Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PNG overview slides

Good points, Leonard. Agreed.
(And agreed that if 1 format is the goal, JpegXL for example perhaps
already solves it.)

Thinking of a W3C-centric, lossy use case off the cuff:
I think people typically associate PNG with logos and icons.
I don't think logos and icons need to be 100% lossless.
I think Jpeg 1 does a bad job with (some) logos and icons, so PNG fills
that gap.

But there are surely better lossy options that are well suited for logos
and icons (rather than photos).
I feel like many lossy compression formats target photos.
And I feel like W3C would care about logos and icons.
I could see a lossy format that falls under W3C's umbrella and addresses an
underserved use case.


On Thu, Nov 13, 2025 at 10:30 PM Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>
wrote:

> >1 still image format that developers can use for almost everything
> >
> Which was the intent for JPEG XL.
>
> Which brings us back to determining whether it (or some other format, such
> as AVIF or WebP) meets those goals/requirements.
>
> Leonard
>
> *From: *Seeger, Chris (NBCUniversal) <Chris.Seeger@nbcuni.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, November 13, 2025 at 8:24 AM
> *To: *Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>, Chris Blume (ProgramMax) <
> programmax@gmail.com>, Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org>
> *Cc: *Portable Network Graphics (PNG) Working Group <public-png@w3.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PNG overview slides
>
> *EXTERNAL: Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.*
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I’m thinking in a similar but slightly different way. Why have different
> image formats when one can answer all of the requirements?
>
> I think it’s good to have choice (JPEG-XL and AVIF), but in my opinion it
> would also be good to have simplicity (1 still image format that developers
> can use for almost everything).
>
> *Chris *
>
>
> *From: *Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, November 13, 2025 at 8:08 AM
> *To: *Seeger, Chris (NBCUniversal) <Chris.Seeger@nbcuni.com>, Chris Blume
> (ProgramMax) <programmax@gmail.com>, Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org>
> *Cc: *Portable Network Graphics (PNG) Working Group <public-png@w3.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PNG overview slides
>
> Why does it need to be under the W3C umbrella?  We already have JPEG-XL
> and AVIF that meet those criteria and are supported by most/all browsers.
> What would be the benefit/use case for ANOTHER image format?
>
> Leonard
>
> *From: *Seeger, Chris (NBCUniversal) <Chris.Seeger@nbcuni.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, November 13, 2025 at 8:04 AM
> *To: *Chris Blume (ProgramMax) <programmax@gmail.com>, Chris Lilley <
> chris@w3.org>
> *Cc: *Portable Network Graphics (PNG) Working Group <public-png@w3.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PNG overview slides
>
> *EXTERNAL: Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.*
>
>
> Seems like it would be valuable to get a single image standard to support
> lossy and lossless under the W3C umbrella.  I’d like to see this move
> forward.
>
> *Chris Seeger*
>
>
> *From: *Chris Blume (ProgramMax) <programmax@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, November 13, 2025 at 1:05 AM
> *To: *Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org>
> *Cc: *Portable Network Graphics (PNG) Working Group <public-png@w3.org>
> *Subject: *[EXTERNAL] Re: PNG overview slides
>
> I have also prepared some slides for the 5th Edition roadmap. (I will
> likely update them further tonight. I want it to feel less "that's asking a
> lot" and more inspirational.)
>
> I didn't realize there was perhaps a slide design I should follow. :) oh
> well
>
> https://www.programmax.net/talks/png-5th-edition-roadmap/
> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.programmax.net/talks/png-5th-edition-roadmap/__;!!PIZeeW5wscynRQ!teSn4yviUBeJ8O9oZSwfJ9aKO0E-s15YjPBgNu1aE25KBHvIssFohlbOT0_RndqnlcdI20H5N-JmHbdKxCmf$>
>
> On Thu, Nov 13, 2025, 2:56 PM Chris Lilley <chris@w3.org> wrote:
>
> Slides for an overview of PNG 3rd Edition (plus what we have so far on
> 4th):
>
> https://www.w3.org/2025/Talks/TPAC/PNG-summary/
> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.w3.org/2025/Talks/TPAC/PNG-summary/__;!!PIZeeW5wscynRQ!teSn4yviUBeJ8O9oZSwfJ9aKO0E-s15YjPBgNu1aE25KBHvIssFohlbOT0_RndqnlcdI20H5N-JmHUriXr2b$>
>
> --
> Chris Lilley
> @svgeesus@mastodon.scot
> W3C Distinguished Expert, Color, Graphics & Fonts
> W3C Technical Programming Team, Core Web Design
>
>
>