- From: Sajka, Janina <sajkaj@amazon.com>
- Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2021 16:38:17 +0000
- To: "public-silver@w3.org" <public-silver@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <fd6e6be567c54d48bbca7fbc717fd669@EX13D28UWB001.ant.amazon.com>
Minutes from the Silver Task Force and Community Group teleconference of
Friday 29 January are provided here.
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SUMMARY:
* Report from Errors Subgroup on methodology and current status.
Feedback is requested, and we engage during this call
* Updates on some loose ends beginning at:
https://www.w3.org/2021/01/29-silver-minutes.html#t04
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Hypertext minutes available at:
https://www.w3.org/2021/01/29-silver-minutes.html
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W3C
- DRAFT -
Silver Task Force & Community Group
29 January 2021
IRC log.
Attendees
Present
Andy, CharlesHall, Chuck, Fazio, Francis_Storr, JakeAbma, jeanne, Jemma, jennifer, JF, joconnor, JustineP, KimD, KimD_, Laura_Carlson, Lauriat, Makoto, Rachael, sajkaj, sarahhorton, Sheri-B-h, Shri, Wilco
Regrets
Angela, Bruce, David, John, Peter, Sukriti, Todd
Chair
-
Scribe
jeanne, sajkaj
Contents
1. Errors subgroup User Needs work
2. results of the scheduling survey
3. Errors subgroup User Needs work
4. FPWD Comment triage system
5. Proposal for Enhanced Acknowledgements
Meeting minutes
<CharlesHall> have to drop at 2:30p ET
<ChrisLoiselle> I defer to the queen.
Errors subgroup User Needs work
sh: Multiple docs associated with group work ...
<sarahhorton> Errors User Needs Summary: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mTrr0hSsQrApmC4N0tF4fQOF-PiLsK-FNZproi7WQcA/edit#
sh: Mainly want to share the doc and request feedback ...
sh: Group working since October on content creation process
sh: First task was to define user needs when working through error situations
sh: Notes links in summary doc above
sh: Existing Silver docs have helped us work through how things should ideally work in error situations
sh: This is all draft material--not a subgroup consens yet! Please beware!
sh: We do want feedback and additional perspectives though
sh: Pauses for questions
js: Asks for overview of work so far
sh: Is screenshare OK
js: As long as you describe
sh: Intro describes at how we arrived at our items
sh: also background info on group work
sh: also overview of existing guidance then asks content groups to provide more pwd group specific needs
sh: notes next step is where we are now, share and request response
sh: We have 4 specific questions
sh: will come back to that
sh: Identified user needs fall into different categories; and that has suggested guidelines
sh: starting with notification
sh: Outcome would be provided notifications that users would know about
sh: barriers might be no message, or inaccessible message, or somehow else not comprehensible
sh: another common situation is getting at details
sh: or a notification that there's change in autocorrection in values--users should have opportunity to verify
sh: reviews a flow chart ...
<Jemma> "unique" user needs now made sense to me with all the examples. Thanks, Sarah.
js: Impressed with the quality of this work. Will be good example for task force training!
janina: I think this is excellent work. I want to ask about scoping about what one does when things that go wrong and you have to re-iniitalize -- like adjust the temperature for the IoT thermostat. Is that
information available in an accessible form. I had to find a hard to find USB port on the thermostat. If therew was a loose wire, it could be dangerouis.
... I also want to get at least one lamp that I can reliably turn off.
... the configuration is not accessible to screen readers
... all the prompts are inaccessible
... there should be disclosure whether or not the device is inaccessible.
<Jemma> yeah. sajkaj's examples are really good ones.
<sajkaj> sj: Explains some WoT stack and process related challenges
<CharlesHall> error notification could be configurable
<sajkaj> sh: Likes the scenarios and agrees need to explore
SH: One of the buckets of ideas are Error Contingencies. These are good scenarios and the configuration scenario as well
<Jemma> First sajkaj's point is related to error identification.
<sajkaj> sh: provides good segue for needs we do have ...
<Jemma> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Fix0uwC0vODgiKl09lMF77FMdd52u64KG9_-N86r4UE/edit#
Error FLows Inventory
<Jemma> abov is error flows inventory
<sajkaj> sh: will walk through one ack je
<Zakim> jeanne, you wanted to ask where Sarah has captured potential outcomes?
<CharlesHall> sorry. have to drop.
<sajkaj> js: Going back to probable guidelines and wondering where you saw potential outcomes
<Jemma> "probable guideline"?
<sajkaj> js: Was that notifications?
<sajkaj> sh: Yes and can show how they came to be
<sajkaj> sh: like the process we discovered
<sajkaj> sh: worked through error flows ...
<sajkaj> sh: first flow was file not found -- click link
<sajkaj> sh: the 404
<sajkaj> sh: error would be no notification--
<sajkaj> sh: user doesn't know why the unrelated response, so tries another way to do the same thing
<sajkaj> js: User needs to know resourdce not available, but is it likely existing via other route?
<sajkaj> sh: we reference all functional needs and walk through our scenario
<sajkaj> sh: eg physical harm or risk
<sajkaj> sh: Doc is output of many individuals and may not yet be fully coherent stylistically
<sajkaj> sh: where we had content in various flows we went to a spread sheet
Errors User Needs Worksheet
<sajkaj> sh: looks at sheet -- each need one row
<Jemma> Sarah's approach is very systematic.
<sajkaj> sh: rows are the functional needs
<sajkaj> sh: not various tabs ...
<sajkaj> sh: looks at some of the specifics identified by the process -- that's how we got to our outcomes
<sajkaj> js: Great!
<sajkaj> sh: Note we also worked on a scope doc for our subgroup
<sajkaj> sh: Notes related guidelines column -- either from 2.x or our emerging 3.0
<jennifer> This spreadsheet is fantastic!
<sajkaj> sh: very handy that this is sortable!
<Lauriat> +1, awesome work, this really helps to follow it all!
<sajkaj> js: Wow!
<sajkaj> js: Very powerful and like it a lot
<sajkaj> jema: Got me to look at unique user need definition ... may be helpful to have uniue functional need definition
<sajkaj> jema: maybe something more specific than "unique"
<sajkaj> sh: That's the kind of feedback we need!
<sajkaj> js:Notes good question -- Should contrast be different for error notifications?
<sajkaj> sh: There are several like that and we need to identify those. It's among our next steps
<sajkaj> andy: Contrast is definitely context sensitive. Understand one some things will need to stand out
<sajkaj> andy: People frequently use red to help--but that's not fully a11y
<sajkaj> andy: ample luminence also important -- but what do you do when everything is actually already high contrast
<sajkaj> andy: should all else become dimmer? We sometimes see that technique
<sajkaj> sl: want to build on this topic a bit ...
<sajkaj> sl: scope for errors interesting, but also andy's points
<sajkaj> sl: using errors as defining increased severity of not following guidance
<sajkaj> sl: this may be about rating workflow and how well workflow follows guidelines
<sajkaj> sl: a button "click here to fix the problem" button not in tab order would be a big problem
<sajkaj> sl: we need to keep this on our agenda for building up these kinds of workflows
<sajkaj> sl: and a walkthrough for how to interpret
<Jemma> great suggestion, Shawn.
<Jemma> This is great discussion!
<sajkaj> js: Notes we have time to incorporate these things as they develop
<Lauriat> I feel like I just complicated things a little, but this work just has so many angles to it. Thank you for walking through it all, Sarah!
<sajkaj> sh: We'll take feedback in any form. February for us is building up guidelines
<sajkaj> sh: Also notes thanks to subgroup who've worked on this so hard
<sajkaj> js: Notes a tweet following FPWD which noted 3.0 is very ambitious
<sajkaj> js: I see that here! A great description
results of the scheduling survey
<sajkaj> js: Trying to followup on loose ends post FPWD ...
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/94845/schedule-Jan2021/results
<sajkaj> js: Changing meeting time js: No one solution fits -- rather as expected
<sajkaj> js: have variety of answers which the bot gives us multiple views of; esp ranking details
<sajkaj> js: no answer yet
<sajkaj> js: Now also reminded to review scope statements from subgroups
<sajkaj> js: Asks for responses to WBS
<sajkaj> js: OK. Current plan is discussion in leadership next week and back on agenda soon
<sajkaj> js: Notes need to plan vis a vis steps beyond 2.2
Errors subgroup User Needs work
<sajkaj> js: Process draft will be forthcoming ...
Process: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/silver/wiki/Procedure_for_Processing_Comments
Github issues ->
<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/silver/issues/
<sajkaj> js: suggest to look at "simplify wcag doc" you'll se tagging we applied. NOT YET APPROVED -- working on it!
<sajkaj> js: Actions; Sections; Guidelines
<sajkaj> js: should help us map to subgroups, then what to do with it ...
<sajkaj> js: Editorial: fix/don't-fix
<sajkaj> js: changed color coding
<sajkaj> js: Should develop into a consistent Tuesday agendum
FPWD Comment triage system
Proposal for Enhanced Acknowledgements
<sajkaj> js: Notes this is just a proposal and an early response. Responses welcome!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Joc5F6YfYPDOK5ryBUsPVP-xUtrrhoQ2Uf7iKGpbLnM/
<sajkaj> js: Proposal is for subsections under Acknowledgements for "How people contributed"
<sajkaj> js: Pushed for useful categories that would help show how work was accomplished
<sajkaj> js: Ex: Authors; Subgroup leaders and participantsjs: Ajother category is research -- Andy, Josh, etc
<sajkaj> js: We should work out our definitions, of course
<ChrisLoiselle> I was just looking for a w3c t-shirt :)
Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 127 (Wed Dec 30 17:39:58 2020 UTC).
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Janina Sajka
Accessibility Standards Consultant
sajkaj@amazon.com<mailto:sajkaj@amazon.com>
Received on Saturday, 30 January 2021 16:38:39 UTC