Re: Joint mtg followup re XAUR and Avatars

Looks like a good addition Janina. I've edited it, as follows and pushed 
this change to the branch:

> Currently, it is not possible to provide an accurate live 
> interpretation via a signing avatar. Animated or digital signing 
> avatars should be avoided as users find them less expressive than 
> recorded video of humans who can convey the natural quality and skill 
> provided by appropriately trained and qualified interpreters and 
> translators.  Therefore uses of signed avatars should rely only on 
> pre-recording of 'real people' who are trained and qualified 
> interpreters and translators. See the concerns expressed by the WFD 
> and WASLI 'Statement on Use of Signing Avatars'. [[wfd-wasli]] 
Looks good?

Thanks

Josh



> Janina Sajka <mailto:janina@rednote.net>
> Wednesday 26 May 2021 13:02
> Trying a few edits ...
>
> Signing avatars should be avoided as users find them less expressive
> than recorded video.
>
> Developers who wish to work on perfecting the use of avatars should be
> certain to model human facial expression using all 44 muscles in the
> human face when creating signing avatars, as facial expression is a key
> component of effective sign language communication.
>
> Joshue O'Connor <mailto:joconnor@w3.org>
> Wednesday 26 May 2021 12:34
> Hi Janina,
>
> Based on the discussion last week I've updated the Signing avatar user 
> need and requirement with some suggested text:
>
> <suggested update>
>
> 4.10 Text description transformation
> User Need 10: A deaf or hard of hearing person, for whom English or 
> any other written language, may not be their first language and may 
> have a preference for signing of text alternatives or equivalents.
> REQ 10a: Allow text, objects or item descriptions to be presented to 
> the user via a signing avatar.
> NOTE
> Any signing avatar should convey the natural quality and skill 
> provided by appropriately trained and qualified interpreters and 
> translators. There have been concerns expressed by the WFD and WASLI 
> 'Statement on Use of Signing Avatars' as machine translations have yet 
> to emulate the human ability in creating a live interpretation (spoken 
> or signed). Currently, it is not possible to provide an accurate live 
> interpretation via a signing avatar. Therefore uses of signed avatars 
> should rely on pre-recording of 'real people' who are trained and 
> qualified interpreters and translators. [wfd-wasli]
> </suggested update>
>
> https://raw.githack.com/w3c/apa/xaur-signing-avatar/xaur/index.html
>
> Thoughts and comments welcome, thanks
>
> Josh
>
> Janina Sajka <mailto:janina@rednote.net>
> Wednesday 19 May 2021 16:17
> I thought I should say for the record what I raised my hand to say when
> we ran out of time ...
>
> Regarding avatars ...
>
> I was highly impressed by the detailes that emerged about why avatars
> tend to fail SL users. I'm thinking we should capture a high level
> description of what would be required to create a successful avatar in
> the XAUR by way of answering any engineering interest in moving to their
> use prematurely.
>
> I believe the explanation is that SL captures far more than the words
> which are captured in a text transcript of what's being said. SL
> attempts to communicate more of the conversation than just the verbal
> language content we've learned to capture with paper and ink.
>
> Facial expression -- there are some 43 muscles that control facial
> expression, though if one googles this question the answers vary, 43,
> 42, 33 ...
>
> Implication: anyone building a signing avatar should provide a face and
> 43 functioning muscular variables.
>
> Similarly, there's the challenge to understand the nuance of vocal
> expression. Consider the word "O:"
>
> O (as in startled surprise)
> O? (as in really?)
> O (as in oops, which sometimes comes out as "o, o)
>
> There are more for just this one word, but I believe I've made my point.
>
> If we take this tack we avoid a perscription against engineering
> development and supplant it with the far more meaningful challenge of
> what it takes to design a satisfying avatar.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Janina
>
>


-- 
Emerging Web Technology Specialist/Accessibility (WAI/W3C)