Re: PROV-ISSUE-1 (define-resource): Definition for concept 'Resource' [Provenance Terminology]

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On May 24, 2011, at 10:13 AM, Paul Groth <pgroth@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Jun, all:
> 
> I don't think we are restricted by our charter to describing provenance of only web objects. I think it would be a shame if we couldn't describe the provenance of objects in the physical world.
> 
> Personally, I think the term "resource" has a particular meaning within the Web Architecture (as graham put up on the wiki) and it would be nice to use that term with the same meaning.
> 
> Maybe we need another concept of something that is more general than a resource?

What about 'Entity'?  I agree with the idea that we may want to separate the web concept of resource from the provenance model concept of any thing which can have provenance.

> 
> But then I wonder what, if anything, *might* not be identifiable by a URI?

Another question, must the URI be resolvable?

> 
> In general, we need a pointing mechanism to be able to talk about the provenance of something.  I don't think the web architecture definition precludes the use of some other pointing mechanism than URIs but it does skew it towards that approach.
> 
> Thoughts?

It would seem to me the web resource representing the provenance of an 'Entity' would naturally be identified by a URI, and would be expected to resolve such that the provenance can be accessed and lineage traced.

But what about the entities (real world or digital) that the provenance is about?  What are the expectations for resolvability?  Expectations in content?  Would this URI represent the entity itself (File URL) or information about the entity (XML or RDF)?

--Stephan

> 
> cheers,
> Paul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jun Zhao wrote:
>> Hi Luc,
>> 
>> On 24/05/2011 09:40, Luc Moreau wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>> 
>>> I am pleased to see that some definitions are being uploaded on the
>>> wiki; in particular, I see definitions of resources, which I would
>>> like to begin debating during the teleconference this week.
>>> 
>>> For now, I just use this definition:
>>> 
>>>   A resource can be anything that might be identified by URI
>>> 
>>> Going back to the Data Journalism example [1], it is not entirely clear
>>> that such a notion of resource encapsulates all the "data entities" that
>>> we find here.    I can see r1 and r2 being resources.
>>> 
>>> However, what about f1, which, for instance, could have been generated
>>> by an xslt transform over d1. f1 could be a file on the local file
>>> system, which then
>>> is made available later as a resource r1.
>>> 
>>> Likewise, lcp1 is a local copy of a serialization of r1.  Again, lcp1
>>> could be a file
>>> on the file system.
>>> 
>>> Are lcp1 and f1 resources?
>> 
>> I think the reason you need to raise these questions is due to your current definition of Resource.
>> 
>> Although we are charted under Semantic Web activities and aim at creating a provenance vocabulary for the Web, it does not mean that an object whose provenance information to be described must be accessible on the Web nor identified by an URI, right?
>> 
>> I felt the proposed definition might be too narrow by introducing identifiable by URI as one feature of a Resource. Please correct me if you do believe this is the scope we must work with in the WG.
>> 
>> cheers,
>> 
>> Jun
>> 
>>> 
>>> Can we classify all the "data entities" in group, with same properties?
>>> What are these classes?
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Luc
>>> 
>>> 
>>> [1] http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ProvenanceExample
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 05/20/2011 08:00 AM, Provenance Working Group Issue Tracker wrote:
>>>> PROV-ISSUE-1 (define-resource): Definition for concept 'Resource' [Provenance Terminology]
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/track/issues/1
>>>> 
>>>> Raised by: Luc Moreau
>>>> On product: Provenance Terminology
>>>> 
>>>> The Provenance WG charter identifies the concept 'Resource' as a core concept of the provenance interchange language to be standardized (see http://www.w3.org/2011/01/prov-wg-charter).
>>>> 
>>>> What term do we adopt for the concept 'Resource'?
>>>> How do we define the concept 'Resource'?
>>>> Where does concept 'Resource' appear in ProvenanceExample?
>>>> Which provenance query requires the concept 'Resource'?
>>>> 
>>>> Wiki page: http://www.w3.org/2011/prov/wiki/ConceptResource
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
>

Received on Wednesday, 25 May 2011 09:18:52 UTC