W3C

Weekly DAWG Meeting

20 Jun 2006

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Kendall_Clark, AndyS, DanC, +1.650.372.aaaa, EliasT, FredZ, SteveH
Regrets
ericP, LeeF, libby
Chair
kendallclark
Scribe
EliasT

Contents


<kendallclark> shit

<kendallclark> i think i forgot to tell zakim about the new meeting time

<kendallclark> i wonder how badly that screws us?

<kendallclark> ericP: you here?

<AndyS> EricP sent his regrets

<ericP> EricP is in a f2f. DanC agreed to represent W3

<scribe> Scribe: EliasT

<kendallclark> DanC: thanks

<kendallclark> DanC: can you remind me of the email address to which I should send email about schedule changes?

<kendallclark> SteveH: are you there?

<SteveH> kendallclark, aye, sorry, didnt relaise what the time was

<kendallclark> are you calling in today?

<SteveH> will be online shortly

<kendallclark> uri?

any regrets?

<DanC> comments from PFPS 22 Feb http://www.w3.org/mid/20060222.185654.133907622.pfps@research.bell-labs.com , noted in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/crq349#obj

<kendallclark> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006AprJun/0162.html

<kendallclark> Amended, thus: Present: KendallC, AFS, EricP, FredZ, PatH, EliasT, LeeF

<kendallclark> Possibly partial list of attendees

<AndyS> Poss AOBs: Test suite? Other implementations for CR?

<kendallclark> argh, lost network...

FredZ: When does the group think we'll finish?

DanC: We are dependent on XQuery and that's not finished.

kendallclark: After July holidays, he'll be responsible to announce if there's a chance to conclude by November.

convene, rollcall, recruit scribe, approve minutes

<DanC> (sounds like Andy is asking to discuss the implementation report http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/imp39 )

Meetings in July

Review MIME Type registration & comments

<kendallclark> thanks

+xml

<DanC> PROPOSED: to justify the json mime type by noting that JSON might be used to serialized RDF abstract syntax, so app/json doesn't distinguish the results format

<DanC> PROPOSED: to justify the json results mime type by noting that JSON might be used to serialized RDF abstract syntax, so app/json doesn't distinguish the results format

AndyS: reminds us that a possible JSON RDF Graph encoding convention that would sparql-results+json format.

<kendallclark> RESOLVED

EliasT: seconds.

<kendallclark> ACTION: EliasT to respond to Mark Baker's comments re: MIME type as we just resolved [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action01]

Function namespace proposal

http://dowhatimean.net/2006/05/rdfjson

-> RDF/JSON using SPARQL REsults Format in JSON for Graph encoding.

OPTIONALs

kendallclark: Looking for status from OPTIONALS discussion between FredZ, PatH, ericP and others.

FredZ: I have been having a private discussion with PatH, ericP and AndyS

KendallClark: I would like more of the traffic in the public mailing list to be able to track it better.

AndyS: He's not proposing changing semantics in CR
... looking more for editorial at the moment.

FredZ: You have seen my comments, what do you think?

AndyS: I find the grammar fixes/tweaks to be ok.
... we need to fix bnodes, blank nodes, blank labels.
... but I need to go more through your comments first.

<kendallclark> Tying things *more* closely to the grammar though is at cross-purposes w/ the comments about semantics from the guys at Pontifical U in Chile, though -- I think...

<kendallclark> Isn't that thrust in conflict with:

<kendallclark> 1) The evaluation process of a language should be directed by a

<kendallclark> clear semantics and not by the language grammar

<kendallclark> (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2006Apr/0023.html).

DanC: We currently don't specify some connections between the semantics and the grammar.

FredZ, can you please type this?

<DanC> { P1 } UNION { P2 } OPTIONAL { P3 }

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to note app/xml doesn't distinguish RDF/XML from sparql-results and to think out loud about the explicit mapping from grammar to semantics

AndyS: We can add references to grammar rules in the definition sections to explicitly state the connection and hope that our users can benefit from that.

<kendallclark> Steve?

<SteveH> yes, im following, but I implement OPTIONAL as prefix, not infeix

<SteveH> (bug)

<SteveH> steve.harris@garlik.com

<kendallclark> ACTION: FredZ to write an email w/ a test for the test suite re: { P1 } UNION { P2 } OPTIONAL { P3 } [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action02]

<AndyS> c.f. http://sparql.org/validator.html

9 June comments from Oracle

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to note relationships between Oracle 9 Jun stuff and issues

<DanC> an open issue is a promise to make a decision. http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/issues

<DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006AprJun/0117.html

<DanC> comment on A.7 "Grammar"

<scribe> ACTION: KendallClark to reopen punctuationSyntax to take up commas in SELECT clause. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action03]

<DanC> I suggest KC think about marking http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/issues#nestedOptionals re-opened

<kendallclark> a prerogative I'm largely scared of :)

<kendallclark> danc: based on which message, please?

<DanC> well, based on today's agenda, for example, and the question you asked to SteveH

<kendallclark> yep, fair enough...

<kendallclark> ACTION: KendallC to reopen nestedOptionals [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action04]

<DanC> I could probably find 3 to 6 public-dawg-comments messages on optionals

Action Items

<DanC> KC leans toward a new issue rather than nestedOptionals

<scribe> ACTION: take up new issue concatenated nestedOptional [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action05]

<DanC> ACTION 4 = KendallC to open an issue around optionals

Note PFPS's outstanding comments

<DanC> PFPS 22 Feb

<DanC> [[

<DanC> C2.38: This is very misleading. SPARQL matching does indeed restrict the bnode

<DanC> in query results to be bnodes from the RDF graph, but not in a useful way. For

<DanC> example,

<DanC> ?x ex:a ex:b .

<DanC> matches against

<DanC> _:a ex:a _:b .

<DanC> with two results for ?x, at least as far as I can determine.

<DanC> ]]

<DanC> ACTION: DanC to review PFPS's comments for more test cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action06]

<kendallclark> ACTION: EliasT to turn C2.38 in PFPS's message into a test case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action07]

Implementation Report

<DanC> implementation report stub

<kendallclark> Test suite, show coverage of language features by 2 or more implementations -- our CR exit criteria

<SteveH> things aren't too bad for me at the moment, I can do a bit on the tests

<SteveH> sure

<Zakim> EliasT, you wanted to ask about how do I got about fixing some test cases: approved and not.

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to note my favorite precedent: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/impls http://www.w3.org/2003/08/owl-systems/test-results-out

<DanC> EARL - the Evaluation And Report Language http://www.w3.org/2001/03/earl/

<SteveH> the test generator should use SPARQL too...

<SteveH> *result generator

<AndyS> August 1.

<SteveH> 50/50

<DanC> PROPOSED: to meet 27 Jun 14:30Z, DanC to scribe

<DanC> so RESOLVED

<SteveH> bye

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: DanC to review PFPS's comments for more test cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: EliasT to respond to Mark Baker's comments re: MIME type as we just resolved [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: EliasT to turn C2.38 in PFPS's message into a test case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action07]
[NEW] ACTION: FredZ to write an email w/ a test for the test suite re: { P1 } UNION { P2 } OPTIONAL { P3 } [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: KendallC to reopen nestedOptionals [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: KendallClark to reopen punctuationSyntax to take up commas in SELECT clause. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: take up new issue concatenated nestedOptional [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/20-dawg-minutes.html#action05]
 
[End of minutes]