- From: Jason J.G. White <jason@jasonjgw.com>
- Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2025 13:56:22 +0000
- To: Roy Ruoxi Ran <ran@w3.org>, Jason White <jason@jasonjgw.net>, Scott Hollier <scott.hollier@accessibility.org.au>
- CC: RQTF <public-rqtf@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <PH7PR20MB530702FDA395F2AA42C66F73CF49A@PH7PR20MB5307.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
We agreed to discuss this further at next week’s meeting.
My personal view is that Janina is right: a community group would be the appropriate forum in which the developers of this proposal could work on it. I would emphasize the importance of including and engaging people who know and use sign languages in the project from the outset. If it turns out to be useful to this community, the W3C can be approached regarding formal development and publication opportunities in APA or another suitable working group.
Comments welcome - discussion at next week’s meeting.
From: Roy Ruoxi Ran <ran@w3.org>
Date: Wednesday, July 9, 2025 at 09:04
To: Jason White <jason@jasonjgw.net>, Scott Hollier <scott.hollier@accessibility.org.au>
Cc: RQTF <public-rqtf@w3.org>
Subject: Fwd: Computer notation and a graphical writing system for recording all sign language
FYI
下面是被转发的邮件：
发件人: Roy Ruoxi Ran <ran@w3.org>
主题: 转发：Computer notation and a graphical writing system for recording all sign language
日期: 2025年7月7日 GMT+8 20:33:24
收件人: Matthew Atkinson <m.atkinson@samsung.com>, Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
抄送: APA Chairs <group-apa-chairs@w3.org>
Hi both,
There is computer notation and a graphical writing system for recording all sign language, please find background in below email, this work from University of Auckland, they want to engage with W3C to do this work, and I think it could be related with our RQTF work, if we can encourage them to join our meeting to work on this, please help to review them work.
Thank you and Best Regards,
Roy Ruoxi Ran, 冉若曦, W3C
下面是被转发的邮件：
发件人: Philippe Le Hégaret <plh@w3.org>
主题: 回复：Computer notation and a graphical writing system for recording all sign language
日期: 2025年5月16日 GMT+8 23:42:15
收件人: Ian Jacobs <ij@w3.org>, Sylvia Cadena <sylvia@w3.org>, Roy Ruoxi Ran <ran@w3.org>
抄送: Richard Ishida <r12a@w3.org>, Fuqiao Xue <xfq@w3.org>, Shawn Henry <shawn@w3.org>, Kevin White <kevin@w3.org>, Tamsin Ewing <tamsin@w3.org>
+Roy, as APA Team Contact.
On 5/16/2025 9:29 AM, Ian Jacobs wrote:
Hi Sylvia,
I look forward to hearing from the WAI folks about where this student’s work would fit into W3C’s overall accessibility effort. If there is not already a venue for this type of activity, then a Community Group could be a venue for incubation.
+1
Looking around, we have looked at synchronization issues in the past:
- https://www.w3.org/TR/saur/#sign-language-interpretation-synchronization
WAI-Adapt might be a place to start with?
https://www.w3.org/WAI/about/groups/task-forces/adapt/
Ian
On May 15, 2025, at 10:23 PM, Sylvia Cadena <sylvia@w3.org> wrote:
Hi everyone,
I was contacted by Dr Ulrich Speidel, from the University of Auckland about a PhD student’s confirmation at the university. Ross is trying to develop a universal markup language for sign languages for the deaf community worldwide. He wants to engage with W3C and bring his work forward. The people copied in the email below (Mano and Xinfeng) as his PhD supervisors. He shared the gist of his work below.
Do you have any suggestions or guidance about how he might engage with W3C?
Their Computer Science program is home for many talented engineers from the Pacific, that in many cases, have gone back to their economies, and contribute to digital infrastructure development and are in charge of deploying government services or growing ISPs and other companies/services. Ulrich’s lab was a recipient of several grants and an award from my former organization, mainly on resilience and reliability of connectivity in the pacific (research, measurements and deployment). He has also been a great mentor to many engineers from Pacific Island nations pursuing their doctorates across many areas of technology, which the grants fund that I’ve established contributed towards. Ellisha is administering the grants fund.
I have a long and really lovely relationship with many people at the University. Fond memories… It will be great to find ways to get the University involved with W3C.
Thanks in advance for your help!
Sylvia
Begin forwarded message:
From: Ross Millar <ross.millar@auckland.ac.nz>
Subject: Re: Introduction
Date: 16 May 2025 at 9:19:58 AM GMT+10
To: Ulrich Speidel <u.speidel@auckland.ac.nz>, Sylvia Cadena <sylvia@w3.org>
Cc: Mano Manoharan <s.manoharan@auckland.ac.nz>, Xinfeng Ye <xinfeng@cs.auckland.ac.nz>, Ellisha Heppner <ellisha.heppner@apnic.net>
Kia ora (Hello from NZ) Sylvia and Ellisha,
And "Kia ora" in NZSL.<image.png>I thought the best way to introduce my work was to generate this SVG (largely, I added the movement later) from the SLAML notation (in XML). I'm developing a computer notation and a graphical writing system for recording all sign language (SL) features for any SL. The system is SL agnostic, so can be used for any SL. Currently, there is no widely accepted writing system for SLs (SignWriting, HamNoSys and other notations systems have weaknesses - especially in the area of non-manual signals, and are not suitable for writing all the features of any SL).
The SLAML for the image above is as below. I won't explain it all, but each articulator (including non-manuals such as eyebrow, nose, cheek, etc) has attributes that are notated in a similar fashion. The side attribute is either A (dominant side or left side for a left-hander), B (non-dominant) or AB (both) with L and R options. Most other attributes (e.g. level) have a range from -12 to 12 (or 0 to 12), or, if an angle, in steps of 15°. (12 allows for division by 2,3,4 and 6, which allows for fine granularity - even if known SLs only use value +/- 0, 6, 12. Lips are more likely to use values like +/- 3, 6, 9. There is some built-in redundancy.)
I hope that is enough of an introduction. I will arrange a time we can have further discussion. I am looking forward to that.
Kind regards,
Ross Millar
PhD Student
University of Auckland
<doc>
<sem type="sign" lexCode="sign_kia_ora">
<gloss lang="English-NZ" gloss="kia ora"/>
<gloss lang="English-US" gloss="hello"/>
<gloss lang="Maori" gloss="kia ora"/>
<params delayDuration="0" moveDuration="100" holdDuration="0" repeat="1"/>
<seq>
<arts>
<eyebrow side="A" inner="6" middle="6" outer="6"/>
<eyebrow side="B" inner="6" middle="6" outer="6"/>
<corrugatorLine side="AB" level="0"/>
<eye side="AB" xAngle="0" yAngle="0"/>
<eyelidA side="AB" level="0" />
<eyelidB side="AB" level="-3" />
<eyeLine side="AB" level="6" number="3"/>
<nose side="AB" level="0"/>
<mouth side="A">
<jaw x="0" y="0" z="0" />
<lipA simple="true" middleX="0" middleY="6" middleZ="0"/>
<lipB simple="true" middleX="0" middleY="0" middleZ="0"/>
<lipC sideOneX="6" sideOneY="6" sideOneZ="0" sideTwoX="6" sideTwoY="6" sideTwoZ="0" />
<tongue x="0" y="0" z="0" />
<breath level="0" />
</mouth>
<mouthLine side="AB" level="6"/>
<dimpleLine side="AB" level="6"/>
<chinLine side="AB" level="0"/>
<hand side="A" lexCode="H5_w">
<!-- f0 = thumb.
j1, j2 and j3 are the angles of flex atthree joints
j1s is the spread of the finger in 5° increments at j1 -->
<f0 j1="0" j1s="45" j2="0" j3="0" />
<f1 j1="0" j1s="15" j2="0" j3="0" />
<f2 j1="0" j1s="5" j2="0" j3="0" />
<f3 j1="0" j1s="5" j2="0" j3="0" />
<f4 j1="0" j1s="15" j2="0" j3="0" />
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="-45"/>
<location>
<pos x="150" y="100" z="100"/>
</location>
<movement moveDuration="100">
<!-- mid and end points record changes - these are approximate at this stage -->
<mid>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="0"/>
<location>
<pos x="300" y="100" z="100"/>
</location>
</mid>
<mid>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="45"/>
<location>
<pos x="350" y="50" z="100"/>
</location>
</mid>
<mid>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="0"/>
<location>
<pos x="300" y="0" z="100"/>
</location>
</mid>
<mid>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="0-45"/>
<location>
<pos x="250" y="0" z="100"/>
</location>
</mid>
<mid>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="0"/>
<location>
<pos x="300" y="100" z="100"/>
</location>
</mid>
<end>
<orientation xAngle="0" yAngle="0" zAngle="45"/>
<location>
<pos x="550" y="100" z="100"/>
</location>
</end>
</movement>
</hand>
</arts>
</seq>
</sem>
</doc>
--
Ian Jacobs <ij@w3.org>
https://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs/
Tel: +1 917 450 8783
Thank you and Best Regards,
Roy Ruoxi Ran, 冉若曦, W3C
Received on Wednesday, 9 July 2025 13:56:32 UTC