Minutes: June 19, 2015 SVG Accessibility Task Force Meeting

Minutes: June 19, 2015 SVG Accessibility Task Force Meeting

http://www.w3.org/2015/06/19-svg-a11y-minutes.html


Text:
- DRAFT -
Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
19 Jun 2015


See also: IRC log


Attendees
Present
      Rich, chaals, Fred, Jason, LJWatson
Regrets
Chair
      Rich
Scribe
      Rich
Contents
      Topics
         1. Actions
         2. Action 1589
         3. New Documents
         4. Taxonomy
      Summary of Action Items



<trackbot> Date: 19 June 2015


<richardschwerdtfeger> chair: Fred


<richardschwerdtfeger> Meeting: SVG Accessibility Task Force


<richardschwerdtfeger> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/access.html



<shepazu>
https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m2f65b5e71b964e48bd1274721ab964e6



<fesch> Supports the ‘a’ element, enablign authors to supply the link
purpose both from its content.


<richardschwerdtfeger> https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/access.html



<richardschwerdtfeger> scribenick: Rich


Actions


<chaals> action-1589?


<trackbot> action-1589 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Update the accessibility
appendix in the main svg specs, to link back to the relevant content -- due
2015-02-27 -- OPEN


<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1589



Action 1589


<chaals> close action-1589


<trackbot> Closed action-1589.


<chaals> action-1600


<trackbot> action-1600 -- Léonie Watson to Get with doug to build a
starting navigation strategy for charts -- due 2015-03-27 -- OPEN


<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1600



<richardschwerdtfeger> fred: Start doing a navigation strategy for charts


<chaals> action-1600 due in 3 weeks


<trackbot> Set action-1600 Get with doug to build a starting navigation
strategy for charts due date to 2015-07-10.


<chaals> action-1602?


<trackbot> action-1602 -- Jason White to Find some stem graphics to
consider as use cases -- due 2015-03-27 -- OPEN


<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1602



<chaals> assign action-1602 to chaals


<chaals> action-1602 on chaals


<richardschwerdtfeger> Jason: I have put together a preliminary document
and sent it to Charles who will put it up on a wiki


<richardschwerdtfeger> action-1603?


<trackbot> action-1603 -- Charles McCathie Nevile to Work with jasonw,
markkuh and the universe to discover how people do interaction… -- due
2015-07-17 -- OPEN


<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1603


New Documents


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: Please look at the revised SVG accessibility
appendix and send me comments: https://svgwg.org/svg2-draft/access.html


<fesch> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/graphics.html



<fesch> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/graphics.html



<richardschwerdtfeger> fred: Let’s start talking about roles


<richardschwerdtfeger> fred: There one area that is talking about SVG in
the third person


<richardschwerdtfeger> amelia: We should edit the co-evolution of WAI-ARIA
and host languages


<richardschwerdtfeger> ACTION: Rich update preliminaries in the SVG spec to
better focus on SVG vs. legacy HTML [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2015/06/19-svg-a11y-minutes.html#action01]


<trackbot> Created ACTION-1659 - Update preliminaries in the svg spec to
better focus on svg vs. legacy html [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due
2015-06-26].


<richardschwerdtfeger> fred: Let’s look at section 4.1 where there are 2
new graphics roles g-icon and g-symbol


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: I think the intro needs to more clearly
emphasize the action


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: We don’t want to encourage people to support
interactivity where it needs to be interactive


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: I will update the example


<richardschwerdtfeger> Jason: I suggest we make it look like the ARIA Spec.
in terms of its position in the taxonmy


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: we need to require the name


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: Let’s discuss symbol


<AmeliaBR> Link to repo: https://github.com/w3c/aria



<AmeliaBR> Link to rawgit:
http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/graphics.html



<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: I will play around with the definition of
symbol


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: The symbol element will never be in the
accessibility tree


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: we need to apply symbol to <use>


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: you have one of these text icon on an
element witthin a group. …


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: were we coing to ask for something linked from
a symbol?


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: I am going to spend to day working on this.
We can go over edits to the mapping spec. next week


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: Were there roles that we missed and agreed to
put in


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: there is the figure role and the structured
graphical component


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: That mean it is like a group or something?


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: Any other comments on the document so far.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: Is everyone ok for me puttng in fallback
role information?


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: Yes if is informative notes


Taxonomy


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: We have some pretty aggressive schedules.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Doug: The SVG working group is going to have another
face to face in Paris in the fall.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Doug: Looking to CR version of SVG in Q!16


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: I would like to see the chart roles in SVG2


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: Would like to also see roles needed fo native
host language semantics as well as needed states and properties to synch
with HTML as well


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: There is an aria-roledescription going into
ARIA 1.1


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: Trying to get ARIA 1.1 locked down too


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: let’s talk about the graphical group role
and what to call it


<richardschwerdtfeger> Doug: I would like to see g-group


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: is there a definition for that on the wiki?


<AmeliaBR>
https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_roles_for_graphics#Structured_Graphical_Component



<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: Graphica components can be nested. These
should be the default role for <svg> and <g> in SVG.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: If you put a title on this group it maps to
a new role


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: Before we said we were going to explicitly
define roles … I wanted to put a label on a group to have it participate in
navigation


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: Do I need to put a role on that?


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: no it maps automatically


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: if you have alternative text on it


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: looking at the stack bar chart and we want to
be able to navigate up and down the stacks. To make it navigable we don’t
need to put a role on it.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: … we don’t need to put tabindex on everything


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: I thought we had an explicit thing on it we
need to put a role on it.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: no


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: there is a set of about 5 things that
trigger whether it is in the accessibility tree.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: it makes polyfills a little harder


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: that is great


<richardschwerdtfeger> Rich: The important thing is does the role of the
object reflect its purpose


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: The one thing I wanted to clarify is that if
we are going to refer to graphical group it will be the main role for an
entire SVG.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: We need to have a way that they have
switchted into a graphics (graphical group) and it may trigger a new
graphical navigation mode.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: right now we have document and widget
navigation modes


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: if we are going to have new graphical
navigation modes then we need to let the browser and AT to know that you
have now entered into a graphical navigation mode.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: If you have SVG can you have a role of icon?


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: that means you could not navigate inside


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: We said you need to be able to navigate
based on the visual layout (left, right, top, down) … to deal with things
like charts and maps


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: Similar to the way you navigate a table


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: if we are going to investigate new
navigation options


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: there is navigating like a tree


<richardschwerdtfeger> Leonie: I don’t relish the work having to adjust to
this as a user


<richardschwerdtfeger> Charles: visual navigation is not an easy way to get
around what you can’t see.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Charles: it is a mechanism that is extremely
limiting at best.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Leonie: from an unsighted perspective spacial
navigation is difficult.


<richardschwerdtfeger> Amelia: We don’t want to tab through a 100 things to
get to something


<richardschwerdtfeger> Fred: I think you could just support both so that
the user has a way to pick the navigation mode they want


<AmeliaBR> s/We don't/It's more for sighted keyboard users, who don't/


<richardschwerdtfeger> Jason: Graphical group might trigger a different
navigation mode. If someone is using SVG to create their own widget set. …
What you are doing is creating a whole set of child nodes that effect your
accessibility tree


<richardschwerdtfeger> Jason: You may not want an explicit group there


<chaals> [chaals leaves]


<richardschwerdtfeger> Jason: … non-presentational child elements


Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: Rich update preliminaries in the SVG spec to better focus on
SVG vs. legacy HTML [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2015/06/19-svg-a11y-minutes.html#action01]


Rich Schwerdtfeger