- From: Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org>
- Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2006 14:05:59 -0500
- To: public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org
- Cc: public-swd-wg@w3.org
The record of today's RDF in XHTML telecon is available [1]. A full text snapshot follows below. [1] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes Topics 1. Use Cases 2. XHTML 1.1 module status 3. Issues Summary of Action Items [NEW] ACTION: Ben add chem-bla-ics use case to a science use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action17] [NEW] ACTION: Ben add a forwarding pointer to http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues when the new wiki issues list page is created [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [NEW] ACTION: Ben look at Semantic Media Wiki use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action15] [NEW] ACTION: Mark produce RDFa XHTML 1.1 module and spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action06] [NEW] ACTION: Michael move the issues list to the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [NEW] ACTION: Michael review Mobile Device use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action16] [PENDING] ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [PENDING] ACTION: Elias start an FAQ [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [PENDING] ACTION: Elias to send email to list with use case from IBM [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10] [PENDING] ACTION: Mark produce more examples of applicability of n-ary relations from IPTC documents [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action08] [PENDING] ACTION: Mark write examples/tests of striping support [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action07] [PENDING] ACTION: Steven to put together sample XHTML2 doc with all mime type, etc.. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action09] [WITHDRAWN] ACTION: Elias to send by email examples of HTML markup that could be problematic with reification [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [DONE] ACTION: Ben update the issues list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [DONE] ACTION: Elias to look into sharing Open Office with task force [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action11] [DONE] ACTION: Mark to report on schema progress [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [DONE] ACTION: Michael to research extended usages of RDFa in Wikis [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] -Ralph ---- RDF-in-XHTML TF 18 Dec 2006 [2]Agenda [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2006Dec/0034.html See also: [3]IRC log, previous [4]2006-12-11 [3] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-irc [4] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes Attendees Present Michael Hausenblas, Ralph Swick, Ben Adida, Mark Birbeck Regrets Chair Ben Scribe Ralph Contents * [5]Topics 1. [6]Use Cases 2. [7]XHTML 1.1 module status 3. [8]Issues * [9]Summary of Action Items _____________________________________________________ Ben: I've revived discussion of hGRDDL on the GRDDL WG list; see "[10]Re: Review of testlist1#rdfa" ... the idea was that given lots of deployed microformats, perhaps it would be good to use GRDDL to transform them to RDFa to preserve rendering characteristics rather than directly to RDF [10] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-grddl-wg/2006Dec/0042.html Michael: I like the idea Michael: the Wiki seems to be dropping some updates in the [11]RecentChanges report ... I've edited [12]http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requiremen ts 5-6 times but only the most recent appears [11] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RecentChanges [12] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requirements <mhausenblas> [13]http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requiremen ts?action=info [13] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requirements?action=info Michael: the final version does show all the changes ... but the [14]recent changes page doesn't show all the changes [14] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RecentChanges ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in [15]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [CONTINUES] [15] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 Ben: I'm talking with Science Commons. Their use cases tend to be quite long so I'm working on distilling something down to the core ACTION: [DONE] Ben update the issues list [recorded in [16]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [16] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 Ben: shall we move the issues list to the wiki? Michael: I'll volunteer to move it ACTION: Michael move the issues list to the wiki [recorded in [17]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [17] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 <mhausenblas> [18]http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues [18] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues ACTION: Ben add a forwarding pointer to [19]http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues when the new wiki issues list page is done [recorded in [20]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [19] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues [20] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 ACTION: [DONE] Mark to report on schema progress [recorded in [21]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [21] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action05 Mark: I've talked with Shane and we're going to move forward using some templates we already have ACTION: Mark produce RDFa XHTML 1.1 module and spec [recorded in [22]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action06] [22] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action06 Mark: the module is already complete. I've enlisted Shane because of his understanding of XHTML modularization and his ability to write specs quickly Ben: does your current module have the latest striping and class decisions incorporated? Mark: no, not yet ... but it won't take long to bring it into line <benadida> looking at --> [23]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#ActionSummary [23] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#ActionSummary ACTION: [DONE] Elias to look into sharing Open Office with task force [recorded in [24]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action11] [24] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action11 ACTION: Elias to send by email examples of HTML markup that could be problematic with reification [recorded in [25]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [WITHDRAWN] [25] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action05 ACTION: Elias to send email to list with use case from IBM [recorded in [26]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10] [CONTINUES] [26] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10 ACTION: Elias start an FAQ [recorded in [27]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [CONTINUES] [27] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 ACTION: Mark produce more examples of applicability of n-ary relations from IPTC documents [recorded in [28]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action08] [CONTINUES] [28] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action08 Mark: I have to reproduce these from memory ACTION: Mark write examples/tests of striping support [recorded in [29]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action07] [CONTINUES] [29] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action07 ACTION: Steven to put together sample XHTML2 doc with all mime type, etc.. [recorded in [30]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action09] [CONTINUES] [30] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action09 Use Cases ACTION: Michael to research extended usages of RDFa in Wikis [recorded in [31]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [DONE] [31] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 Michael: I added several ... I tried to separate system metadata from others -> [32]Semantic Wiki use cases [32] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requirements#head-16b401eee1ad765055a4b133806e0fe799ecaadb Michael: does 8.1 capture what you were thinking, Ben? Ben: begins to capture ... in a semantic wiki there are triples all over the place; every link has a relationship Michael: I could go into more detail but I really wanted to show that without any user action there is already metadata there and RDFa could be provided Ben: can point out that all the triples from the semantic wiki can be included in the HTML Michael: I'm not so deep into semantic wikis to know if they want to go into client-side RDFa ... they're currently constructing RDF on the server side from the raw page source Ben: I need to resync on this; I've talked with Stefano Mazocchi ACTION: Ben look at Semantic Media Wiki use case [recorded in [33]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action15] [33] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action15 Michael: [34]PDF use case ... converting PDF to HTML can preserve the metadata using RDFa ... Mobile Device use case; I looked quickly at DELI and it seems feasible to create this on the fly [34] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa_Use_Cases_and_Requirements#head-fd77f6f46ed0abaa22c6f67728d9df884238e7bf Mark: doesn't seem quite the right way around; CC/PP is delivered by the client to the server Ralph: that is my understanding as well; the server does some processing based on the client describing its capabilities Mark: role attribute is used now a lot in the mobile community ... to describe, e.g. that a div is a navigation bar or a footer ... with CC/PP you know what the device can do so the server can optimize the placement of such things for the device Michael: Publishing use case ... to emphasize use in blogging community <MarkB_> On blogging: [35]http://chem-bla-ics.blogspot.com/2006_12_01_chem-bla-ics_archive .html [35] http://chem-bla-ics.blogspot.com/2006_12_01_chem-bla-ics_archive.html <MarkB_> This guy is talking about using RDFa for chemistry. Michael: might be nice to approach del.icio.us ACTION: Michael review Mobile Device use case [recorded in [36]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action16] [36] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action16 Mark: chem-bla-ics is an example of a focussed blog that is more than simply a personal page Ben: chemisty example might be better to go with Science Commons use case rather than just blogging ACTION: Ben add chem-bla-ics use case to a science use case [recorded in [37]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action17] [37] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action17 Mark: this also shows a need for namespaces Ben: copy-and-paste use case is Mark's Mark: yep, I'll work on it this week Ben: I've received suggestions that the use cases be more consumer-focussed and less publisher-focussed ... add more story lines, as the use cases are never just one-way ... next 2 Mondays are holidays. Are we able to meet later during the week of 1 January? Mark: I'll be working off and on, but perhaps we can communicate more by email Ben: next telecon will be 8 Jan then; we'll need to have a complete document by then to send to the WG for the 9th Ralph: I'd like to see more detail in story lines in the use case document. Most of the detail is currently buried in the markup. This works for us but not for the general reader. Ben: yes, I hope to flesh out the story lines following the GRDDL example Ralph: from the use cases, we should be able to distill out requirements ... summarized in a "list of requirements." <mhausenblas> [38]http://www.w3.org/TR/webont-req/ [38] http://www.w3.org/TR/webont-req/ Michael: where are our requirements? they should be called out specifically, as in the OWL UCR document Ralph: I agree but I'm pessimistic about the available time Michael: so we shouldn't claim that this document has requirements yet XHTML 1.1 module status Ben: we have Mark's update ... is it likely to be ready by 8 Jan? <benadida> --> [39]http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues [39] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues Mark: I hope so -- I'm keeping an eye out for Shane Issues Ben: I want to particularly highlight issues 4&7 role & class) -> [40]Role Attribute [40] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues#role Mark: I'm happy with the proposal Michael: whatever we decide needs to go into the RDFa syntax document soon Ralph: I'm generally persuaded by Mark's arguments Ben: we should confirm Steven's agreement ... issue 12 - CURIEs in predicate attributes ... I'm of the opinion that these should be CURIE/QName only, and not try to add [] syntax Ralph: the further we get from current HTML practice the harder we make our lives Ben: sounds like we have consensus for just CURIE only Ralph: I need to raise red flags about presuming a CURIE solution, especially for XHTML 1.1 Mark: we don't need to drop CURIEs just because of XHTML 1.1 Ben: issue 18 nested meta and link ... proposed resolution is to look up the tree for a meta containing @about ... in Bob Ducharme's example in the use case, do we agree that the interpretation is as Bob suggests? Making statements about the same subject Michael: I have a problem with reification in general. I doubt it's wise to include it in the first version. Mark: this isn't reification ... we don't get reification until we put meta inside non-meta [adjourned] Summary of Action Items [NEW] ACTION: Ben add chem-bla-ics use case to a science use case [recorded in [41]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action17] [NEW] ACTION: Ben add a forwarding pointer to [42]http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues when the new wiki issues list page is created [recorded in [43]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [NEW] ACTION: Ben look at Semantic Media Wiki use case [recorded in [44]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action15] [NEW] ACTION: Mark produce RDFa XHTML 1.1 module and spec [recorded in [45]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action06] [NEW] ACTION: Michael move the issues list to the wiki [recorded in [46]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [NEW] ACTION: Michael review Mobile Device use case [recorded in [47]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action16] [PENDING] ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in [48]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [PENDING] ACTION: Elias start an FAQ [recorded in [49]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [PENDING] ACTION: Elias to send email to list with use case from IBM [recorded in [50]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10] [PENDING] ACTION: Mark produce more examples of applicability of n-ary relations from IPTC documents [recorded in [51]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action08] [PENDING] ACTION: Mark write examples/tests of striping support [recorded in [52]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action07] [PENDING] ACTION: Steven to put together sample XHTML2 doc with all mime type, etc.. [recorded in [53]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action09] [WITHDRAWN] ACTION: Elias to send by email examples of HTML markup that could be problematic with reification [recorded in [54]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [DONE] ACTION: Ben update the issues list [recorded in [55]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [DONE] ACTION: Elias to look into sharing Open Office with task force [recorded in [56]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action11] [DONE] ACTION: Mark to report on schema progress [recorded in [57]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action05] [DONE] ACTION: Michael to research extended usages of RDFa in Wikis [recorded in [58]http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action03] [41] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action17 [42] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-current-issues [43] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 [44] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action15 [45] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action06 [46] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 [47] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/18-htmltf-minutes.html#action16 [48] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 [49] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action04 [50] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10 [51] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action08 [52] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action07 [53] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action09 [54] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action05 [55] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 [56] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action11 [57] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action05 [58] http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action03 [End of minutes] _____________________________________________________ Minutes formatted by David Booth's [59]scribe.perl version 1.127 ([60]CVS log) $Date: 2006/12/18 18:58:25 $ [59] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm [60] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
Received on Monday, 18 December 2006 19:06:30 UTC