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Minutes: February 3, 2014 WAI-PF ARIA Caucus

From: Joseph Scheuhammer <clown@alum.mit.edu>
Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2014 11:54:53 -0500
Message-ID: <52EFC9DD.3080708@alum.mit.edu>
To: public-pfwg@w3.org
Link: http://www.w3.org/2014/02/03-aria-minutes.html

Plain text follows:

      [1]W3C

       [1] http://www.w3.org/

                                - DRAFT -

            Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
                               03 Feb 2014

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2014/02/03-aria-irc

Attendees

    Present
           joanie, janina, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Michael_Cooper,
           Matt_King, Joseph_Scheuhammer, Jon_Gunderson,
           James_Craig

    Regrets
    Chair
           Rich

    Scribe
           clown

Contents

      * [3]Topics
          1. [4]action-1329
          2. [5]action 1360
      * [6]Summary of Action Items
      __________________________________________________________

    <trackbot> Date: 03 February 2014

    [7]http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#mapping_role_t
    able

       [7] http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#mapping_role_table

    First column is WAI-ARIA role, followed by mappings to the
    following accessibility APIs: MSAA, IAccessible2, UI
    Automation, ATK, and MAC Accessibility

    [8]http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#mapping_role_t
    able

       [8] http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#mapping_role_table

    <richardschwerdtfeger> meeting: W3C WAI-PF ARIA Caucus

    summary: First column is WAI-ARIA role, followed by mappings to
    the following accessibility APIs: MSAA, IAccessible2, UI
    Automation, ATK, and MAC Accessibility

    caption: Table describing mapping of WAI-ARIA roles to
    accessibility APIs

    [9]http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#document-handl
    ing_author-errors

       [9] http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-implementation/#document-handling_author-errors

    [10]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#document-hand
    ling_author-errors

      [10] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#document-handling_author-errors

    <mattking> misspelling in this caption:

    <mattking> Table of accessibility application programing
    interface for focus states and events

    MichaelC ^

    <mattking> in this caption, interfaces should be singular:

    <mattking> Table of events to be fired in each application
    programing interfaces for changes in Accessible Rich Internet
    Application states and properties

    <richardschwerdtfeger>
    [11]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/1

      [11] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/1

    <scribe> scribenick: clown

action-1329

    action-1329?

    <trackbot> action-1329 -- Michael Cooper to Add to spec for
    grab "When grab is set to true, all potential drop targets
    should have dropeffect property set appropriately. When an
    object is ungrabbed (value reverts to supported or none)
    dropeffects should revert to none". -- due 2008-09-01 -- CLOSED

    <trackbot>
    [12]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/239

      [12] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/239

    action-1329

    <trackbot> action-1329 -- James Craig to Clarify the "bridging"
    language in #co-evolution to make it clear that aria is not a
    stop-gap technology. it will always be relevant svg, and it
    will remain relevant for html as long as web developers have
    *any* reason to not use the native control, including the use
    to retrofit existing sites or frameworks without completely
    gutting the implementation. -- due 2014-01-30 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [13]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1329

      [13] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1329

    RS: Did this get done?
    ... Let me look.
    ... I don't see the word "bridge" doing a search.

    MC: You won't find it on the cover page. It was in a couple of
    places.
    ... It's in the DTD section.
    ... It is in the introduction.

    RS: Still there?

    MC: Yes.

    JS: That needs to be fixed before we go PR.

    MC: I thought james had worked up some wording.

    <richardschwerdtfeger>
    [14]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/introduction

      [14] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/introduction

    JC: Let me look at that.

    RS, JC: <discussion of where the changes need to be made>

    MK: This is written as if SVG includes ARIA. Does it?

    RS: It is in SVG2.

    JC: It doesn't actually include it, but you cann use aria in
    SVG.

    MK: So we should remove that clause.

    <richardschwerdtfeger>
    [15]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/introduction

      [15] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/introduction

    <jcraig>
    [16]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/complete#co-evolution

      [16] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/complete#co-evolution

    RS, JC, MK: <discussion of fixes>

    JC: Just remove the phrase about the obsolescence of ARIA.

    MK: Just take out the phrase that starts "without the
    obsolescence "

    JC: Yes.

    MC: Yes, we can remove that.

    RS: Also, in the first paragraph, change "bridging" to
    "additve".

    MC: How about enhancing (?)

    RS: That would be better.

    <jcraig> <abbr title="Accessible Rich Internet
    Applications">WAI-ARIA</abbr> is intended to augment semantics
    in supporting languages like <a href="#ref_HTML">HTML</a> and
    <a href="#ref_SVG">SVG</a>, or used as an accessibility
    enhancement technology in other markup-based languages that do
    not explicitly include support for ARIA.

    <jcraig> In these cases, <abbr title="Accessible Rich Internet
    Applications">WAI-ARIA</abbr> could be adopted as a long-term
    approach to add semantic information to user interface
    components.

    MK: I propose we delete this sentence:

    <mattking> delete this sentence: Thus new types of objects
    would generally appear first within the web community, then
    WAI-ARIA

    <mattking> would provide bridging accessibility semantics in
    the medium term, and finally web languages would provide native
    semantics in the longer term. In this

    <mattking> way, WAI-ARIA and host languages both evolve
    together but at different rates.

    <mattking> Thus new types of objects would generally appear
    first within the web community, then WAI-ARIA

    <mattking> would provide bridging accessibility semantics in
    the medium term, and finally web languages would provide native
    semantics in the longer term. In this

    <mattking> way, WAI-ARIA and host languages both evolve
    together but at different rates.

    MK: I think this is redundant
    ... It is describing a bridge in time, but I think the
    paragraph is better without it.

    MC: But the next sentence makes less sense now.

    JC: Instead of "The goal of WAI-ARIA", say, "One of the goals
    of WAI-ARIA".

    <jcraig> Furthermore, new types of objects are continually
    being developed. One goal of <abbr title="Accessible Rich
    Internet Applications">WAI-ARIA</abbr> is to provide a way to
    make such objects accessible, because host language standards
    tend to be slower to evolve. In this way, <abbr
    title="Accessible Rich Internet Applications">WAI-ARIA</abbr>
    and host languages both evolve together but at different rates.

    JC: Then we could pull out the next sentence.

    <jcraig> because host language standards tend to be slower to
    evolve.

    JC: That implies, again, that aria is a quick stop-gap measure.

    <jcraig> because host language standards sometimes overlook
    accessibility needs.

    RS: We don't need to say that aria is quicker. Nothing is
    gained by that.

    Clown: It's not just the W3C. It's the authors that are moving
    quicker.

    <jcraig> because web authoring practices often advance faster
    than host language standards.

    RS: I am good with the first paragraph.

    JC: One thing that bothers me is one sentence starts,
    "Furthermore", and the next one begins "Therefore".
    ... Drop the furthermore.

    MC: Okay.

    JC: Or, combine the two sentences.

    RS: Yes.

    MK: The first sentence has a strange grammatical structure.
    ... Need "or to be used as" in the second phrase.

    RS: Does that do it?
    ... Can we close action-1329 now?

    JC: I think so.
    ... I've checked in the 1.1 changes; Michael has done it for
    1.0

    RS: I'm going to close it then.

    <richardschwerdtfeger> RESOLUTION: Close action 1329 as
    complete

    MK: Didn't you say the "bridging" teminology appeared elsewhere
    in the document?

    MC: Yes, in an appendix, but in a different context.

    <richardschwerdtfeger>
    [17]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

      [17] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

action 1360

    action-1360?

    <trackbot> action-1360 -- Janina Sajka to Write one paragraph
    per special acknoledgement for Al Gilman, Aaron Leventhal, etc.
    -- due 2014-02-01 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [18]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

      [18] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

    <jcraig> action-1360

    <trackbot> action-1360 -- Janina Sajka to Write one paragraph
    per special acknoledgement for Al Gilman, Aaron Leventhal, etc.
    -- due 2014-02-01 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [19]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

      [19] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1360

    JS: I think that's necessary in the final document.
    ... Do we need it now, Michael?

    JC: This is one of the good things that came up at the
    face-to-face
    ... There are these acknowledgements, but they are kind of
    buried in the current draft.

    JS: I can get this done, right after the call.
    ... Is this important for the PR version?

    MC: We can do it later, but it would be helpful to do it
    earlier.

    JS: I would like to input from you, Rich.

    RC: Well, we have 15 minutes.
    ... But, I also want to talk about a new meeting time.

    MK: Good idea. Someone was going to ping Stefan about that.
    ... How about 1pm eastern, on Mon.

    JS: We need to focus on the key people, and then post it to a
    wider audience.

    RS: The chanllenge is 1.5 hours.
    ... Tues 1pm eastern.

    Clown: I prefer Mon for this meeting.
    ... The UAIG meeting is also on Tue on afternoon.

    RS: I could do 12.

    MK: That would be 10am for me.

    RS: What does everyone think about 1pm eastern on Mon?

    +1

    MC: I should be able to do that.

    RS: We need to check with James.

    JS: Do we want to explore other times?

    RS: <cites lots of conflicts>

    <joanie> i'm good with 1pm

    <joanie> i am here

    <jongund_> I have a meeting at 1 EST, but I could move it

    <joanie> richardschwerdtfeger: I said yes

    JS: It is 10am for James. He should be in the office by then.

    JG: What about stefan?

    JS: It would be 7pm for him. It's after work, but not too late.

    RS: I have sent the new time suggestion to the list.

    MK: We could switch in two weeks.

    RS: Any news on Mike Smith while we were talking?

    MC: I have not heard.
    ... I don't think we will publish tomorrow, but probably on
    Thu.

    RS: Regarding Aaron and Al, what do you want to say, and where.

    JS: Near the acknowledgements with a couple of sentences.

    RS: Although aaron and al were not part of the WG at the time
    of publication, their contributions were ...
    ... I think the big thing is that both of them were key or
    founding contributors to the specifications.
    ... Specifically, Al chaired PFWG at the time that the ARIA
    effort began.
    ... And Aaron established the first implementation in browsers.

    JS: Which demonstrated the viability of the approach

    RS: Let me point to the announcement.

    <richardschwerdtfeger>
    [20]http://www.networkworld.com/news/2005/081605-ibm-firefox.ht
    ml

      [20] http://www.networkworld.com/news/2005/081605-ibm-firefox.html

    JS: I will use that.

    RS: Aaron authored the first draft of the UAIG.
    ... Point to the initial 50k lines of code in FF.
    ... They couldn't because of the restrictions of the use of JS
    and CSS because they were deemed to be inaccessilbe.
    ... The contribution of the code showed that it could be done.
    ... It showed that it would work in the browser in the same way
    as on the desktop.

    JS: Characterize Al as a strategic figure?
    ... Is that fair?
    ... I'll put together a draft, and run it by you.
    ... And, if we don't publish until Thu, I can have it done by
    then.
    ... I think I have enough.

    RRSAgent: stop log

Summary of Action Items

    [End of minutes]
      __________________________________________________________


     Minutes formatted by David Booth's [21]scribe.perl version
     1.138 ([22]CVS log)
     $Date: 2014-02-03 16:50:14 $
      __________________________________________________________

      [21] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
      [22] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/


-- 
;;;;joseph.


'A: After all, it isn't rocket science.'
'K: Right. It's merely computer science.'
              - J. D. Klaun -
Received on Monday, 3 February 2014 16:55:24 UTC

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