Re: Action-1293 Proposal

On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 1:19 PM, Dominic Mazzoni <dmazzoni@google.com>
wrote:

> I still don't understand what this line is supposed to mean:
>
> <tr aria-rowindex="100" aria-rowcount="50"><tr> <!-- 49 rows are not yet
> loaded -->
>
> If the intended meaning of this line is that "there are 49 rows following
> this one that aren't loaded yet",
>

yes


> then I don't see how that's useful information to annotate. I'm not aware
> of an existing native accessibility API that has a way to express this, nor
> am I aware of any screen reader that announces anything like this.
>
>
Rather, most APIs and screen readers primarily concern themselves with (1)
> the coordinates of the current cell, (2) the span of the current cell, and
> (3) the total number of rows and columns in the table.
>

> Everything else is just implied or discovered - for example if you
> navigate down from row 1 and reach row 100, clearly the rows in-between
> were missing - but that's implicit, not explicit.
>

I don't know if that info is useful for AT. Is your point that there's no
point to put aria-rowcount on the row because there's no any profit for AT
in that?

Just in case here's original Joanie's use case [1].

[1] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pfwg/2015Jan/0160.html


> - Dominic
>
> On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 10:01 AM, Alexander Surkov <
> surkov.alexander@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I don't see a reason preventing rowcount from working on the table
>> element (I guess same for colcount attribute) but I let Joanie to comment
>> in case if I miss something.
>>
>> I would argue that spanned cell and missed rows/columns are semantically
>> different and shouldn't be used to substitute each other.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 12:38 PM, Dominic Mazzoni <dmazzoni@google.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 5:38 AM, Alexander Surkov <
>>> surkov.alexander@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> yes but not always though. If that was true then there's no reason of
>>>> putting those attributes on cell or row elements. As I understand a table
>>>> may be loaded in number of parts (Joanie's point iirc), for example:
>>>>
>>>> <table>
>>>>   <tr></tr> <!-- 98 rows are missed-->
>>>>   <tr> aria-rowindex="100" aria-rowcount="50"><tr> <!-- 49 rows are not
>>>> yet loaded -->
>>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="151" aria-rowcount="20"></tr> <!- 19 rows are not
>>>> yet loaded -->
>>>> </table>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I'm not sure I understand that example. If the user lands on row 151,
>>> how would you have that described by AT? Aren't there 170 total rows in the
>>> table?
>>>
>>> What would be wrong with this?
>>>
>>> <table aria-rowcount="170">
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="100"><tr> <!-- 49 rows are not yet loaded -->
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="151"></tr> <!- 19 rows are not yet loaded -->
>>> </table>
>>>
>>> In that example above, the index of each row, plus the total row count
>>> in the table, is sufficient to totally describe what rows are present and
>>> what rows are missing.
>>>
>>> Alternatively, if you want a placeholder for missing rows, I think we
>>> should use rowspan:
>>>
>>> <table aria-rowcount="170">
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="1" aria-rowspan="99"><tr> <!-- 99 rows are missed
>>> -->
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="100"><tr>
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="101" aria-rowspan="49><tr> <!-- 49 rows are not yet
>>> loaded -->
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="151"></tr>
>>>   <tr aria-rowindex="152" aria-rowspan="18><tr> <!-- 18 rows are not yet
>>> loaded -->
>>> </table>
>>>
>>>
>>
>