- From: Nikos Andronikos <nikos.andronikos@cisra.canon.com.au>
- Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2012 07:48:31 +1000
- To: <www-svg@w3.org>
Minutes:
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/16-svg-minutes.html
and as text:
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
- DRAFT -
SVG Working Group Teleconference
16 Aug 2012
[2]Agenda
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2012JulSep/0096.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2012/08/16-svg-irc
Attendees
Present
Brian, Leroux
Regrets
Chair
Cameron
Scribe
nikos
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]Publication of FPWD of SVG 2
2. [6]Sizing of SVG and HTML
3. [7]Filter Effects - clipping of subreagions
4. [8]Filter Effects - dx and dy with
primitiveUnits="objectBoundingBox"
5. [9]CSS Masking
* [10]Summary of Action Items
__________________________________________________________
<trackbot> Date: 16 August 2012
<pdr> Hi, I am [Google].
<heycam>
[11]https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/19480/SVGLucerne2012/results
[11] https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/19480/SVGLucerne2012/results
<scribe> scribenick: nikos
heycam: first we'll have an introduction from Rich
richardschwerdtfe: I'm involved in a number of w3 efforts on
accessibility
... I work for IBM. CTO for accessibility in software
... what I'm interested in svg2 is having it as accessible as
possible for the svg2 release
... next week Ican go through the gap analysis we did if yo
ulike
... i'll send a doc for review before then
heycam: We have a F2F coming up, might be a bit soon for you to
attend
richardschwerdtfe: I probably won't be able to make it
... I have one question - in terms of accessibility work, are
you looking for content changes?
heycam: generally we have people pitching into the documents
that they can
... Tav and I probably do the most editorial work
richardschwerdtfe: I'm happy to pitch in then
Publication of FPWD of SVG 2
heycam: This is a reminder that we're scheduled to publish
Tuesday next week
... I'm going to do clean ups this morning and then send off
request to the webmaster
... so if you have any changes (that aren't controversial) get
them in now
Sizing of SVG and HTML
pdr: Hi, I'm from Google on the Chrome team
... I'm implementing the sizing stuff, where you have image
with svg in it
<heycam>
[12]https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gDnYxvqIMPjs4TThwc5N0Jc
6qgIKlrgPaYJglsvrjtI/edit?pli=1
[12] https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gDnYxvqIMPjs4TThwc5N0Jc6qgIKlrgPaYJglsvrjtI/edit?pli=1
pdr: what I can tell, this is really underspecified in the spec
- all browsers are different
... I thnk Firefox is the best implementation
... I was wondering if we could clean up the spec and converge
on their approach
<pdr>
[13]https://docs.google.com/a/chromium.org/document/d/1gDnYxvqI
MPjs4TThwc5N0Jc6qgIKlrgPaYJglsvrjtI/edit?pli=1
[13] https://docs.google.com/a/chromium.org/document/d/1gDnYxvqIMPjs4TThwc5N0Jc6qgIKlrgPaYJglsvrjtI/edit?pli=1
pdr: I listed the various permutations of svg file
... you can click on the bottom and I have a list of results -
you can see how they differ
heycam: I was wondering if you could summarise the behaviour of
FF
pdr: for the basic things - all are right
... differences when you hav ean image with a width and an svg
width property and they differ (attribute or property)
... if you look at the table in my doc
... last 2 rows are an example of this
heycam: Am I right that the svg width property doesn't seem to
be doing anything
pdr: that's right. that's the path mozilla took and it's as
good as any
krit: svg in image tag?
pdr: that's the first table
... second is inline svg
... my request for the WG is to clean this stuff up
heycam: this has been an open issue for a while and we are keen
to fix it up
pdr: would you like someone to write it up?
... I have a test suite that matches mozilla behaviour - we
could spec it from that
krit: regarding embedding svg image inline - do we want to
differ between width attribute and property in future, when we
move to presentation attribute?
... Canvas is a bit different than SVG
... Canvas has resolution
Tav: The equivalent in SVG is the viewport size
krit: for inner svg element, would there still be separate
width attribute and property?
heycam: currently the width property on inner svg element
doen'st do anything?
all: right
krit: I'd like to specify something that is common for all
browsers
shepazu: pdr, can you write the specification from the data you
have?
heycam: If you could write up the rules from the sizing, that
would be helpful
pdr: ok
shepazu: we talked about adding the viewbox value auto, which
automatically sets the viewbox to the bounding box of the
containing shapes
pdr: how would you like me to do this?
... email results to www-svg?
all: yes
heycam: we'll wait for a resolution until you write up the
rules
... is everyone ok that we move forward?
shepazu: I think the general approach is fine, it's a good way
forward
Resolution: Address the question of SVG sizing
Filter Effects - clipping of subreagions
krit: I can summarise.
... we have an issue in the filter effects spec where we might
mwant to specify a keyword or property that allows the author
to clip the input or output or nothing
... since we haven't decided if we want just input or output
I'd like to delay this
... it would be good to get Erik's input
... we discussed this last week and resolved to ask Erik about
it
Filter Effects - dx and dy with primitiveUnits="objectBoundingBox"
<krit>
[14]https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/FXTF/raw-file/tip/filters/index.html
#feOffsetElement
[14] https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/FXTF/raw-file/tip/filters/index.html#feOffsetElement
krit: I just realised that dx and dy take numbers and
percentages
... some browsers support percentages
heycam: is it useful to support percentages?
krit: I would expect that percentage is relative to either
viewport or object depending on primitiveUnits
... I think it's ok to have numbers that act as percentages
... I think we shouldn't chane the specification
heycam: if we have percentages it might seem like we can take
arbitrary lengths as well
... percentages are separate from lengths in css?
krit: yes
heycam: I'm looking at other things that take 0-1 number values
... the new filter shorthand property value takes number as
well as percentage
... I'm wondering if there's an expectation that values that
take 0-1 are a ratio
krit: if you put 0.5 with primitiveUnits="objectBoundingBox" it
means 50%
... with the other value of primiteUnits it means 0.5 * the
unit
heycam: I think it would be good to get Erik's input - are you
happy to talk about it when he's back?
krit: yep
CSS Masking
krit: I want to summarise
<krit>
[15]http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/FXTF/raw-file/tip/masking/index.html
[15] http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/FXTF/raw-file/tip/masking/index.html
krit: I brought up a short first draft
... it specifies what webkit is doing with css msaking as well
as waht firefox is doing with svg masking
... mask-repeat, etc are all shorthand for the webkit
properties
... I think they can apply to svg in the same way
... the css wg isn't in favour of using all these properties
... not all these properties make sense for svg
... such as mask-attachment, clip and origin
... I think we could remove these for svg
... so far no one in css has objected to clip-paths
heycam: all those mask properties - they are things that webkit
currently supports for html content?
krit: mask-attachment doesn't do anything in webkit, mask-type
you can select between luminance and alpha masks
... the editorship of the specification, I'd like to delay to
next css meeting, to see if they reject completely or decide to
go on
... they are worried that they have too many specifications on
the go
heycam: you were going to look at whether you could supply
resources for editing the spec weren't you?
krit: it depends on css wg, whether they reinvent the wheel or
not. It may be too much work
... if it's just removing properties and changing behaviour of
properties then it's ok
heycam: I think it would be a bit silly to do everything from
scratch
... currently clip-path stuff is in the spec
krit: no one from css objected to it yet
heycam: maybe because they haven't thought about it properly
yet
... it would be good for us to review it also
krit: there are some descriptions missing, but the general
intent of the spec sould be clear
... css wg is looking at aligning mask feature with specific
part of element, i.e just mask border or just content
heycam: that seems similar to shaders, with filters applying to
different parts
krit: it might apply to svg elements once we support vector
effects, i.e. i just want to have mask on stroke or fill
heycam: even without full vector effects we could support that
krit: dont know if we will fit this in svg 2
heycam: if the css wg doesn't want to take it on, what will be
the way forward?
krit: I think it's reasonable to define what webkit already
does
heycam: Brian said he probably doesn't have time to be a full
editor
krit: css wg meet is in 2 weeks so we'll see what they say
heycam: for the moment the masking chapter is in the svg 2 spec
- it's probably a bit early to point to the new document
... I think the direction is good though
... I might agree with comments about proliferation of the
background style property and whether we can cut some out
... just a reminder to register for the F2F
<heycam>
[16]https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/19480/SVGLucerne2012/
[16] https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/19480/SVGLucerne2012/
krit: just one more thing - css wg has decided to publish draft
of filter effects
heycam: I noticed css working group resolved to include
scientific notation
... there was some opposition but it got through
Summary of Action Items
[End of minutes]
__________________________________________________________
Minutes formatted by David Booth's [17]scribe.perl version
1.136 ([18]CVS log)
$Date: 2012/08/16 21:45:55 $
__________________________________________________________
[17] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
[18] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
Scribe.perl diagnostic output
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[19] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
Succeeded: s/krit svg in image tag?/krit: svg in image tag?/
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Inferring Scribes: nikos
Present: Brian Leroux
WARNING: Fewer than 3 people found for Present list!
Agenda: [20]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2012JulSep
/0096.html
Found Date: 16 Aug 2012
Guessing minutes URL: [21]http://www.w3.org/2012/08/16-svg-minutes.html
People with action items:
[20] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2012JulSep/0096.html
[21] http://www.w3.org/2012/08/16-svg-minutes.html
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[22] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
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Received on Thursday, 16 August 2012 21:49:30 UTC