Re: Issue 153 - Approaching CfO

Thank you all for the participation in this discussion on add-ons. 
Please be aware that the co-chairs would like to start a Call for 
Objections on the text proposals soon after the WG call today. Please 
take a look at the wiki page 
http://www.w3.org/wiki/Privacy/TPWG/Proposals_on_limitations_for_add-ons 
to see whether your proposed text is listed there (or maybe suggest a 
last minute merging of text).

Bryan, I updated the wiki with your two proposals from December 18 
http://www.w3.org/wiki/Privacy/TPWG/Proposals_on_limitations_for_add-ons
Would you please take a look to see whether I successfully captured them?

Ninja

Am 18.12.13 01:34, schrieb Nicholas Doty:
> Hi Brad,
>
> Thanks for this update. I think the clarity is useful, as this brings 
> the proposal more in line with the scope of this issue (which is noted 
> as being explicitly not about plug-ins or parts of the user agent, but 
> about other software).
>
> I've updated the wiki with the full two paragraphs in the existing 
> text and your change proposal.
> http://www.w3.org/wiki/Privacy/TPWG/Proposals_on_limitations_for_add-ons
>
> You're right that there's an interaction between the last sentence of 
> the default tracking preference paragraph (currently, "Likewise, a 
> user agent extension or add-on MUST NOT ... unless the act of 
> installing ....") and the following paragraph (currently, "A user 
> agent extension or add-on MUST NOT alter the user's 
> tracking preference setting unless it complies..."). I think perhaps 
> these are actually currently redundant, and just an artifact of adding 
> the issue-153 text to already agreed upon text regarding extensions.
>
> Alan Chapell wrote that second paragraph in June, integrated into the 
> editors' draft by David Singer: 
> https://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/track/actions/423.
>
> I hope that background helps. That gives me a few questions:
>
> 1) If we delete the "Likewise" sentence and leave the following 
> paragraph, does that work for everyone? (I think that would be a 
> mostly editorial change, and an improvement for the most part.)
>
> 2) Brad, if your concern is about software outside the user agent (the 
> second paragraph, which I believe is the intended scope of issue-153), 
> could we modify your proposal to just change the last sentence of the 
> second paragraph ("Software outside of the user agent that causes a 
> DNT header to be sent...")?
>
> 3) Brad, could we modify your proposal to rely on functional 
> requirements (the current text relies on meeting the consent 
> requirements, but maybe you had something else in mind) rather than 
> prohibiting certain classes of software from sending/modifying a signal?
>
> For the reasons I've expressed before, I don't think forbidding 
> modifying/sending a DNT header for certain types of software will help 
> any of our use cases, but expressing functional requirements will be 
> more productive for our group.
>
> Thanks,
> Nick
>
> On December 12, 2013, at 4:18 AM, Brad Kulick <kulick@yahoo-inc.com 
> <mailto:kulick@yahoo-inc.com>> wrote:
>
>> Nick,
>>
>> To make this proposal more clear, I have updated it. Along with 
>> clarifying the what to remove/alter I have added some non-normative 
>> text might be helpful per yesterday's discussion.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Brad
>>
>> Existing text
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> A user agent must have a default tracking preference of unset (not 
>> enabled) unless a specific tracking preference is implied by the 
>> decision to use that agent. For example, use of a general-purpose 
>> browser would not imply a tracking preference when invoked normally 
>> as "SuperFred", but might imply a preference if invoked as 
>> "SuperDoNotTrack" or "UltraPrivacyFred". A user agent extension or 
>> add-on must not alter the tracking preference unless the act of 
>> installing and enabling that extension or add-on is an explicit 
>> choice by the user for that tracking preference.
>>
>> A user agent extension or add-on must not alter the user's tracking 
>> preference setting unless it complies with the requirements in this 
>> document, including but not limited to this section (Determining a 
>> User Preference). Software outside of the user agent that causes a 
>> DNT header to be sent (or causes existing headers to be modified) 
>> must not do so without ensuring that the requirements of this section 
>> are met; such software also must ensure the transmitted preference 
>> reflects the individual user's preference.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> New text
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> A user agent must have a default tracking preference of unset (not 
>> enabled) unless a specific tracking preference is implied by the 
>> decision to use that agent. For example, use of a general-purpose 
>> browser would not imply a tracking preference when invoked normally 
>> as "SuperFred", but might imply a preference if invoked as 
>> "SuperDoNotTrack" or "UltraPrivacyFred".
>>
>> A user agent extension, add-on, or software outside of the user agent 
>> must not alter the tracking preference.
>>
>> Non-normative:
>> User agent plug-ins and add-ons as well as software outside of a user 
>> agent are under continued review for future addition, whereby 
>> recognized limitations affecting a balanced implementation can be 
>> addressed.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 11, 2013, at 6:51 AM, "Brad Kulick" <kulick@yahoo-inc.com 
>> <mailto:kulick@yahoo-inc.com>> wrote:
>>
>>> Nick,
>>>
>>> You are correct. Removing "Likewise" would be suffice. But Given the 
>>> paragraph that following we would want to add intermediaries as 
>>> well. Therefore, it would be:
>>>
>>> "A user agent extension, add-on, or software outside of the user 
>>> agent must not alter the tracking preference."
>>>
>>> Also, the paragraph following it would need to be altered to remove 
>>> or sync with the above.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Brad
>>>
>>>
>>> On Dec 8, 2013, at 11:43 PM, Nicholas Doty wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've set up a wiki with what I believe are the two proposals (the 
>>>> existing text which was the basis for sometime and for the batch 
>>>> closing period; and Brad's alternative to remove the "unless" clause).
>>>>
>>>> http://www.w3.org/wiki/Privacy/TPWG/Proposals_on_limitations_for_add-ons
>>>>
>>>> Brad, we might want to clarify the wording of your suggestion: the 
>>>> sentence begins with "Likewise", but I believe you're proposing a 
>>>> different result (prohibition, rather than explicit choice) for 
>>>> user agent extensions / add-ons.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Nick
>>>>
>>>> On December 4, 2013, at 12:48 PM, Brad Kulick <kulick@yahoo-inc.com 
>>>> <mailto:kulick@yahoo-inc.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Matthias,
>>>>>
>>>>> Respectfully, I would like to maintain my objection for closing 
>>>>> Issue-153 and allow it to proceed to CFO. Given the lower than 
>>>>> normal participation for today's call, I would appreciate allowing 
>>>>> for process to complete to ensure any other similar viewpoints are 
>>>>> represented.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Brad