Minutes of the Silver meeting of 18 January 2019

Formatted version of minutes:
https://www.w3.org/2019/01/18-silver-minutes.html

Text version of minutes:

    [1]W3C

       [1] http://www.w3.org/

                                - DRAFT -

                  Silver Community Group Teleconference

18 Jan 2019

Attendees

    Present
           KimD, AngelaAccessForAll, LuisG, Lauriat, JF, Charles,
           cyborg, jeanne

    Regrets

    Chair
           jeanne, Shawn

    Scribe
           LuisG

Contents

      * [2]Topics
          1. [3]attending CSUN Silver F2F meeting?
          2. [4]consolidating the prototypes - plain language
          3. [5]Method detail mockup
      * [6]Summary of Action Items
      * [7]Summary of Resolutions
      __________________________________________________________

    Jeanne: If you're intending to go to the CSUN face-to-face
    meeting, make sure and let us know

attending CSUN Silver F2F meeting?

    Charles: I will likely not be there

    Jeanne: We'll have remote access if you want to sign in for
    part of the day

consolidating the prototypes - plain language

    Jeanne: On Tuesday, we started working on consolidating
    prototypes.

    <jeanne>
    [8]https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/Secti
    onHeading.html

       [8] https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/SectionHeading.html

    Jeanne: here's the plain language prototype
    ... we had been talking about the tabs
    ... we agreed on the tabs content. We were discussing whether
    to add a Miscellaneous tab
    ... and maybe splitting the Design tab

    <jeanne>
    [9]https://mikecrabb.github.io/silver_taggingSystemDemo/guideli
    nes.html

       [9] https://mikecrabb.github.io/silver_taggingSystemDemo/guidelines.html

    Jeanne: let's move on to how we want to integrate this into the
    information architecture prototype
    ... here's the Info Architecture prototype
    ... what we have in Plain Language Prototype is a detail page
    for an individual guideline
    ... the tabs aren't the primary navigation because there is a
    higher level navigation related to all the guidelines

    <Charles> repost the plain language link?

    <jeanne>
    [10]https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/Sect
    ionHeading.html

      [10] https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/SectionHeading.html

    Jeanne: the first section in the Get Started tab (inside the
    box) would be the guideline
    ... each guideline would have methods, you can get to them from
    the details page
    ... any questions? or should we continue where we left off on
    Friday?
    ... Okay, we were discussing subdividing the tabs a little more
    ... we talked about how complex the tabs should be
    ... and breaking down some of the tabs by role
    ... we looked at work done by Education and Outreach; they have
    a list of accessibility roles. Were wondering if that would fit
    into this architecture
    ... I think we stopped at "it would be helpful to link to
    those, but might be too much detail for these pages"
    ... I think the next step is to look at the information
    architecture prototype and see how we can move the plain
    language prototype into that
    ... I would start with drilling down the architecture prototype
    into looking into the guidelines so you see the page with the
    checkboxes for filtering methods and one for "check all"
    ... I would move that whole tagging bit to the guideline list
    and then have the guideline box to fit the page horizontally
    and put the plain language tab there

    KimD: I agree, the tagging needs to be at a much higher level

    Lauriat: That makes sense

    Jeanne: I'll make a list of changes so we can discuss some of
    the changes with him
    ... think we'll need tagging for the methods? especially if we
    get lots of methods

    Lauriat: Maybe, the Methods were how we were going to have
    things tabbed, but it would also be for filtering what you're
    looking at..like by filtering methods that apply to that
    technology

    <cyborg> sorry just joined

    Howdy: )

    <KimD>
    [11]https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/Sect
    ionHeading.html

      [11] https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/SectionHeading.html

    <KimD>
    [12]https://mikecrabb.github.io/silver_taggingSystemDemo/guidel
    ines.html

      [12] https://mikecrabb.github.io/silver_taggingSystemDemo/guidelines.html

    <cyborg> if there are links I need to see today, please repost
    if possible

    <cyborg> oh great, looks like you already are

    Lauriat: I think I'd start merging them by starting at the data
    level and plug in the plain language information into the
    database, then we could play with how we render things
    separately

    Jeanne: How granular should we make it?

    [13]https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/Sect
    ionHeading.html

      [13] https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/SectionHeading.html

    scribe: for breaking up the data
    ... if someone filters by "design" do we only show them tabs
    that have design?
    ... pretty sure we want to break up the title, short
    descriptions, and long descriptions, but how much?

    Lauriat: Let's err on the side of not breaking things up. We're
    going to have enough work getting the content into the
    architecture
    ... then we could break it up later
    ... it's hard to tell what would make sense since it's all fake
    data right now

    JF: +1 to leaving our options open
    ... when it comes to techniques, should we be thinking of a
    tagging library. have we thought about that?
    ... I'm thinking WCAG is applicable to more than just Webpages.
    It would seem we'd want tags for things like "desktop web"
    "mobile web" etc.
    ... and leave the possibility of additional tags
    ... even though we don't have data to flesh that out, I think
    collectively it would be non-controversial to have that level
    of grouping

    Lauriat: I'm looking for the example we wrote up at TPAC, it
    was doing something like that. We took language of page and
    broke it out..
    ... into overall guidance and different methods
    ... here's a link

    <Lauriat> Language of environment:
    [14]https://docs.google.com/document/d/18JyGF-AK8Qgq7DPyVlDYmxo
    j6814rORxuCf0l0oSb7U/edit

      [14] https://docs.google.com/document/d/18JyGF-AK8Qgq7DPyVlDYmxoj6814rORxuCf0l0oSb7U/edit

    Lauriat: the prototype itself was how to write methods starting
    with test, but a key thing we have in here. each method is tied
    to specific technology
    ... I think for me, it's mostly a question of how do we start
    plugging plain language stuff into the database Mike Crabb has
    set up
    ... or should we start with documents like this one and start
    copying things into documents and work with Mike to get things
    into the database

    Jeanne: I think he built an interface for us to easily put
    stuff into the database

    Angela: Looks like we have Section Headings, Name Role Value...
    ... sensory characteristics, pause stop hide
    ... so we have a few. We could tweak these to make them
    consistent

    Jeanne: Or just cut/paste things into their appropriate places
    since we're not writing the official content yet

    Lauriat: +1 on keeping it easy

    Cyborg: Does the education team have material we could put into
    the prototype

    Jeanne: I think there's some. I think Headings was one
    ... and I forget the others
    ... in the plain language prototype in the design tab, there's
    a link to the video on clear layout and design. in develop tab
    there is a link to the tutorial on headings they did
    ... they were very excited to share their work with us at the
    TPAC meeting
    ... they also wanted to start making lists of suggestions for
    them
    ... we're not there yet, but at some point, we should start
    thinking about that...after CSUN
    ... what are some of the videos we're going to want

    Cyborg: Does that require an architecture aspect as well?

    Jeanne: yup
    ... It doesn't seem like Mike has built the input for us

    Lauriat: Let's just start a folder in drive and put content in
    there

    Jeanne: I put the interface for content on my list for Mike

    Lauriat: How do we want to divide up the work?
    ... in the drive folder, for a translation of an existing
    guideline into plain language, put the document in there with
    the name of the guideline
    ... so people can see it exists or in progress

    Jeanne: We should probably create a "combined prototype" folder

    <jeanne>
    [15]https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1tGB1-m5QcrLcbrFB4Ou
    VKiUh8I709Qca

      [15] https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1tGB1-m5QcrLcbrFB4OuVKiUh8I709Qca

    Jeanne: here's the combined prototype folder
    ... I'll create another called "mockup content" if you want to
    work on something, create it in there
    ... anything we already have done we can put that in there too
    ... Anything else on this?

    Lauriat: I think we have a clear path forward

    Jeanne: By CSUN, we need the overall structure
    ... after CSUN, we need to start writing content
    ... anything up until CSUN is just a mock up ...after that, we
    get down to business and actually start writing this thing

Method detail mockup

    Jeanne: one part we haven't worked on yet is what the detail
    page of a method would look like. that's where we start looping
    in the conformance and that work

    <jeanne>
    [16]https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pyDEt4HhXFCI_IH7H5Uzj0r
    enEuRJlX7yHhIeKUSrtc/edit

      [16] https://docs.google.com/document/d/1pyDEt4HhXFCI_IH7H5Uzj0renEuRJlX7yHhIeKUSrtc/edit

    Jeanne: What do we want in it?

    Lauriat: Method name, short description, long description,
    examples, tests, and I think the test/examples are external
    since they could span multiple methods
    ... associated tags...I think that's all we had for the methods
    prototype for language of page

    Cyborg: I would add tutorial, like videos or other external
    tools. And what technology it applies to

    Jeanne: Probably don't want to repeat the tutorial if it's
    already in the guideline

    Lauriat: Tutorials probably make more sense at the method
    level, but we'll see as we write information. I think tech is
    covered by the associated tags
    ... we may want to treat technology a little more special than
    other tags

    Jeanne: The points that it's worth?

    LuisG: Are they behind the scenes?

    Jeanne: The calculation is behind the scenes. People will want
    to know the points values.
    ... they'll be there to incentivize making things more
    accessible
    ... someone want to take this list and turn it into a rough
    design?

    Cyborg: How do this merge with other tabs?

    Jeanne: I think of it like an accordion, but it might be a
    little too much. we might need a different way of managing it

    Lauriat: I'm fine not designing the interactions, etc. but
    instead the information architecture of how things fit together
    ... we can look at how we would present this after that. we'll
    likely iterate on that for a bit as well
    ... we have the method details we're talking about here. but
    for plain language prototype, we have other tabs and within
    those we have different sections.

    <jeanne>
    [17]https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/Sect
    ionHeading.html

      [17] https://w3c.github.io/silver/prototypes/PlainLanguage2/SectionHeading.html

    Jeanne: If you go back to the plain language prototype and look
    at develop tab...each tab has a list of methods. you'd click on
    that and it would open somehow
    ... that would give you all the information we were just
    brainstorming for the name, short desc, long desc, etc.

    Cyborg: so is this a nested hierarchy, you would go into the
    plain language prototype...you would go to guidance, you go to
    dev tab see possible methods, choose one, go into it and then
    get in depth look at the method?

    Jeanne: that would be a way of doing it, but we'd like people
    to be able to go through the methods as well
    ... it's a many-to-many relationship for the guidelines and
    methods

    Lauriat: Would help if we could talk through the information
    architecture merging with a real example...could we do that
    with language of page?

    Jeanne: Getting real examples of how to do some user testing it
    would be very helpful to have some written up "this is how you
    would test this"
    ... for usability or testing with people with disabilities,
    etc.

    Cyborg: The idea would be...is it possible to write a method
    for a particular user test that could be used for different
    guidance or does it need to be specific to the guidance? Would
    it fit as a method within the design tab?

    Charles: A method of testing can be described independently of
    the thing being tested.

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

    [End of minutes]