- From: Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org>
- Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2008 14:21:30 -0400
- To: public-swd-wg@w3.org, public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org
The record [1] of today's RDF-in-XHTML Task Force telecon is
now available for review. A text snapshot follows below.
[1] http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html
----
RDF-in-XHTML TF
26 Jun 2008
[2]Agenda
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2008Jun/0134.html
See also: [3]IRC log, previous [4]2007-06-19
[3] http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-irc
[4] http://www.w3.org/2008/06/19-rdfa-minutes
Attendees
Present
Ralph Swick, Shane McCarron, Manu Sporny, Mark Birbeck,
Steven Pemberton
Regrets
Ben Adida, Michael Hausenblas
Chair
Manu
Scribe
Ralph
Contents
* Topics
1. Action Review
2. Tools for RDFa authors
* Summary of Action Items
_____________________________________________________
Action Review
ACTION: Ben followup with Fabien on getting his RDFa GRDDL transform
transferred to W3C [recorded in
[9]http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01]
[CONTINUES]
[9] http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01
ACTION: Manu to reach out to Slashdot and attempt to get RDFa
integrated into Slashdot. [recorded in
[10]http://www.w3.org/2008/05/08-rdfa-minutes.html#action10] [DONE]
[10] http://www.w3.org/2008/05/08-rdfa-minutes.html#action10
Manu: I've been talking with Jamie McCarthy and he said he'd be more
than happy to accept a patch.
ACTION: Manu write the perl code for Slashdot [recorded in
[11]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
Shane: operator only notices RDFa in a page if one of our new
attributes is used in the page. This is a bug.
Manu: I believe this implementation is Elias' code
... may be a month or two behind the spec
Shane: perhaps they decided that this was a clever way to infer an
announcement
ACTION: Michael to create 'RDFa for uF users' on RDFa Wiki [recorded
in [12]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
[CONTINUES]
[12] http://www.w3.org/2008/03/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action12
ACTION: [DONE] Ralph confirm whether LGPL is ok with W3C [recorded
in [13]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
[13] http://www.w3.org/2008/06/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action03
Ralph: LGPL is OK for the XSLT, particularly since it's
non-normative
Tools for RDFa authors
Manu: we've received some criticism that we haven't provided enough
teaching tools
... we could create more wiki examples
Shane: to some extent it's about design patterns
... so one way to teach the technology is to show lots of best
practices design patterns
Shane: if you're a microformat user and want to transition to RDFa,
what would you need to do?
... these are two different audiences and we may need to address
them both
... might antagonize some, however
Mark: opinions can evolve over the years
... we've offered an outreached hand to show how microformats can
use parts of RDFa
... there's lots of momentum now [for RDFa]
... I'd suggest making sure we've covered all the non-microformat
examples first
... e.g. ones where there is no vocabulary
Manu: yes, there's some basic examples we don't yet have in the wiki
... these are things people tend to mark-up often
... effectively this is FOAF, vEvent; people+places+event
... chemistry might be interesting; depends on our goals
... definitely do chemistry if our goal is to help people who can't
currently use microformats
... other examples are higher priority if our goal is to address
large numbers of users
Mark: geolocation also nice and simple
<ShaneM> GEO location is dead easy, fwiw.
Shane: Dan Brickley's geolocation vocabulary "just works"
<ShaneM> There are some existing vocabularies that just work....
let's use them in our examples
Shane: the cool thing is that we didn't have to do anything special
in RDFa; the RDF vocabulary just worked
Manu: can we pick 5 or six to work on for the wiki and each pick
one?
<Steven> I did Vevent already
Manu: I'll take haudio plus one other, perhaps foaf or vevent
<Steven> Happy to expand
Mark: I'll take foaf
ACTION: Manu write haudio examples for wiki [recorded in
[14]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action06]
ACTION: Mark write foaf examples for wiki [recorded in
[15]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
ACTION: Steven write vevent examples for wiki [recorded in
[16]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]
<markbirbeck> [17]first-steps-in-rdfa-creating-foaf
[17] http://internet-apps.blogspot.com/2008/02/first-steps-in-rdfa-creating-foaf.html
ACTION: Shane write geolocation examples for wiki [recorded in
[18]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]
Shane: "the wiki" means which wiki?
Manu: [19]rdfa.info/wiki
[19] http://rdfa.info/wiki
<ShaneM> [20]http://rdfa.info/wiki/RDFa_Wiki
[20] http://rdfa.info/wiki/RDFa_Wiki
Manu: the short form we prefer to cite is [21]http://rdfa.info/wiki
... go to Tutorials; add examples there
[21] http://rdfa.info/wiki
Shane: I don't seem to have edit access
Manu: I'll check the permissions
ACTION: Manu check edit permissions on rdfa.info/wiki [recorded in
[22]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]
Shane: there is an hcard example already, but how about vcard ?
Mark: superceded by foaf?
Manu: some (large?) overlap but there are differences
Mark: but foaf has deployment and vcard really doesn't
Shane: how about RSS?
<Steven> +1 to RSS
<Steven> +100 to RSS in fact
Mark: SearchMonkey has an RSS+RDFa mode
ACTION: Ralph think about RSS+RDFa [recorded in
[23]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
<ShaneM> FWIW I tried to do some RSS annotation in this page:
[24]/MarkUp/Drafts/
[24] http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Drafts/
Manu: next can think about some javascript tools to generate the
markup for some of these
... would be nice to have a unified architecture to create these
wizards
... is there something already in existence we could use for this?
Mark: yes, we have an ajax library that would be suitable
Manu: extensible to other formats?
Mark: yes
... new version no longer requires a browser plug-in
... might be ready within the next month
ACTION: Mark create base wizard suitable for cloning [recorded in
[25]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
Manu: anything we want to work with MikeK on operator?
Shane: he's focusing right now on changing the way operators are
invoked
... I'd like to see a way to map in well-known handlers for RDF
vocabularies
... unfortunately they don't currently detect all RDFa
Manu: Mike has been very open to accepting patches
... he'd really like someone to collaborate with him
... anyone have any spare cycles to work with him?
Mark: my plan is to finish what I've been working on and document it
... once it's working, I will throw it open for discussion
... I have formats for jason, for sparql, ...
... I'd be happy to talk with Mike after I have this stable and
working
Manu: the demos you did, Mark, in your Google talk would make
wonderful 5-minute snips
... to help people 'get' RDFa and why it's so useful
Steven: Ben had some demos about adding RDFa to digg and others
... at least, I heard that he did
Mark: may be a demo that I did
<markbirbeck>
[26]http://code.google.com/p/ubiquity-rdfa/wiki/TutorialIntroduction
[26] http://code.google.com/p/ubiquity-rdfa/wiki/TutorialIntroduction
Manu: my suggestion is several 5-minute screencasts
<msporny> Manu: to create screencasts, I use xvidcap + Blender +
audacity
<Steven> +1
<Steven> Tidy for µf
Manu: what do you think about Ben's idea to create a web service
that accepts an HTML page containing microformat data and outputting
an RDFa formatted page?
Ralph µfTidy :)
Shane: we only define RDFa in the context of XHTML
... most µf users are using HTML, not XHTML
... tidy does an ok job of trying really hard to fix HTML, but it
can break it
... [unfortunately] there's a perception out there that XHTML isn't
sufficiently portable
Mark: I give priority to getting RDFa into drupal, flickr,
upcoming.org, etc.
Manu: I agree with Mark. Don't want to reignite a µf vs. RDFa war
... let's focus on getting people to use RDFa rather than converting
people who are using uf
Shane: one way to get a bigger win is to approach the tool and
environment maintainers
... let's help them
... operator is a priority for me because it enables the use of RDFa
... getting browsers to do something with RDF[a] will make RDF[a]
truly useful
Steven: travel sites can offer a link to book a hotel and earn money
... if someone books a flight or a hotel by following a link in a
browser
... RDFa provides a model for earning money this way
Manu: how about the MSIE folk?
Shane: MSIE doesn't really support XHTML yet
... however, it would not take very long to define an HTML profile
for RDFa
Steven: there's no reason why browsers couldn't recognize @xmlns:
even if they think the document is HTML
... it's just a token
... we don't really require namespace processing in the DOM
... the current javascript stuff is all working on the DOM already
Shane: @lang vs. @xml:lang
Mark: yeah, that's a tricky one
... MSIE actually disallows checking for @xml:lang, though it does
allow other @xml:* attributes
[adjourned]
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: Manu check edit permissions on rdfa.info/wiki
[recorded in
[27]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]
[NEW] ACTION: Manu write haudio examples for wiki [recorded in
[28]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: Manu write the perl code for Slashdot [recorded in
[29]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: Mark create base wizard suitable for cloning [recorded
in [30]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
[NEW] ACTION: Mark write foaf examples for wiki [recorded in
[31]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
[NEW] ACTION: Ralph think about RSS+RDFa [recorded in
[32]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
[NEW] ACTION: Shane write geolocation examples for wiki [recorded in
[33]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]
[NEW] ACTION: Steven write vevent examples for wiki [recorded in
[34]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/26-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]
[PENDING] ACTION: Ben followup with Fabien on getting his RDFa GRDDL
transform transferred to W3C [recorded in
[35]http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01]
[PENDING] ACTION: Michael to create 'RDFa for uF users' on RDFa Wiki
[recorded in
[36]http://www.w3.org/2008/03/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
[35] http://www.w3.org/2007/11/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action01
[36] http://www.w3.org/2008/03/13-rdfa-minutes.html#action12
[DONE] ACTION: Manu to reach out to Slashdot and attempt to get RDFa
integrated into Slashdot. [recorded in
[37]http://www.w3.org/2008/05/08-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]
[DONE] ACTION: Ralph confirm whether LGPL is ok with W3C [recorded
in [38]http://www.w3.org/2008/06/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
[37] http://www.w3.org/2008/05/08-rdfa-minutes.html#action10
[38] http://www.w3.org/2008/06/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action03
[End of minutes]
_____________________________________________________
Minutes formatted by David Booth's [39]scribe.perl version 1.133
([40]CVS log)
$Date: 2008/06/26 18:19:41 $
[39] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
[40] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
Received on Thursday, 26 June 2008 18:22:02 UTC