Re: doubt about "Synset / Concept" class

Hi Aldo,

Names in the previous example are not fixed of course. I also don't like
"means" that much I just haven't got a better alternative yet. (synset is
too WordNet-specific, means/meaning/concept are too broad)

Regards,
John


On Wed, May 8, 2013 at 1:02 PM, Aldo Gangemi <aldo.gangemi@cnr.it> wrote:

> Hi, I agree with John, we really seem on the same wave now :), in fact I
> agree with Model 2 being far better.
> Only, should we really use ontolex:means to link senses and synsets? It's
> a bit too broad as a name for a specific relation like that, isn't it?
>
> Aldo
>
> On May 8, 2013, at 6:37:22 AM , John McCrae <
> jmccrae@cit-ec.uni-bielefeld.de> wrote:
>
> Hi Jorge, all,
>
> Thanks for your comment, I agree this is an issue we should discuss. I
> think that it is clearly wrong to continue to treat skos:Concepts as
> ontological elements, they aren't and we shouldn't really confuse them. The
> question of whether we should still use SKOS terminologies as systems of
> reference for the model also seems clear to me (of course we should).
>
> The question then boils down to this essential question: do we use the
> same property to reference both a skos:Concept and an ontology entity?
>
> This leads to two variation on the model:
>
> Model 1. (Same property)
>
> With synsets
>
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:means-> wordnet:corn_n_xxx
> *--ontolex:conceptualizes->* fao:Corn (a skos:Concept)
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:means-> wordnet:corn_n_xxx
> --ontolex:conceptualizes-> dbpedia:Corn (a owl:Class)
>
> Without synsets
>
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 *--ontolex:reference->* fao:Corn (a
> skos:Concept)
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:reference-> dbpedia:Corn (a
> owl:Class)
>
> Model 2. (Different property)
>
> With synsets
>
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:means-> wordnet:corn_n_xxx
> *--skos:exactMatch->* fao:Corn (a skos:Concept)
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:means-> wordnet:corn_n_xxx
> --ontolex:conceptualizes-> dbpedia:Corn (a owl:Class)
>
> Without synsets
>
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 *--ontolex:means->* fao:Corn (a
> skos:Concept)
> :corn --ontolex:sense-> :corn_sense1 --ontolex:reference-> dbpedia:Corn (a
> owl:Class)
>
> With further linking valid of
>
> fao:Corn --ontolex:conceptualizes-> dbpedia:Corn
>
>
> I prefer model two as it makes a clearer distinction between terminologies
> and ontologies, doesn't require linking two SKOS concepts with an ontolex
> property (which we should avoid as it is not our job to fix SKOS) and
> allows us to define a natural property for linking terminologies to
> ontologies.
>
> Regards,
> John
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 2:58 PM, Jorge Gracia <jgracia@fi.upm.es> wrote:
>
>> Dear Philipp, all
>>
>> I am not able to join the telco today, sorry. But let me to formulate
>> a quick question about John's model
>> http://www.w3.org/community/ontolex/wiki/File:John-modelling.png);
>> maybe you can treat it today.
>> Following the previous discussions I can understand the inclusion of
>> the new class "Synset / Concept". My doubt is: despite the fact that
>> skos concepts could be represented with this new class, can we
>> alternatively continuing treating skos concepts (of external skos
>> ontologies) as "ontology entities"? (as in the IFLA example presented
>> last week). For me this option is very natural, fully compliant with
>> R3 "semantics by reference" and we shouldn't lose it.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Jorge
>>
>>
>> 2013/5/2 Philipp Cimiano <cimiano@cit-ec.uni-bielefeld.de>:
>> > Dear all,
>> >
>> >  this is a gentle reminder that we will have our regular ontolex telco
>> > tomorrow.
>> >
>> > I intend to discuss the model proposed by John on the basis of the
>> > contributions of all of you.
>> > I would like to see if there is a chance that we agree on this model as
>> a
>> > building block for the further work.
>> >
>> > Here is a link to the conference metadata including access details:
>> >
>> >
>> http://www.w3.org/community/ontolex/wiki/Teleconference,_2013.03.05,_15-16_pm_CET
>> >
>> > Best regards,
>> >
>> > Philipp.
>> >
>> > --
>> > Prof. Dr. Philipp Cimiano
>> > Semantic Computing Group
>> > Excellence Cluster - Cognitive Interaction Technology (CITEC)
>> > University of Bielefeld
>> >
>> > Phone: +49 521 106 12249
>> > Fax: +49 521 106 12412
>> > Mail: cimiano@cit-ec.uni-bielefeld.de
>> >
>> > Room H-127
>> > Morgenbreede 39
>> > 33615 Bielefeld
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jorge Gracia, PhD
>> Ontology Engineering Group
>> Artificial Intelligence Department
>> Universidad Politécnica de Madrid
>> http://delicias.dia.fi.upm.es/~jgracia/
>>
>>
>
>