Re: Regarding: Making the W3C Web SQL Database Specification Active

On 26 sept. 2013, at 00:39, Michael Fitchett wrote:

Dear Members of the W3C Consortium::

Regarding:  Making the W3C Web SQL Database Specification Active

I would like to request  that you make the W3C Web SQL Database specification active again. The Web SQL Database Specification enables developers to build web-based applications that can store, retrieve, manipulate and query against data on the client machine. This technology is similar to SQLite, Microsoft SQL Server, MySQL, etc. Web SQL combined with Manifest enable developers to build web-based applications that work while offline.

The Web SQL Database specification was on the W3C Recommendation track, but the specification was stopped because Mozilla and Microsoft did not want to implement a specification that lacked proper SQL definition.

The sentence in the W3C Note is:

"This document was on the W3C Recommendation track but specification work has stopped. The specification reached an impasse: all interested implementors have used the same SQL backend (Sqlite),  but we need multiple independent implementations to proceed along a standardisation path."

http://www.w3.org/TR/webdatabase/


I think having such API to also connect an external SQL database, instead of just using an embedded one (which might still be provided by default), would be very useful in the context of installed Web applications (which is why I add the System Applications Working Group to the thread). Note that with the ongoing Raw Socket API (potentially renamed "Transport layer socket API"), such apps will be able to access any SQL database engine on a network.

I mentioned this potential usage during TPAC last year (http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/SessionIdeas#End-to-end_W3C_APIs) and one associated this approach to JDBC calling it JSDBC (coming from PHP I'd associated it in my mind to PDO).

Of course a standard SQL API for Server-Side JavaScript make even more sense, and I feel concerned because we try in the Wakanda server to make as most as possible Server-Side JS APIs compliant with the W3C ones
DOM is already widely supported in many server side languages. For your information, I try to list potential candidates for SSJS implementations on this wiki: http://www.w3.org/community/jseverywhere/wiki/Main_Page

Web SQL is of course one of them


Back to non-installed Web Applications

Note that user agents may also themselves propose settings to use a specific engine available on the client or on its local network and then provide alternatives to a potential embedded one.


I know there is a need for both a NoSQL and SQL solution. The two specifications (Web SQL Database and Indexed Database API) that exist to date are acceptable..

I fully agree, IndexedDB, I think it is very nice but, correct me if I'm wrong, it has been designed on purpose for not being relational
NoSQL database were not designed to replace relational  databases everywhere but to provide alternate solutions where RDBMS were not the most adapted
IndexedDB will not be the best candidate for advanced relational queries which would then require, using IndexedDB, to fetch many collection of objects in JS and then construct the result in JS

However, as stated above, the problem is the lack of definition for SQL.  Since lack of definition is the issue, I would like to recommend a remedy.  I know SQL experts and great documentation writers who I would gladly hire to further define the Web SQL Database specification and fill in the missing SQL definition. Is this something that would be possible to help revive the specification and get the remaining vendors on board?

I'd love if this specification could be revived :-)



On 26 sept. 2013, at 00:39, Michael Fitchett wrote:

Dear Members of the W3C Consortium::

Regarding:  Making the W3C Web SQL Database Specification Active

I would like to request  that you make the W3C Web SQL Database specification active again. The Web SQL Database Specification enables developers to build web-based applications that can store, retrieve, manipulate and query against data on the client machine. This technology is similar to SQLite, Microsoft SQL Server, MySQL, etc. Web SQL combined with Manifest enable developers to build web-based applications that work while offline.

The Web SQL Database specification was on the W3C Recommendation track, but the specification was stopped because Mozilla and Microsoft did not want to implement a specification that lacked proper SQL definition. I know there is a need for both a NoSQL and SQL solution. The two specifications (Web SQL Database and Indexed Database API) that exist to date are acceptable.. However, as stated above, the problem is the lack of definition for SQL.  Since lack of definition is the issue, I would like to recommend a remedy.  I know SQL experts and great documentation writers who I would gladly hire to further define the Web SQL Database specification and fill in the missing SQL definition. Is this something that would be possible to help revive the specification and get the remaining vendors on board?

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