MATF Minutes May 25, 2022

*MATF Minutes May 25, 2022
*
*Link**:****https://www.w3.org/2022/04/25-matf-minutes.html

Text of minutes:
*


  Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference


    25 April 2022


    Attendees

Present
    jjdg, Kim_patch, Perrin, Sally, VJ
Regrets
    -
Chair
    -
Scribe
    Kim_patch


    Contents

 1. logistics <https://www.w3.org/2022/04/25-matf-minutes.html#t01>
 2. feature map <https://www.w3.org/2022/04/25-matf-minutes.html#t02>
 3. Summary of action items
    <https://www.w3.org/2022/04/25-matf-minutes.html#ActionSummary>


    Meeting minutes

<Sally> Sally +

<jjdg> Some AxeCon sessions which might be interesting to watch: 
https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/creating-accessible-react-native-apps/ 
<https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/creating-accessible-react-native-apps/> 
https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/building-accessible-android-apps-with-jetpack-compose/ 
<https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/building-accessible-android-apps-with-jetpack-compose/> 
https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/swiftui-accessibility-goodies-gotchas/ 
<https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/swiftui-accessibility-goodies-gotchas/> 
https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/accessible-by-design-the-nab-mobile-banking-app/ 
<https://www.deque.com/axe-con/sessions/accessible-by-design-the-nab-mobile-banking-app/>


      logistics


      feature map

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1j1-C7t4sHtJqLT4YKJqLfJIl28DET6gYBQPczDFDWpY/edit#gid=0 
<https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1j1-C7t4sHtJqLT4YKJqLfJIl28DET6gYBQPczDFDWpY/edit#gid=0>

Jan: doing something similar for developers, later this year

Jan: also analytics

VJ: I want to do with the other way around. I choose and everything I 
logon to knows

VJ: another group, lived experiences people who are using smart phones 
and iPads every day and I sit and observe. There is loads of stuff that 
comes up. Ongoing Miro board based case study based around that might 
produce some interesting insights and specific questions.

VJ: seems access to mid-level smart phone technology – being used to 
create access to daily life for certain people who are using 
accessibility features may be nontraditional that are just the standard 
use of the smart phone

Sally: something I think that there is little research – fact that most 
people have multiple access needs. I think that doesn't come across at 
all in the literature

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eWyuPdzlLsYoKsuQdtrOYvGZklMJNpjsr1rehA-ORBU/edit#gid=0 
<https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1eWyuPdzlLsYoKsuQdtrOYvGZklMJNpjsr1rehA-ORBU/edit#gid=0>

Jan: I'm interested in videos – how they are using their phones. Also 
good examples of what apps work well, what kind of features make apps 
work well

VJ: I've been using and explain everything board so you can do video. 
I've been breaking apart documents and adding voice memos at the point 
when something comes up

Sally: ethics to publish and share the data

VJ: there's a dearth of research – hard to find and a lot of people 
saying the same things. Trying to prompt other people to get some 
research actually happening.

VJ and Sally to connect on ethics

Jan:

Jan: another question is what makes people exit an app.

Sally: people complaining about uber eats does not work well the screen 
reader, and menu log hit and miss. Door dash has come to New Zealand but 
there are no restaurantson it yet.

Jan: when an app is really accessible you have a lot of loyal users, 
then others use it

VJ: it's very evident that some developers have absolutely no idea where 
to start. The one thing we are doing with these guys we took the WCAG 
guidelines and there's 84 problems with the way it's been built. Code is 
one great big block and not in the proper order.

VJ: they have no idea where to start other than they probably have to 
start again from the ground up because it's that complex. I think a lot 
of people are in that situation. This idea of prebuilt blocks to solve 
the problem for them. There's lots of good intentions.

VJ: need good directions for developers – APIs, what is good

Jan: one of the main problems I found is auditors do an audit and then 
you receive maybe even 100 pages of what's wrong but a lot of times 
there's no solutions. So they know it's wrong but they don't know how to 
fix it. Developer gets this report handed to you and you have no idea 
how to fix issues that are in the report. That's the biggest issue I've seen

Sally: developers and actual end-users aren't really talking

VJ: guidelines tell people what to do but not how to do it.

Sally: not embedded into what the developers learn a lot of the time and 
perhaps we need to attack it from that

Jan: expand the techniques – right now 0 for android

Jan: you see HTML but I'm a mobile developer why am I seeing HTML I want 
to see my own programming language. I think that's the most common – 
they feel left out maybe and then say I can't do anything with this and 
just exit

Sally: WCAG all focused on the web and there isn't a lot from others.

VJ: can we find out who is offering Masters level degrees in mobile 
development? Those students could potentially provide the answers to 
what they needs the guidelines to say.

Sally: have to put it through ethics but we could put a survey together 
– that has been done there are some studies listed in the references. 
Most of them published 2021 2022 that have asked the question of did you 
learn this developers but small samples of 20 developers, may be bigger 
survey

VJ: developers with lived experience – what they feel would most benefit 
those learning this right now in terms of guidelines or what they 
observe in their experience working like this and trying out these 
different ways of developing – but they come across

Sally: but if we come up with some survey questions and came back next 
time. Once we have survey questions in a research question I can make a 
proposal

Jan: we are doing something similar – writing a survey for developers – 
how do they come up with accessibility. Not academic but a quick way for 
information

Sally: if we can use the same survey questions that would be good

Sally: easier to get a survey through ethics

Sally: question for users – how many of them have multiple needs and how 
that impacts how they use software

Sally: that adds another layer of complexity that hasn't been addressed

*ACTION:* Jan to send research questions to Sally, add them to Docs to 
take a look at next time.

Error finding 'Jan'. You can review and register nicknames at 
<https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/track/users 
<https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/track/users>>.

no meeting next week. Next meeting May 9.

**


-- 
______________________________________

Kimberly Patch
(617) 325-3966

patchontech.com
@patchontech
scriven.com/kimpatch
______________________________________