Re: Fwd: Interaction model vs data model

Hi Henry,

Promising in indeed a very important topic to understand the relationship  
between URIs, resources and representations (and protocols, etc.). I will  
publish something on that one soon - I'll send the paper to the list when  
it's finished.

It's important because the promise "qualifies" the action that will be  
performed. Depending on the promise, the action is thus made different,  
though not necessarily from a strict behaviorist perspective.

I'd argue that this point is not restricted to the philosophy of language  
though and that we should move beyond it to really get of good grasp of  
the Web but that is a huge topic I don't have time to tackle right now! :)

Best,
A.




Le Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:19:52 +0100, Henry Story <henry.story@bblfish.net>  
a écrit:

> Some discussion on Protocols and Restful behavior
> where I start introducing some concepts from pragmatics.
> This is in response to Erik Wilde who is a REST proponent....
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>> From: Henry Story <henry.story@bblfish.net>
>> Subject: Re: Interaction model vs data model
>> Date: 24 January 2013 19:45:06 CET
>> To: Erik Wilde <Erik.Wilde@emc.com>
>> Cc: Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>, public-ldp-wg@w3.org
>> Bcc: Adeline Gasnier <adeliga@hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>> On 24 Jan 2013, at 18:25, "Wilde, Erik" <Erik.Wilde@emc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> hello kingsley.
>>>
>>> On 2013-01-24 17:59 , "Kingsley Idehen" <kidehen@openlinksw.com> wrote:
>>>> On 1/24/13 11:40 AM, Wilde, Erik wrote:
>>>>> i am certainly using "link" in the REST sense: references that  
>>>>> clients
>>>>> are expected to follow in their application flow, and where the  
>>>>> behavior
>>>>> is defined by the protocol (the media type). if that may cause
>>>>> confusion, what about hyperlink, following the recent trend that one  
>>>>> of
>>>>> the essences of REST is that it's hypermedia?
>>>> Is a Content-type (or media type) a protocol? Isn't that metadata for
>>>> the resource denoted by the link? Basically, the description of the  
>>>> data
>>>> de-referenced by the link.
>>>
>>> any content type that uses links (i.e., goes beyond simple image/gif  
>>> kind
>>> of standalone data formats) essentially is a protocol: it defines rules
>>> how interactions between clients and servers are possible, and what  
>>> they
>>> mean.
>>
>> Aïïï! this is very confused though I see what you are trying to get at.  
>> We're
>> going to have to be careful in this space about how our use of  
>> terminology.
>>
>> We have two elements here: the documents and the protocol (which most of
>> us regard HTTP as being a clear case of).  The area of philosophy where
>> these two is known as pragmatics. For example one distinguishes between
>> the content of a sentence, and what one does with it.  For example given
>> the sentence A
>>
>>  A: "The blue chair is outside"@en
>>
>> Here are two ways to use it
>>
>>  B: Joe make it the case that "the blue chair is outside"@en .
>>  C: Joe is it the case that "the blue chair is outside"@en ?
>>
>> Each one of these does something with the sentence "The blue chair is  
>> outside", but the
>> meaning of A does not change in each sentence thereafter. B is an  
>> order, C is a question.
>> Notice that B, and  C, sentences that appear in a social context and  
>> that use A.
>> We don't have to repeat them all the time. We could just refer to them,  
>> so that we
>> could continue with examples such as
>>
>>   D: I promise to make it be A .
>>   E: I swear that A .
>>   F: Sorry I was wrong that A .
>>
>> Promising, or swearing is an event. In some situations one puts one's  
>> hand
>> up to do this.  This event can be given a name: the promising or  
>> swearing
>> of A. Call one such event Ev1.  Creating such events is what POSTing  
>> allows
>> us to do.
>>
>>  The web allows us to give names to every thing we find with a URL. So  
>> we
>> can give names to things that create promising events, and we can  
>> describe
>> the types of promising that can be made there.... This is done by  
>> looking
>> at documents that describe things.
>>
>>  So we have a declarative side of things. And we have a protocol side
>> of things. We are between "Saying and Doing" as Robert Brandom's recent
>> book is called.
>>
>> 	I'll keep you updated when I can make it even clearer....
>>
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>>
>>> dret.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Social Web Architect
>> http://bblfish.net/
>>
>
> Social Web Architect
> http://bblfish.net/
>


-- 


Responsable Recherche Web et Métadonnées à l'Institut de Recherche et  
d'Innovation du Centre Pompidou (IRI)
Doctorant en philosophie à Paris 1 (PHICO, EXeCO)
Collaborateur extérieur chez Inria - Projet DBpedia Francophone et  
SemanticPedia (Membre associé de l'EPI Wimmics, Centre de Recherche de  
Sophia-Antipolis)
Chercheur associé au CNAM (équipe Dicen-idf)

Co-chair du W3C Community Group "Philosophy of the Web"  
http://www.w3.org/community/philoweb/
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Received on Thursday, 24 January 2013 20:16:07 UTC