W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-pronunciation@w3.org > January 2021

Meeting Minutes Pronunciation Task Force Teleconference - 2021-01-20

From: Paul Grenier <pgrenier@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 11:00:50 -0500
Message-ID: <CAMq9vGbv_awGAFLotfr5eLcNm0mpjQPQaBvCkcX1vOF+Mq2bmA@mail.gmail.com>
Cc: Spoken Pronunciation Task Force <public-pronunciation@w3.org>, Shadi Abou-Zahra <shadi@w3.org>
The meeting minutes generated page is a 404, so I preserved the log from my

[10:02] <paul_grenier> zakim, agenda?
[10:02] <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda:
[10:02] <Zakim> 1. Agenda Review & Announcements [from Irfan]
[10:02] <Zakim> 2. Editor Draft updates
https://w3c.github.io/pronunciation/technical-approach/ [from Irfan]
[10:02] <Zakim> 3. Taskforce updates and proposed approach to Shadi [from
[10:02] <Zakim> 4. Other Business [from Irfan]
[10:02] == janina [~janina@public.cloak] has joined #pronunciation
[10:02] <janina> present+
[10:02] <paul_grenier> trackbot, start meeting
[10:02] * trackbot is preparing a teleconference.
[10:02] <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
[10:02] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, trackbot
[10:02] <trackbot> Meeting: Spoken Pronunciation Task Force Teleconference
[10:02] <trackbot> Date: 20 January 2021
[10:02] <paul_grenier> zakim, who is here?
[10:02] <Zakim> Present: IrfanA, paul_grenier, Roy, Dee, janina, JF, Irfan
[10:02] <Zakim> On IRC I see janina, Dee, becky, paul_grenier, shadi,
RRSAgent, Irfan, Roy, MichaelC, Zakim, trackbot
[10:03] <paul_grenier> scribe: paul_grenier
[10:03] * becky Dee, I barely heard you ask if we could hear you now
[10:03] <paul_grenier> zakim, next item
[10:03] <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Agenda Review & Announcements -- taken up
[from Irfan]
[10:03] == SteveNoble_ [~SteveNoble@ef89345d.public.cloak] has joined #
[10:03] <becky> present+
[10:03] <SteveNoble_> present+
[10:03] == mhakkinen [~mhakkinen@ef89345d.public.cloak] has joined #
[10:04] <paul_grenier> zakim, take up item 3
[10:04] <Zakim> agendum 3 -- Taskforce updates and proposed approach to
Shadi -- taken up [from Irfan]
[10:04] <shadi> present+
[10:05] <Dee> present+
[10:06] <paul_grenier> janina: we have a couple of approaches and we expect
to have some implementations to help us get to CR.
[10:07] <paul_grenier> janina: we need to defend our timeline, we're doing
this because we have to reach our goals.
[10:07] <paul_grenier> janina: our charter will need to bring up WHATWG and
speak to the impact to our timeline.
[10:08] <paul_grenier> irfan: we were talking about a plugin architecture
and a screen reader plugin as an option for implementation.
[10:08] <paul_grenier> janina: we've heard from everyone on the screen
reader side, they don't want to parse the HTML.
[10:08] == JF [~JF@ef89345d.public.cloak] has joined #pronunciation
[10:09] <JF> Present+
[10:09] <paul_grenier> janina: which means the axtree must be updated
[10:09] <Roy> https://www.w3.org/2021/01/13-pronunciation-minutes.html#t02
[10:09] <paul_grenier> roy: last week we discussed how Shadi could help us
find some cooperation to talk about this.
[10:10] <paul_grenier> janina: the EU specifically has 22 languages and
probably a bigger problem for pronunciation. If any help we can get with
connecting, implementing, or funding implementation will move us forward.
[10:12] <paul_grenier> shadi: the EU unit responsible for accessibility and
multilingualism is the same. Lots of intersections between them. The short
time frame is a problem.
[10:13] <paul_grenier> shadi: we just started an easy-funded project to
look at gaps in technology and we could add this (pronunciation) and take a
look at implementation but it wouldn't be an implementation per se and not
be faster than a year from now.
[10:14] <paul_grenier> shadi: will you have a minimal set of test cases or
examples that we can show how AT misreads content.
[10:14] <paul_grenier> shadi: this will attract interest and developers you
need to do the implementations.
[10:14] <paul_grenier> mark: we have examples and a gap analysis document.
[10:15] <JF> Q+
[10:15] * Zakim sees JF on the speaker queue
[10:15] <paul_grenier> janina: we're just short of a first public working
draft, so we're not that far off.
[10:15] <paul_grenier> ack JF
[10:15] * Zakim sees no one on the speaker queue
[10:16] <paul_grenier> JF: it feels like we need a bounty to quickly
attract development effort, are you aware of any funds like that?
[10:16] <paul_grenier> shadi: right now, I don't know of anything that fits
[10:17] <paul_grenier> JF: we haven't limited ourselves, we could use AT
plugin architectures like NVDA to help demonstrate what we want the
ecosystem to do.
[10:17] <paul_grenier> JF: if feels like it needs money to make that happen
[10:18] <paul_grenier> janina: it starts as markup but it could be an ebook
reader or AT that converts it.
[10:18] <paul_grenier> JF: any sort of document that supports markup, it's
not constrained to the browser.
[10:20] <paul_grenier> shadi: thank you, this is helpful. I think this can
be a priority for the commission. Roy, we need to take this back to the
internal meeting to spotlight it.
[10:20] <paul_grenier> JF: we need a concrete something to show people. The
video is good but it's one example.
[10:22] <paul_grenier> mark: Texthelp and pearson have implemented one of
the two approaches in current products.
[10:24] <paul_grenier> mark: From Pearson assessment (QTI XML) uses ssml in
the QTI content and gets transformed to HTML. Pearson needed a way to embed
the ssml into the html and were able to do the transform using the
attribute model. Texthelp is consuming that content and converting it to
[10:25] <shadi> s/for the commission/in Europe
[10:25] <paul_grenier> SteveNoble: there are 2 tools consuming the markup,
Pearson's own TTS tool and also Texthelp's extension which works inside
[10:26] <shadi> s/easy-funded/EC-funded
[10:26] <paul_grenier> SteveNobel: there's a GUI based tool that lets
people add pronunciation to content.
[10:27] * shadi has to drop for other meeting
[10:28] <paul_grenier> mark: the SSML is only being consumed by readaloud
tools, we don't have a screen reader support.
[10:30] <paul_grenier> mark: educators are asking for better pronunciation
and pausing in the classroom and learning context
[10:31] <paul_grenier> shadi: I have to drop. This is great. I'll check in
with Roy.
[10:32] <paul_grenier> mark: do we know other kinds of short-term funding
sources to get this work done?
[10:33] <paul_grenier> zakim, take up item 2
[10:33] <Zakim> agendum 2 -- Editor Draft updates
https://w3c.github.io/pronunciation/technical-approach/ -- taken up [from
[10:33] == shadi [shadi@815ad96c.team.cloak] has left #pronunciation [
[10:33] <paul_grenier> mark: maybe some foundation money or special grants
from either Google or Amazon
[10:34] <paul_grenier> janina: who's behind Narrator?
[10:36] <paul_grenier> mark: I'm working on the single-attribute model in
the document
[10:36] <paul_grenier> irfan: paul has updated the multi-attribute demo
[10:36] <paul_grenier> mark: I'll update section 2 within the next couple
of days
[10:37] <paul_grenier> irfan: maybe by next week we can review this and
push it to the next step
[10:39] <paul_grenier> zakim, next item
[10:39] <Zakim> agendum 1 -- Agenda Review & Announcements -- taken up
[from Irfan]
[10:39] <paul_grenier> zakim, take up item 4
[10:39] <Zakim> agendum 4 -- Other Business -- taken up [from Irfan]
[10:39] <paul_grenier> janina: we need our 1-2 paragraph pitch ready in
[10:40] <paul_grenier> janina: we need to write this up and it will be
shared once we send the charter to be reviewed by management
[10:40] <paul_grenier> janina: Roy has given personalization a start on
that so I'll make a draft based on Roy's draft
[10:41] <paul_grenier> janina: I should have that before we meed next week
[10:42] <paul_grenier> RRSAgent, make logs public
[10:42] <RRSAgent> I have made the request, paul_grenier
[10:42] <paul_grenier> RRSAgent, make minutes
[10:42] <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate
https://www.w3.org/2021/01/20-pronunciation-minutes.html paul_grenier
*Paul Grenier*
*[image: github] <https://github.com/AutoSponge>**[image: twitter]
<https://twitter.com/AutoSponge>**[image: linkedin]

On Tue, Jan 19, 2021 at 4:07 PM Ali, Irfan <iali@ets.org> wrote:

> Call Agenda
> If you would like to add an item to the agenda please reply to this mail.
>    - Agenda+ Agenda Review & Announcements
>    - Agenda+ Editor Draft updates
>    https://w3c.github.io/pronunciation/technical-approach/
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c.github.io%2Fpronunciation%2Ftechnical-approach%2F%23attribute-ssml&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C0b7d071affe149a9ac7808d8b7dd5e2e%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637461508693706245%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=9ek5RuPpdKPwmwLsZcIYKeVMOwFKYxclEmZw54KgGo8%3D&reserved=0>
>    - Agenda+ Discussion with Shadi
>    - Agenda+ Other Business
> Call Details
> You can find this by clicking through to the secured meeting info page on
> w3c's website
> <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2017%2F08%2Ftelecon-info_pronunciation-wed&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401217549%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=pIL%2BC56xFI8tnjLzCr5TieuDS5HmqVZ1biWJEel%2BY3o%3D&reserved=0>
> .
> Previous Meeting Minutes
>    - 2021/01/13 <https://www.w3.org/2021/01/13-pronunciation-minutes.html>
> *Chairs:* Irfan Ali, Paul Grenier
> *Scribe: *TBD
> *IRC:* irc.w3.org
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> Additional Logistics
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> Resources and Useful Links:
>    - Pronunciation Explainer Document
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2Fpronunciation-explainer%2F&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401247532%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=uzXtcyRa35Ctg%2FxHx%2BTUGi8xiD%2FGLbyo5JijzRHLtiQ%3D&reserved=0>
>    - Pronunciation Gap Analysis & Use Case document page
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2Fpronunciation-gap-analysis-and-use-cases%2F&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401257527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=yR1UmJpTxCxdEED7pZY9xAe22BB87FQuCC6v7CCd1GY%3D&reserved=0>
>    - Pronunciation User Scenarios document page
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2FTR%2Fpronunciation-user-scenarios%2F&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401257527%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=j%2F9MzZfffHmH9%2F%2BppH%2Fl0jn7kh2OZqlggzH6vZs8ex4%3D&reserved=0>
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>    - Mailing list archives
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.w3.org%2FArchives%2FPublic%2Fpublic-pronunciation%2F&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401277515%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=gAcqLuGsf9uqRyf40ZBfCjAOrTt6yOOpQ%2Fomr76tIuQ%3D&reserved=0>
>    - Wiki
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fw3c%2Fpronunciation%2Fwiki&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401287512%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=8227Fs9YrmneXeDNExYWqM7kBR5IsfQ3tCuAKOvvxoo%3D&reserved=0>
>    - Pronunciation source repository issue tracker
>    <https://nam01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fw3c%2Fpronunciation%2Fissues&data=04%7C01%7Ciali%40ets.org%7C928e096fe66843eae3be08d8b25ec446%7C0ba6e9b760b34fae92f37e6ddd9e9b65%7C0%7C0%7C637455467401297507%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=GgrsOb69cFF2c1d4QoyX%2Fe2EqIKlnA7bIKgcc0U3%2Bgk%3D&reserved=0>
> *Irfan Ali*
> Principal Research System Specialist
> *Accessibility Standards & Inclusive Technology Group (ASIT)*
> C-130, 660 Rosedale Road
> Princeton, NJ 08541
> Phone: (O)609-524-8181
>            (C)917-349-2698
> Email: iali@ets.org
> *Co-Chair*, Pronunciation Task Force :
> https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/task-forces/pronunciation/
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Received on Wednesday, 20 January 2021 16:01:18 UTC

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