Re: W3C [PBG] Publishing Business Group Agenda December 2024

I also will not be able to make any of the calls, and echo Wendy’s concerns around vendor implementation clarity and concerns.

Leonards statement that ‘ The law simply states that there needs to be method(s) for allowing for the declaration of opt-out, but not that every training system has to respect every method of declaration.’ jumped out at me.  If there are legal and legislative requirement around this then the status of the TDM as a community group report does need consideration.  If (as I suspect) an elevation of the status of that ‘specification’ is needed, now is the time as we recharter the working group.


Rick Johnson | Co-Founder and Vice President of Solutions Engineering and Accessibility
VitalSource Technologies, LLC
get.vitalsource.com <https://get.vitalsource.com/>



From: Reid, Wendy <wendy.reid@rakuten.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 26, 2024 at 2:32 PM
To: Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>, Laurent Le Meur <laurent@edrlab.org>, McCloy-Kelley, Liisa (she/her) <lmccloy-kelley@penguinrandomhouse.com>
Cc: W3C Publishing Business Group <public-publishingbg@w3.org>, Daihei Shiohama <shiohama@mediado.jp>, Cristina Mussinelli - Fondazione LIA <cristina.mussinelli@fondazionelia.org>
Subject: Re: W3C [PBG] Publishing Business Group Agenda December 2024
Unfortunately I am going to miss the early session due to a conflict, but I do want to emphasize how important the last question is in the TDM discussion, What do you expect recipients to do with this info?

Recipients of TDM declarations (like ebook vendors) are now being asked what we are doing with them once they are received, but as of right now it’s not clear what is expected of us, or what impact this might have on the user experience of the content. We’re also faced with the potential requirement of needing to implement multiple formats of this declaration, which is fine but we need to know what is coming, what kind of adoption there is, and what the expectations are. I don’t know if outreach has been done with industry groups to communicate on this topic, but I think that is also key to ensuring there’s clear communication and implementation.

Another topic I think the business group should consider is that TDM Rep is currently published as a W3C community group report, which means it has no formal standing in W3C and it hasn’t gone through the rigour of the publication and horizontal review processes. While I’m sure the CG is going to be careful about how it updates and maintains the document, anyone who implements it should be aware of the potential risk to implementing a proposed standard that hasn’t been reviewed for potential impacts on security, privacy, accessibility, and web architecture. This is not to say that TDM Rep must go through W3C, if there is a more appropriate pathway for it that should be explored, but I do want to make sure the business group considers it.

Thanks,
Wendy

From: Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>
Date: Tuesday, November 26, 2024 at 9:12 AM
To: Laurent Le Meur <laurent@edrlab.org>, McCloy-Kelley, Liisa (she/her) <lmccloy-kelley@penguinrandomhouse.com>
Cc: W3C Publishing Business Group <public-publishingbg@w3.org>, Daihei Shiohama <shiohama@mediado.jp>, Cristina Mussinelli - Fondazione LIA <cristina.mussinelli@fondazionelia.org>
Subject: Re: W3C [PBG] Publishing Business Group Agenda December 2024

[EXTERNAL] This message comes from an external organization.
It is actually not clear, legally, who gets to choose the method(s) that are used – which is why we continue to meet (see you in BRU next week 😉 ).   The law simply states that there needs to be method(s) for allowing for the declaration of opt-out, but not that every training system has to respect every method of declaration.

I am hopeful that we can settle on a small enough subset of options – both location and unit based – that we will get to where all want to be.

Leonard

From: Laurent Le Meur <laurent@edrlab.org>
Date: Tuesday, November 26, 2024 at 7:20 AM
To: McCloy-Kelley, Liisa (she/her) <lmccloy-kelley@penguinrandomhouse.com>
Cc: W3C Publishing Business Group <public-publishingbg@w3.org>, Daihei Shiohama <shiohama@mediado.jp>, Cristina Mussinelli - Fondazione LIA <cristina.mussinelli@fondazionelia.org>
Subject: Re: W3C [PBG] Publishing Business Group Agenda December 2024

EXTERNAL: Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.


Hi,

I won't be able to participate in this call (I'll be in Bruxelles to discuss TDM opt-out with other copyright owners and AI actors).

You'll find an up-to-date list of known adopters of TDM Rep at https://w3c.github.io/tdm-reservation-protocol/docs/adopters.html .

So far, the prominent AI actors have yet to start obeying these rules. This puts them in an illegal position vs. Article 4 of the EU CDSM, but I didn't hear about legal actions from publishers on this ground. It may change after the start of the EU AI Directive. See https://w3c.github.io/tdm-reservation-protocol/docs/eu-act-extracts.html.


Re. DRM and Accessibility, as you know, is of great interest to EDRLab. Happy to have a separate discussion.

Best regards
Laurent




Le 19 nov. 2024 à 18:28, McCloy-Kelley, Liisa (she/her) <lmccloy-kelley@penguinrandomhouse.com> a écrit :

Hello Publishing Business Group members,

Please find below the agenda for the next PBG calls for Americas/Europe on Tuesday, December 3rd, 2024,  to be held at [0] with joining instructions at [1] and for Americas/Asia on Tuesday, December 3rd, 2024/Wednesday, December 4th, 2024 to be held at [2] with joining instructions at [3], via the Zoom links in the PBG Calendar events linked above and the ics files attached.


W3C IRC: http://irc.w3.org/<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http*3A*2F*2Firc.w3.org*2F&data=02*7C01*7CLAUDRAIN*40hachette-livre.fr*7Cf1f4b36643b342c072ff08d79c8273be*7Cf881a2c50a89483181b1c7846c49594d*7C0*7C0*7C637149956414432943&sdata=fRlwrrNqKLfWvIy6pt4d2F379ZmHqDYjXD4yiFM1dp0*3D&reserved=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!PH0vZokp8wwQNw!25oU4tNXeepf6MLFJgmEgrCcS44aixe3HOVLuXI9tycKoDi7ROE_9FLthRwLKTxc53z3AI5uHfP5NaRlvOLMMK0KUUfJUByOcTr-2Wk2DA$>  (IRC channel #pbg).


Agenda:

  *   Adoption of TDM Protocol

     *   Who has adopted it?

     *   Are you using it in both epub and ONIX?
     *   Are you putting in a policy statement or just an opt-out?
     *   What do you expect recipients to do with this info?


  *   DRM and Accessibility

     *    Discuss how DRM and accessibility are not interdependent


  *   Update on EPUB Maintenance WG and New Charter

     *   Discuss what may be included in upcoming work
     *   https://w3c.github.io/publ-maintenance-wg-charter/



  *   Upcoming Meetings and discussions planned for 2025



Please send along any other topics you want to discuss.

We look forward to a great discussion!
On behalf of PBG co-chairs,
Liisa McCloy-Kelley, Daihei Shiohama and Cristina Mussinelli




[0] https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=W3C+PBG+Meeting+-+Americas%2FEurope&iso=20241203T12&p1=179&ah=1



[1] https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/2891b5a9-53dd-4def-ad51-f587e05e2cb9/


[2] https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=W3C+PBG+Meeting+Americas%2FAsia&iso=20241203T19&p1=179&ah=1


[3] https://www.w3.org/events/meetings/50fbb58c-ac3a-441b-95ea-48b4f59915bd/






<PBG_Americas-Asia.ics><PBG_Americas-Europe.ics>