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Fwd: 48-Hour Call for Consensus (CfC): Support for Audiobook

From: Charles LaPierre <charlesl@benetech.org>
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2019 14:58:24 +0000
To: W3C Publishing Working Group <public-publ-wg@w3.org>
CC: "Reid, Wendy" <wendy.reid@rakuten.com>, Garth Conboy <garth@google.com>, Avneesh Singh <avneesh.sg@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <41F2FFD3-E21C-4C1D-8C75-2852E2D10067@benetech.org>
Cross Posting for the Publishing WG
Charles

Begin forwarded message:

From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net<mailto:janina@rednote.net>>
Subject: Re: 48-Hour Call for Consensus (CfC): Support for Audiobook
Date: October 15, 2019 at 7:54:29 AM PDT
To: Ivan Herman <ivan@w3.org<mailto:ivan@w3.org>>
Cc: Avneesh Singh <avneesh.sg@gmail.com<mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com>>, "White, Jason J" <jjwhite@ets.org<mailto:jjwhite@ets.org>>, Marisa DeMeglio <marisa.demeglio@gmail.com<mailto:marisa.demeglio@gmail.com>>, Wendy Reid <wendy.reid@rakuten.com<mailto:wendy.reid@rakuten.com>>, Accessible Platform Architectures Administration <public-apa-admin@w3.org<mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org>>, Matt Garrish <matt.garrish@gmail.com<mailto:matt.garrish@gmail.com>>, Garth Conboy <garth@google.com<mailto:garth@google.com>>, Judy Brewer <jbrewer@w3.org<mailto:jbrewer@w3.org>>, Michael Cooper <cooper@w3.org<mailto:cooper@w3.org>>
Resent-From: public-apa-admin@w3.org<mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org>

Colleagues:

The APA teleconference agenda for Wednesday is now available here:


http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-apa/2019Oct/0018.html



This is my invitation for all Dpub folks who can make this call to join.
Hopefully, we can use this call to resolve any lingering concerns and
agree on what the spec needs to say regarding the not yet finished sync
standard.

Best,

Janina

Janina Sajka writes:
Thanks, Ivan. That would also be my preference.

So, we need now work out what additional language would be helpful.

Janina

Ivan Herman writes:


On 15 Oct 2019, at 14:02, Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net<mailto:janina@rednote.net>> wrote:

Explicitly adding Judy and Michael as cc:

Thank you, Ivan, for this response.

I am proposing to make this CfC the top APA agendum on our regular
weekly teleconference, Wednesday at Noon (Boston), 1600Z. I suspect
there will be the need for a checkin beyond this email thread, so
propose to do that on the APA call this week.


Meanwhile, do I understand you to be advising pulling references to the
sync spec from the Audiobook spec Dpub is proposing to move to CR?

Or, should we leave it in with additional notes, e.g. "unfinished," "may
change and adversely impact implementations," etc., something like that?


Definitely leave it in the document as a non-normative reference from a non-normative section. A note saying something like "this specification may change in the future".

Thx

Ivan


Personally, I think those are the only two options, but I may be
misunderstanding things.

Best,

Janina

Ivan Herman writes:
My apologies not to have answered earlier.

Jason raised the issues on the normative or non-normative nature of the Sync Media specification. Let me reflect on that specific question:

- Putting the Sync Media specification on a recommendation track does not seem to be possible for now. That document is not really publication specific but would be useful on the Web in general (which is a good thing!) so I am not sure it should be done in the Publication Working Group. It would probably deserve its own Working Group whose possible creation is a different process.
- Even if we decided to do this on the Publication Working Group, it would be too late. The WG's charter runs out in about 10 months, there is simply no time. Let alone the fact that I am not sure this could be done without rechartering, i.e., it would be a stretch to use the current charter.  If we do recharter the Publishing Working Group (which is not a given) we could think about adding this work to the charter, but that is, even in the best of worlds, way down the line, and should not be taken into account for the Audiobooks Recommendation.
- It is perfectly fine, on the other hand, to refer to a CG report from a non-normative section of a specification. In fact, the audiobook document already does that to the Lightweight Packaging specification. I.e., I do not see a problem with the direction the Working Group is proposing on that.

I would therefore propose to close (or postpone?) this particular issue as far as the Audiobook's a11y review is concerned. I think we would all be happy to see the work on sync media continued and, if that happens, a future version of the Audiobooks specification may "upgrade" the reference to a Rec version of the sync media specification.

Thanks!

Cheers

Ivan

On 11 Oct 2019, at 08:20, Avneesh Singh <avneesh.sg@gmail.com<mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com>> wrote:


It is worth mentioning that in addition to pointing towards sync media, the audio books specifications also allows pointing to text equivalent in HTML files. Copying the relevant section from the latest draft of audio books specs. So, we provide two ways for fulfilling accessibility requirements, sync media as well as text in HTML.

Alternatively, a content creator can provide the text equivalent as HTML [[html]] resources in the resources.

                  {
                      "@context" : ["https://schema.org <https://schema.org/>" <https://schema.org <https://schema.org/>"/>, "https://www.w3.org/ns/pub-context <https://www.w3.org/ns/pub-context>"] <https://www.w3.org/ns/pub-context%22] <https://www.w3.org/ns/pub-context%22]>>,
                      "type"         : "Audiobook",
                      "url"      : "https://publisher.example.org/janeeyre <https://publisher.example.org/janeeyre>" <https://publisher.example.org/janeeyre%22 <https://publisher.example.org/janeeyre%22>>,
                      "name"     : "Jane Eyre",
                      "readingOrder" : {
                          "type"    : "LinkedResource",
                          "url"   : "audio/part001.wav#0",
                          "encodingFormat" : "audio/vnd-wav",
                          "name"  : "Chapter 1",
                          "duration" : "457.931",
                          "alternate" : "text/part001-1.html"
                      },

With regards
Avneesh
From: Marisa DeMeglio <>
Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 5:34
To: White, Jason J <>
Cc: Reid, Wendy <> ; Avneesh Singh <> ; Janina Sajka <> ; Accessible Platform Architectures Administration <> ; Matt-Garrish <> ; Ivan Herman <> ; Garth Conboy <>
Subject: Re: 48-Hour Call for Consensus (CfC): Support for Audiobook

In looking over the Sync Media section in the Audiobooks spec, I found something I had a question about so I raised an issue [1]; I don’t think it affects the APA review though so didn’t want to bog down this thread.

As for whether Sync Media can be referenced non-normatively by a rec-track specification, I would defer to Ivan. I hope it can.

Sync media will have a closer-to-final draft posted very soon, using the same URL referenced by Audiobooks.

Marisa

1. https://github.com/w3c/audiobooks/issues/27 <https://github.com/w3c/audiobooks/issues/27> <https://github.com/w3c/audiobooks/issues/27 <https://github.com/w3c/audiobooks/issues/27>>


On Oct 10, 2019, at 11:44, White, Jason J < <>jjwhite@ets.org<mailto:jjwhite@ets.org> <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org> <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org>>> wrote:

Thank you for the editorial corrections and for the revised link.

-----Original Message-----
From: Reid, Wendy < <>wendy.reid@rakuten.com<mailto:wendy.reid@rakuten.com> <mailto:wendy.reid@rakuten.com> <mailto:wendy.reid@rakuten.com <mailto:wendy.reid@rakuten.com>>>
Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2019 2:25 PM
To: Avneesh Singh < <>avneesh.sg@gmail.com<mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com> <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com> <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com>>>; White, Jason J < <>jjwhite@ets.org<mailto:jjwhite@ets.org> <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org> <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org <mailto:jjwhite@ets.org>>>; Janina Sajka < <>janina@rednote.net<mailto:janina@rednote.net> <mailto:janina@rednote.net><mailto:janina@rednote.net <mailto:janina@rednote.net>>>; Accessible Platform Architectures Administration < <>public-apa-admin@w3.org<mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org> <mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org> <mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org <mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org>>>
Cc: Matt-Garrish < <>matt.garrish@gmail.com<mailto:matt.garrish@gmail.com> <mailto:matt.garrish@gmail.com> <mailto:matt.garrish@gmail.com <mailto:matt.garrish@gmail.com>>>; Ivan Herman < <>ivan@w3.org<mailto:ivan@w3.org> <mailto:ivan@w3.org> <mailto:ivan@w3.org <mailto:ivan@w3.org>>>; 'Garth Conboy' < <>garth@google.com<mailto:garth@google.com> <mailto:garth@google.com><mailto:garth@google.com <mailto:garth@google.com>>>; Marisa < <>marisa.demeglio@gmail.com<mailto:marisa.demeglio@gmail.com> <mailto:marisa.demeglio@gmail.com> <mailto:marisa.demeglio@gmail.com <mailto:marisa.demeglio@gmail.com>>>
Subject: Re: 48-Hour Call for Consensus (CfC): Support for Audiobook

Hello APA,

Thank you for the review, I have amended the errors mentioned and they will be on github in the next few days then published. For an accurate URL to Sync media, you can find it now at https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Faudiobooks&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=4iDkGvSPdy%2FaiCju1%2FKNN8Sp7BaJDzhvJanoafAmOS4%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Faudiobooks&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=4iDkGvSPdy%2FaiCju1%2FKNN8Sp7BaJDzhvJanoafAmOS4%3D&amp;reserved=0> <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Faudiobooks&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=4iDkGvSPdy%2FaiCju1%2FKNN8Sp7BaJDzhvJanoafAmOS4%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Faudiobooks&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=4iDkGvSPdy%2FaiCju1%2FKNN8Sp7BaJDzhvJanoafAmOS4%3D&amp;reserved=0>> .

Please let me know if there are any other questions or revisions needed!

Thanks,
Wendy

On 2019-10-10, 1:49 AM, "Avneesh Singh" < <>avneesh.sg@gmail.com<mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com> <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com> <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com <mailto:avneesh.sg@gmail.com>>> wrote:

 Thanks Jason,

 I am providing my comments inline and copying to the PWG chairs and Editors
 for further discussions. Also copying chair of sync media CG.

 I would like to raise both editorial and substantive matters.

 I note the following two editorial issues in the draft:

 Section 2.1.1: "Resources within the bounds of a [sic] Audiobook" should
 read "an Audiobook".

 Section 2.2.8: the link to "Synchronized Media" gives me a 404 error.

 Avneesh: Request to PWG editors to look into these.

 More substantively, section 2.2.8 is non-normative. However, it "recommends"
 use of the Synchronized Media Note to create an accessible audio book -
 that's the apparently broken link. Moreover, shouldn't this "Synchronized
 Media" note be on a W3C Recommendation track, and cited here as a normative
 reference as the Web standard for achieving the desired synchronization?
 Alternatively, I suppose it could be cited non-normatively as work in
 progress, if this is allowed by W3C publication policy - but it should still
 be on a Rec track if it's effectively a specification.

 Avneesh: Sync media is a CG at this time. This is why we have non-normative
 reference to it. I believe that W3C process allows it.
 There is a possibility that sync media can go to rec track in future, but
 the PWG charter ends in mid of next year, so it cannot happen during this
 short time period.
 Copying Ivan and Marisa for further comments.

 With regards
 Avneesh

 -----Original Message-----
 From: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net<mailto:janina@rednote.net> <mailto:janina@rednote.net> <>>
 Sent: Wednesday, October 9, 2019 2:13 PM
 To: Accessible Platform Architectures Administration
 <public-apa-admin@w3.org<mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org> <mailto:public-apa-admin@w3.org> <>>
 Subject: 48-Hour Call for Consensus (CfC): Support for Audiobook

 Manifest
 Reply-To:

 Colleagues:

 With apologies for the double posting, the first with an old Subject.

 This is a Call for Consensus (CfC) to the Accessible Platform Architectures
 (APA) Working Group. Digital Publishing is seeking our agreement to publish
 the audiobook profile for publication manifest as a W3C specification and
 believe it is ready to move to Candidate Recommendation status.

 https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Ftr%2Faudiobooks%2F&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=tN92KxNUZ%2FkbE%2FS4D%2BJCpFMBBSbXZnfJeu7ctqcQpm0%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Ftr%2Faudiobooks%2F&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=tN92KxNUZ%2FkbE%2FS4D%2BJCpFMBBSbXZnfJeu7ctqcQpm0%3D&amp;reserved=0> <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Ftr%2Faudiobooks%2F&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=tN92KxNUZ%2FkbE%2FS4D%2BJCpFMBBSbXZnfJeu7ctqcQpm0%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Ftr%2Faudiobooks%2F&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=tN92KxNUZ%2FkbE%2FS4D%2BJCpFMBBSbXZnfJeu7ctqcQpm0%3D&amp;reserved=0>>

 I have reviewed this specification as my Action 2209, but our wider group
 consensus is being sought.

 ***ACTION TO TAKE***

 This CfC is now open for objection, comment, as well as statements of
 support via email. Silence will be interpreted as support, though messages
 of support are certainly welcome.

 If you object to this proposed action, or have comments concerning this
 proposal, please respond by replying on list to this message no later than
 23:59 (Midnight) Boston Time, Friday 11 October.

 Janina

 NOTE: This Call for Consensus is being conducted in accordance with the APA
 Decision Policy published at:

 https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2FAPA%2Fdecision-policy&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=MYLneo4CzyLocbW1zMEZl62eRdvQLMXT9U5XiPWf0OU%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2FAPA%2Fdecision-policy&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=MYLneo4CzyLocbW1zMEZl62eRdvQLMXT9U5XiPWf0OU%3D&amp;reserved=0> <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2FAPA%2Fdecision-policy&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=MYLneo4CzyLocbW1zMEZl62eRdvQLMXT9U5XiPWf0OU%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FWAI%2FAPA%2Fdecision-policy&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7C094a877ac40548b73c2e08d74daf2641%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637063286984969159&amp;sdata=MYLneo4CzyLocbW1zMEZl62eRdvQLMXT9U5XiPWf0OU%3D&amp;reserved=0>>


 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 Janina Sajka

 Linux Foundation Fellow
 Executive Chair, Accessibility
 Workgroup:https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=DI7FiJDLCnWKxZvLAmPwY6xn1UtIW%2F1Xa1dz6sQc62o%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=DI7FiJDLCnWKxZvLAmPwY6xn1UtIW%2F1Xa1dz6sQc62o%3D&amp;reserved=0> <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=DI7FiJDLCnWKxZvLAmPwY6xn1UtIW%2F1Xa1dz6sQc62o%3D&amp;reserved=0 <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fa11y.org&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=DI7FiJDLCnWKxZvLAmPwY6xn1UtIW%2F1Xa1dz6sQc62o%3D&amp;reserved=0>>

 The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
 Chair, Accessible Platform
 Architectureshttps://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=pzUZbB7ua%2F3gVeed505vWT5dAbScwnMXipwOJBXf5zs%3D&amp;reserved=0 <architectureshttps://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=pzUZbB7ua%2F3gVeed505vWT5dAbScwnMXipwOJBXf5zs%3D&amp;reserved=0> <architectureshttps://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=pzUZbB7ua%2F3gVeed505vWT5dAbScwnMXipwOJBXf5zs%3D&amp;reserved=0 <architectureshttps://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2Fwai%2Fapa&amp;data=02%7C01%7Cjjwhite%40ets.org%7Cd4a3780cb7e440ac897808d74ce45b2f%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637062415973533472&amp;sdata=pzUZbB7ua%2F3gVeed505vWT5dAbScwnMXipwOJBXf5zs%3D&amp;reserved=0>>



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----
Ivan Herman, W3C
Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
mobile: +31-641044153
ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704


--

Janina Sajka

Linux Foundation Fellow
Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup: http://a11y.org <http://a11y.org/>

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa <http://www.w3.org/wai/apa>

----
Ivan Herman, W3C
Home: http://www.w3.org/People/Ivan/
mobile: +31-641044153
ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/0000-0003-0782-2704


--

Janina Sajka

Linux Foundation Fellow
Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup: http://a11y.org

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa




--

Janina Sajka

Linux Foundation Fellow
Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup: http://a11y.org

The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
Chair, Accessible Platform Architectures http://www.w3.org/wai/apa




Received on Tuesday, 15 October 2019 14:58:34 UTC

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