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[Minutes] 2015-04-22

From: Phil Archer <phila@w3.org>
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 15:12:41 +0100
Message-ID: <5537AC59.3070504@w3.org>
To: SDW WG Public List <public-sdw-wg@w3.org>
The minutes of today's meeting are at 
http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html

With a text summary below. Thanks Josh for scribing.


22 Apr 2015

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-irc

Attendees

    Present
           kerry, phila, Frans, +1.857.919.aaaa, JoshLieberman,
           eparsons, jtandy, +61.4.303.7.aabb, ClemensPortele,
           LarsG, billroberts

    Regrets
           Linda_van_den_Brink, John_Machin, Rachel_Heaven

    Chair
           Kerry

    Scribe
           JoshLieberman

Contents

      * [3]Topics
          1. [4]Process call
          2. [5]Timing, new members
          3. [6]use case document
      * [7]Summary of Action Items
      __________________________________________________________

    <phila> Kerry - hang on. We have to set up an ad hoc which i'll
    do nearer the top of the hour

    <phila> It's because the zamim booking hasn't changed to this
    new time yet

    <kerry> no wories

    <phila> (Zakim thinks we're meeting in 12 hours' time or so)

    <kerry> chhirs?

    <kerry> chris?

    <kerry> how would you like to scribe today?

    <kerry> chrislittle -- would you like to scribe?

    <kerry> ChrisLittle: would u like to scribe????

    <kerry> Armin, would u like to scribe????

    <kerry> *ahaller2, would u like to scribe?

    <phila> kerry?

    <ahaller2> hi kerry, not today, i am only on my phone
    (internet)

    <ahaller2> will do next time

    <kerry> ta, armin

    <kerry> ChrisLittle: are u there?

    <kerry> scribe: JoshLieberman

    <kerry> scribenick: JoshLieberman

    <kerry> big ugly beep?

    <kerry> can anyone else still hear on the line?

    <Frans> I don hear many meaningful sounds

    <Frans> I have just muted myself

    <billroberts> Alejandro and me joined at about same time

    <billroberts> I think I was first and am IPcaller

    <ebremer> zakin, 1.631.444.aacc is me

    <billroberts> and Ale is .a I think?

    <billroberts> not 100% sure!

    <ebremer> tks

    <Alejandro_Llaves> sorry phil, which one you said?

    <ChrisLittle> zakim aaff is ChrisLittle

    <eparsons> Yes

    <billroberts> yes

    <Frans> Kerry recommends following the instructions on the
    meeting page:
    [8]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2015042
    2

       [8] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20150422

    <LarsG> yes, I can here you

    <kerry> minutes
    [9]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

   http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

    +1

    <eparsons> +1

    <MattPerry> +1

    <Frans> +1

    <ChrisLittle> +1 to minutes

    <ebremer> +1

    <phila> PROPOSED: Accept last week's minutes
    [10]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

      [10] http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

    <phila> RESOLVED: Accept last week's minutes
    [11]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

      [11] http://www.w3.org/2015/04/15-sdw-minutes.html

    <Adila> +1

    <Alejandro_Llaves> +1

    <jtandy> s/laty/last/

Process call

    <kerry> [12]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

      [12] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call

Timing, new members

    <phila> Jitao: Introduces himself...

    <kerry> jitao? say hello?

    <LarsG> yes

    <phila> kerry: Jitao is from the Chinese Academy of Sciences

    jitao: from the Chinese Academy of Science

    <Frans> I think an introduction by e-mail is OK too?

use case document

    <Alejandro_Llaves> latest version
    [13]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/UseCases/SDWUseCasesAndRequirement
    s.html

      [13] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/UseCases/SDWUseCasesAndRequirements.html

    kerry: editors will show us what the document looks like and
    plans to complete

    <Alejandro_Llaves> +q

    <Frans>
    [14]http://w3c.github.io/sdw/UseCases/SDWUseCasesAndRequirement
    s.html

      [14] http://w3c.github.io/sdw/UseCases/SDWUseCasesAndRequirements.html

    frans: document still in development. core is list of use cases
    (complete except for two complex ones) and requirements
    ... document introduction is fairly complete as well.
    ... comments invited on Chapters 1-4
    ... ACTION: review use cases that each submitted
    ... focusing now on requirements and relation to the use cases

    Alejandro_Llaves: also looking to cross-reference requirements
    and deliverables

    <SimonCox> +q

    Alejandro_Llaves: mailing list discussion on filtering and
    refining requirements is useful

    <cperey> what is link to the spreadsheet to which Chris is
    referring?

    ChrisLittle: will send an update on requirements from their use
    cases. Also need to clarify some more obscure key words /
    phrases

    <Alejandro_Llaves> link to spreadsheet
    [15]https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PSnpJYQDgsdgZgPJEfU
    U0EhVfgFFYGc1WL4xUX9Dunk/edit?usp=sharing

      [15] 
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PSnpJYQDgsdgZgPJEfUU0EhVfgFFYGc1WL4xUX9Dunk/edit?usp=sharing

    kerry: some definitions are in my head and need to be
    contributed...

    <jtandy> I think that all use case contributors should go
    through and suggest requirements that fit ... I will do so for
    my two UCs

    <ChrisLittle> spreadsheet
    [16]https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PSnpJYQDgsdgZgPJEfU
    U0EhVfgFFYGc1WL4xUX9Dunk/edit?pli=1#gid=0

      [16] 
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PSnpJYQDgsdgZgPJEfUU0EhVfgFFYGc1WL4xUX9Dunk/edit?pli=1#gid=0

    <SimonCox> -q

    Frans: document is still very much in process

    kerry: any comments on the structure and approach of the
    document?

    <kerry> acj jtandy

    <SimonCox> +q

    <Frans> A clarification: especially the requirements and
    linking ucs and reqs are a work in progress

    jtandy: the cross-references seem to work well in the document.
    Requirements probably are not complete yet.

    <cperey> 15 requirements is still a lot! Very rich set of
    things on which to work for years to come

    SimonCox: more requirements coming?

    Frans: probably yes, more requirements and therefore more
    cross-links

    JoshLieberman: will the requirements include those that may not
    be essentially spatial but not well covered elsewhere?

    <kerry> +q

    Frans: some of the "non-functional" requirements may be
    included among these.

    <Zakim> phila, you wanted to answer Josh on non-spatial Reqs

    phila: "non-spatial" requirements should be documented in
    document, but also communicated to the Data on the Web group as
    well.

    <ChrisLittle> +1 phil's comments

    <kerry> ack

    kerry: example?

    <ChrisLittle> +1 non-func requirements section

    <AndreaPerego> About requirements overlapping with DWBP ones,
    some are recorded here:
    [17]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Requirements

      [17] https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Requirements

    <SimonCox> @phila: Are SSN requirements non-spatial?

    <phila> No, they're in scope of this WG, SimonCox

    JoshLieberman: appropriate links / identifiers may be an
    example of non-spatial but essential for our use cases

    <SimonCox> Interesting ... arguably much 'data' is generated by
    sensors

    ClemensPortele: may be overlap with Data on the Web
    requirements, but need clarification in our context

    <Zakim> jtandy, you wanted to ask about how we will collect
    example datasets to support the use casess?

    jtandy: real data examples can be very useful in delineating
    use cases. Is there a plan for collecting datasets?

    kerry: definitely want them. include with use case on wiki if
    they are available

    jtandy: some may be quite large

    <cperey> very important point. Yes about Phil's point

    <Frans> Can we have a wiki page listing datasets?

    <cperey> that the use of data demonstrates rigor and tests the
    robustness of solutions

    phila: access to datasets shows a rigor that is very useful.
    Also, the DotW group will also be meeting in Japan.

    Note: lots of support for datasets attached to usecases

    <Frans> We could ask for more links to datasets in use cases?

    eparsons: make sure requirements are linked back to specific
    use cases to keep them "grounded" and help with prioritization

    <AndreaPerego> +1 to req ranking

    <jtandy> +1 to eparsons

    <kerry> +1

    <Adila> +1 to Frans

    Frans: some use cases have links to resources, even datasets.
    we should encourage more links to datasets.

    <eparsons> +1 to frans

    <jtandy> +1

    <ChrisLittle> +1

    <Zakim> jtandy, you wanted to ask about putting datasets on
    github repo

    kerry: how to handle datasets?

    <Alejandro_Llaves> +1 to Jeremy

    jtandy: useful to manage datasets on GitHub and link from wiki
    or use case document

    <ChrisLittle> +1 to github suggestion

    <billroberts> +1 to github

    <ebremer> +1 to github suggestion

    <Frans>
    [18]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Working_Use_Cases#Vari
    ous_Sensor_Use_Cases_.28SSN.29

      [18] 
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Working_Use_Cases#Various_Sensor_Use_Cases_.28SSN.29

    kerry: returning to complex use cases relating to SSN and IoT.

    <Frans>
    [19]https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Working_Use_Cases#.221
    01.22_Smart_City_Use-cases

      [19] 
https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Working_Use_Cases#.22101.22_Smart_City_Use-cases

    kerry: should probably bring SSN use cases over directly, since
    SSN update is a deliverable here

    <Alejandro_Llaves> +q on collections of use cases

    <jtandy> +1 to kerry ... the SSN use cases need to appear here
    ...

    <Zakim> Alejandro_Llaves, you wanted to comment on collections
    of use cases

    <SimonCox> [sorry - my battery is about to run out]

    Alejandro_Llaves: Frans idea to select out the SSN / IoT use
    cases that suffice to tie in requirements.

    kerry: selection may apply for IoT use cases, but SSN use cases
    are already somewhat filtered to support SSN requirements

    <kerry> ACTION: payam to summaries reqs from 101 use cases
    [recorded in
    [20]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action01]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-20 - Summaries reqs from 101 use
    cases [on Payam Barnaghi - due 2015-04-29].

    <kerry> ACTION: kerry to check ssn use cases and requirements
    [recorded in
    [21]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action02]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-21 - Check ssn use cases and
    requirements [on Kerry Taylor - due 2015-04-29].

    <SimonCox_> [fresh battery!]

    <SimonCox_> When I get back with voice I want to ask question
    about implied extension of scope for SSN and Time deliverables

    Frans: good practice has been for the whole use case group to
    evaluate each case, but IoT collection was too large to do this
    with. Summaries would be helpful.

    <kerry> ACTION: payam to summarise 101 use cases [recorded in
    [22]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action03]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-22 - Summarise 101 use cases [on
    Payam Barnaghi - due 2015-04-29].

    Kerry: action-22 is to both summarize and check requirements
    for IoT use cases.

    <billroberts> sorry all, have to leave early to catch a train.
    Will check minutes

    kerry: IoT use cases are not connected into the requirements
    yet.

    <Zakim> SimonCox, you wanted to ask question about implied
    extension of scope for SSN and Time deliverables

    <kerry> +1

    <Alejandro_Llaves> +q on scope of reqs

    SimonCox: two deliverables are based on existing W3C docs, with
    potentially expanded scope. Concern to define the scope more
    precisely by examining requirements so time doesn't inflate
    indefinitely

    <jtandy> I do think that it is important that we manage the
    scope of the deliverables going forward

    kerry: should scope those two deliverables based on most
    important requirements
    ... should be able to estimate "bang for buck" in scope

    <Zakim> Alejandro_Llaves, you wanted to comment on scope of
    reqs

    <SimonCox_> For example: 'sampling features' is an important,
    relatively discrete extension to SSN. But may be delegated to a
    separate project (though in practice we have found that most
    observation projects require it!)

    <eparsons> +1 to JoshLieberman "bang for buck"

    <jtandy> +1 to SimonCox_ 's comment about SamplingFeatures

    Alejandro_Llaves: work on defining requirements is leading to
    some being identified as more general and applicable to more
    use cases than originally conceived.

    <kerry> aq?

    ChrisLittle: not that worried about scope "creep" because scope
    hasn't yet been addressed and will be.

    <SimonCox_> +1 ChrisLittle

    <jtandy> +1 to ChrisLittle ... we manage our scope during
    prioritisation activity when we review the requirements list
    resulting from assessment of the use cases

    <eparsons> sorry cut off

    Frans: excluding requirements from present work is not
    eliminating them from importance - so requirements delineated
    but not addressed will still be a useful result

    kerry: very much in scope to describe work for a follow-on
    working group
    ... some discussion and confusion on principles out of best
    practice discussion

    <SimonCox_> Are principles on Wiki?

    <SimonCox_> Are non-functional requirements on Wiki?

    kerry: principles help describe what we are trying to do.
    should discuss further next week.
    ... putting things in the issue tracker a good way to make them
    visible

    <eparsons> Having trouble with zakim letting me back on voice
    :-(

    <ChrisLittle> +1 timing

    <Frans> +1 for the new time

    <SimonCox_> Not so good for the Australians

    <cperey> thank you for the new time!

    <ahaller2> +1 time

    <ebremer> +1 time

    <LarsG> +1 for new time

    I need to depart to another call.

    <SimonCox_> But I'm in Liverpool this week

    <cperey> yes, we appreciate everyone's sacrifice!

    <Frans> People do seem to be busier at this time

    <jtandy> thanks kerry

    <eparsons> bye

    <cperey> bye

    <AndreaPerego> Thanks. Bye!

    <Alejandro_Llaves> thanks, bye!

    <LarsG> bye

    <ClemensPortele> bye

    <kerry> rrsagen. make logs public

    <Frans> Have a good day!

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: kerry to check ssn use cases and requirements
    [recorded in
    [23]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action02]
    [NEW] ACTION: payam to summaries reqs from 101 use cases
    [recorded in
    [24]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action01]
    [NEW] ACTION: payam to summarise 101 use cases [recorded in
    [25]http://www.w3.org/2015/04/22-sdw-minutes.html#action03]

    [End of minutes]
      __________________________________________________________
Received on Wednesday, 22 April 2015 14:12:57 UTC

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