

     [11] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/179

   <mmartin3> sean: Need to post to list.

   <Sean> Style properties that operate in both the horizontal and
   vertical direction, such as border, outline thickness etc. may
   be specified using a single value which is based on the cell
   unit. When the cell is non-square, the computed value is
   calculated based on the height of the cell. For example: Given
   a root extent of 852px 480px and a ttp:cellResolution="30 20";
   then in pixels the horizontal cell size is : 852/30 = 28.4
   pixels, in the vertical 480/20 = 24 pixels. Th

   <Sean> he relative unit to be used is 28.4px.

   <mmartin3> mike: Is this the issue? Difference of pixel in
   display?

   <mmartin3> sean: This is on Issue-163.

   <mmartin3> Issue-163?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-163 -- Clarify use of cell units in certain
   properties -- open

   <trackbot>
   [12]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

     [12] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/163

   <mmartin3> sean: See text above.

   <mmartin3> ...Style properties that operate in both the
   horizontal and vertical direction, such as border, outline
   thickness etc. may be specified using a single value which is
   based on the cell unit. When the cell is non-square, the
   computed value is calculated based on the height of the cell.
   For example: Given a root extent of 852px 480px and a
   ttp:cellResolution="30 20"; then in pixels the horizontal cell
   size is : 852/30 = 28.4 pixels, in the vertical 480/20 =
   24[CUT]

   <mmartin3> ...The relative unit to be used is 28.4px

   <mmartin3> Generally agree.

   <mmartin3> ...Clarify on references to mean cell height.

   <mmartin3> Action Glenn Clarify cell units as Sean specified as
   follows: .Style properties that operate in both the horizontal
   and vertical direction, such as border, outline thickness etc.
  may be specified using a single value which is based on the
   cell unit. When the cell is non-square, the computed value is
   calculated based on the height of the cell. For example: Given
   a root extent of 852px 480px and a ttp:cellResolution="30 20";
   then in pixels the horizontal cell[CUT]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-148 - Clarify cell units as Sean
   specified as follows: .Style properties that operate in both
   the horizontal and vertical direction, such as border, outline
   thickness etc. may be specified using a single value which is
   based on the cell unit. When the cell is non-square, the
   computed value is calculated based on the height of the cell.
   For example: Given a root extent of 852px 480px and a

   <trackbot> ... ttp:cellResolution="30 20"; then in pixels the
   horizontal cell[CUT] [on Glenn Adams - due 2013-02-28].

   <mmartin3> Issue-179?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-179 -- Interpreting the pixel measure -- open

   <trackbot>
   [13]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/179

     [13] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/179

   <mmartin3> sean: Explains issue. Pixels are underlying video vs
   device pixels.

   <mmartin3> ...Clarify what they mean if we use.

   <mmartin3> ...Proposal in issue.

   <mmartin3> ...Netflix presentation - use device pixels, you get
   a strange presentation.

   <mmartin3> glenn: See CSS pixels. SVG may be closer to what we
   want. Review both.

   <mmartin3> sean: Need time bounded so we can resolve for SE
   actions.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Will try to do the review.

   <mmartin3> sean: Go to open list.

   <mmartin3> Action Glenn Review CSS pixels and SVG to suggest a
   resolution to Issue-179.

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-149 - Review CSS pixels and SVG to
   suggest a resolution to Issue-179. [on Glenn Adams - due
   2013-02-28].

   <mmartin3> mike: Viewport is in the authoring phase. Then, you
   map to the video.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Can we give guidance when the implementation
   does different things?

   <mmartin3> mike: Remaining in authoring expectation.

   <mmartin3> sean: How mapped is separate.

   <mmartin3> Issue-170?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-170 -- Section 5.2 para 8 is vague regarding
   optionality of specifying profile in case where profile is
   negotiated/determined by 'document interchange process' -- open

   <trackbot>
   [14]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/170

     [14] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/170

   <mmartin3> sean: Is a profile optional when it is created by
   the document interchange process?

   <mmartin3> mike: We need to specify a profile guaranteed to be
   unique with URI. Back up and review further.

   <mmartin3> ...Close.

   <mmartin3> andreas: If a profile isn't exchanged with document,
   what does it mean?

   <mmartin3> mike: Element and attribute are optional.

   <mmartin3> andreas: Document can still be processed.

   <mmartin3> mike: Silence is presumed to be full?

   <mmartin3> sean: Empty set and everything becomes optional.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Need to review further before make
   suggestions. Profile element as use attribute to modify and
   extend. Speak to null or empty profile.

   <mike> 5.2: If neither ttp:profile attribute nor ttp:profile
   element is present in a TTML document instance, and if the
   Document Interchange Context does not make an implicit or
   explicit reference to a pre-defined Content Profile or does not
   specify a Profile Definition Document or another equivalent set
   of feature designations, then the DFXP Transformation profile
   applies.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Section 5.2

   <mmartin3> mike: Need to review this.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Need to be null profile.

   <mmartin3> sean: Semantic change.

   <mmartin3> mike: No one adheres to this.

   <mmartin3> sean: Argue if implicit, some profile applies which
   could be a null profile.

   <mmartin3> andreas: Common understanding should be supported
   work in the document.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Private agreement, outside spec, etc.

   <mmartin3> sean: Delete, "then the DFXP Transformation profile
   applies."

   <mmartin3> glenn: Can be convinced to do in SE.

   <mmartin3> mike: Clarify implicit reference to give the
   control.

   <mmartin3> Discuss options.

   <mmartin3> mike: Clarify implicit reference.

   <mmartin3> glenn: Take up on mailing list.

   <mmartin3> Issue-201?

   <trackbot> ISSUE-201 -- How to specify aspect ratio to
   understand positioning that may apply for display or video. --
   raised

   <trackbot>
   [15]http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/201

     [15] http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/201

   <mmartin3> mmartin3: What to do in SE?

   <mmartin3> sean: Influenced by pixel issues.

   <mmartin3> ..What is mapping to root container? What is
   expected?

   <mmartin3> mike: Separate in 1.0 SE and 1.1 work.

   <mmartin3> sean: Clarification in SE is needed.

   <mmartin3> ...Point forward.

   <mmartin3> ...Discuss on list.

   <mmartin3> trackbot, end meeting

Summary of Action Items

   [End of minutes]


Monica J Martin
Senior Program Manager
Microsoft Open Technologies, Inc.
A subsidiary of Microsoft Corporation
Received on Thursday, 28 February 2013 06:38:51 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.1 : Tuesday, 6 January 2015 21:06:06 UTC