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RE: question on issue-110 (xml:lang vs. lang)

From: Yves Savourel <ysavourel@enlaso.com>
Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 07:43:12 -0700
To: <public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org>
Message-ID: <assp.0742f144d6.assp.07426a2459.005c01cdfef8$2199bb40$64cd31c0$@com>
Just one question:


If it’s an XHTML document it’s not HTML5, so it should be supported within the XML test cases.


But then, we don’t formally support XHTML + ITS. We support XML + ITS, so why XHTML gets a special treatment about lang vs xml:lang? If it does, then why, for example, DITA is not getting a special treatment with dita:translate vs its:translate?


Basically I’m just wondering if dealing with xhtml:lang vs xml:lang is within scope at all?





From: Leroy Finn [mailto:finnle@tcd.ie] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 7:22 AM
To: Arle Lommel
Cc: Yves Savourel; <public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org>
Subject: Re: question on issue-110 (xml:lang vs. lang)


I have added the output now along with updating the test suite dashboard for this new test.


The input is located here:   <https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite/blob/master/its2.0/inputdata/languageinformation/html/languageinfo4html.html> https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite/blob/master/its2.0/inputdata/languageinformation/html/languageinfo4html.html

The output is located here: https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite/blob/master/its2.0/expected/languageinformation/html/languageinfo4htmloutput.txt


Let me know if this is okay,



On 30 January 2013 13:41, Leroy Finn <finnle@tcd.ie> wrote:

Everyone this test file now has been added here: https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite/blob/master/its2.0/inputdata/languageinformation/html/languageinfo4html.html . I will add the output soon. So issue-110 can be closed for Ankit.





On 29 January 2013 10:09, Leroy Finn <finnle@tcd.ie> wrote:

Okay I will add this test file today based on this discussion.




On 28 January 2013 21:32, Arle Lommel <arle.lommel@dfki.de> wrote:

Anything else would be tremendously unintuitive for most users and would create strange problems. So +1 to Yves and Shaun. 




Arle Lommel

Berlin, Germany

Skype: arle_lommel

Phone (US): +1 707 709 8650 <tel:%2B1%20707%20709%208650> 


Sent from a mobile device. Please excuse any typos.

On Jan 28, 2013, at 21:21, Yves Savourel <ysavourel@enlaso.com> wrote:

+1 on Shaun's comments.
(especially "...xml:lang to take precedence over lang only when defined on the same node")


-----Original Message-----
From: Shaun McCance [mailto:shaunm@gnome.org] 
Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 12:28 PM
To: Felix Sasaki
Cc: Jirka Kosek; public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org
Subject: Re: question on issue-110 (xml:lang vs. lang)

On Fri, 2013-01-25 at 12:17 +0100, Felix Sasaki wrote:

Am 25.01.13 11:19, schrieb Jirka Kosek:

On 25.1.2013 9:01, Felix Sasaki wrote:


we had discussed on Wednesday


that xml:lang and lang take precedence over the BCP 47 value 

conveyed by a "langRule". One clarification question: should we 

state that this relation also includes inherited values? e.g.


<html xml:lang="en" ...>...

<its:langRule selector="//h:p" langPointer="@class"> ...

<body lang="ja"> ...

<p class="de">...



In this case the output of processing "langRule" would convey "en":

xml:lang takes precedence over HTML lang. And xml:lang inherits to "p".

My instinct says that inheritence shouldn't be applied here and for 

p element language should be selected using langRule.


Fine by me - so the output in the test suite would be


/html    lang="en"


/html/body[1]    lang="ja"

/html/body[1]/p[1]    lang="de"


Now, if "p" contains a "span" element, what would the language be? 



/html/body[1]/p[1]/span[1]    lang="de"

I would say certainly lang="de". I would also expect xml:lang to take precedence over lang only when defined on the same node, so I would expect the language to be "ja" on body.

 if node/@xml:lang: return node/@xml:lang
 if node/@lang: return node/@lang
 if node selected by a langRule: return value from rule
 if node.parent: return getLang(node.parent)
 else: return ""

Seems to me that's the same algorithm we use for all other data categories, except we don't define our own local attribute, using xml:lang and lang instead.




Received on Wednesday, 30 January 2013 14:43:44 UTC

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