- From: Kim Patch <kim@redstartsystems.com>
- Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2014 12:11:40 -0400
- To: "public-mobile-a11y-tf@w3.org" <public-mobile-a11y-tf@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <542D793C.8020501@redstartsystems.com>
<http://www.w3.org/>MATF Minutes URL:
http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html
Text of minutes:
Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
02 Oct 2014
Agenda2
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-mobile-a11y-tf/2014Sep/0016.html>
See also: IRC log3 <http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-irc>
Attendees4
Present
Kim_Patch, Kathy_Wahlbin, Jeanne, Andrew_Kirkpatrick, Detlev,
Brent_Shiver, Jan, Jon
Regrets
Alan
Chair
Kathleen_Wahlbin
Scribe
Kim_patch
Contents
* Topics5 <http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html#agenda>
1. 15 minute discussion to talk about techniques people are working
on.6 <http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html#item01>
2. Technique Survey -
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140916_survey/. This
survey includes the suggested revisions to G9 from the WCAG
Working Group.7
<http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html#item02>
3. NEW survey
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140929_survey/8
<http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html#item03>
* Summary of Action Items9
<http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-mobile-a11y-minutes.html#ActionSummary>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
<trackbot> Date: 02 October 2014
<scribe> Scribe: Kim_patch
<Kathy>
https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Technique_Development_Assignments10
15 minute discussion to talk about techniques people are working on.
Kathy: we have all of the ones assigned in G4 except 1
... questions on techniques that have been assigned
Jon: often not a way to hide or return to the alternative, on mobile
there really isn't embedded content
<Kathy> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G82.html11
Jon: canvas really isn't method to hide, remove or mask it (G82). I can
take that one and add a canvas example. Anything else people can
recommend -- are there any canvas techniques?
Andrew: don't know
Kathy: sending a technique by Monday means it will get on the survey for
the next week, survey Tuesday morning to give people time to review
before Thursday's call
Technique Survey -
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140916_survey/.12
<https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140916_survey/> This
survey includes the suggested revisions to G9 from the WCAG
Working Group.
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140916_survey/results13
Kathy: survey from a couple weeks ago. We've gone through some of these,
I want to get them wrapped up and finished
... #1 G4 accepted as proposed, but I wanted to bring up the WCAG
working group was working on additional language to put into the
description. One of the things that they were looking at adding was
information about standard keyboard interface. Suggested change would
include "a standard keyboard interface is always required under 2.2.1...
<Kathy> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20120103/G4.html14
Kathy: Katie and I talked about this on Tuesday after the WCAG working
group call. The problem with adding that is if we are going to modify
the description we need to include some additional language. The second
sentence says a mechanism can be provided either by interactive control
to conform to WCAG or by keyboard shortcuts.
<Kathy> This mechanism can be provided either through interactive
controls that conform to WCAG or through keyboard shortcuts. Standard
keyboard interface accessibility is always required (under 2.1.1), and
if non-standard keyboard shortcuts are used, they are documented.
Kathy: wanted to bring that to the task force to see what your thoughts
are on that -- what you think of modifying the description overall
... I want to make sure the language is consistent -- keyboard access is
always referred to in a similar way. Right now we've got language that
we are adding -- or a keyboard interface such as an on-screen keyboard -
into other techniques. One of my concerns here is I'm wondering if we
need that clarification to this and that also that second sentence maybe
needs "custom shortcuts"
Detlev: situation where normally don't get virtual keyboard unless you
focus on some element that accepts text input so you wouldn't be able to
bring up a virtual keyboard -- not necessarily-- or you would have to
know how to do that so I'm confused whether that means accessible
content can only be provided to devices that will have some form of
either virtual or physical keyboards available...
... at all times -- I don't quite understand it
Kathy: keyboard refers to physical keyboard or on-screen keyboard or
other interface
Detlev: but if you don't have a virtual keyboard how do you handle that
Jan: 2.1.1 may be a note somewhere that says maybe there are interfaces
without virtual keyboard
Kathy: if we add that sentence we are saying that is a problem
Detlev: you can also stop content by tapping or something else or
keyboard wouldn't be the only way to conform
Kathy: if the sentence gets added -- a keyboard interface is always
provided, then you don't have that option
Detlev: and it's just a technique that does not apply if there is no
keyboard
Jon: I think it's not necessary for us to add this here. For other
devices like the Windows phone obviously providing interactive control
would solve the problem. It is covered there. It would apply. In
addition we do have to solve the problem of the keyboard interface
because WCAG is so keyboard focused.
Kathy: we can come back and say that we don't feel it's necessary and
then let the WCAG working group decide. But if it is added I think we
need to use the language that we have been working on.
Andrew: I think it was Katie, I think David might've been another
person. Two different ways, focus on techniques and not muddy the
waters, or make sure to remind people what's important. If the mobile
group feels that it's muddying the waters then you should say so, and
can indicate that back for the WCAG group to discuss. Similarly if you
don't think so or if that's not a decision the...
... working group makes, you can make an action such that when you come
up with different keyboard language the WCAG group could commit to
remain in sync with that in places where that's mentioned.
Kathy: I think that's a good way to approach it..
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G915
<Kathy> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20120103/G9.html16
Kathy: G9 we have discussed this a couple of times. We have added can be
accessed on a mobile device, video and audio
... any other comments on those changes?
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140916_survey/results17
Jon: I agree with everything I'm good with it. As far as being alive,
the content document talks about live presentations so I'm glad we are
adding an example. This is a good update, modernizing the technique.
Andrew: is this a live webinar and you are viewing it on a mobile
device, or are you sitting in the room and getting the captions on the fly
Jan: live event in the room
Andrew: is there a way to clarify that further
Jon: in the latter example, if I'm in the room and a PowerPoint at the
same time?
Jan: no because it's not like coming across the web
... it's not media if you are watching the person in this stage in front
of you
... to clarify this is a webinar of a live event and you are seeing the
person's live video stream
<Detlev> sounds fine
<AWK> A live conference is streaming video with audio for remote
participants using Communication Access Real-Time Translation (CART) to
provide users who are Deaf or hard of hearing with speech to text
translation services that can be accessed on a mobile device (this also
helps on-site participants needing captioning)
Jeanne: why not just say a webinar? It seems more immediate -- everyone
understands what a webinar is
Andrew: trying to help people understand that it's a challenge. But I
understand, the biggest concern is if people read this and think it's
for a live event, someone will point out that that stuff is not live
content and so you don't need to meet WCAC with it
Kathy: any objections to not saying live conference and just saying webinar?
Jeanne: after remote participants put in parentheses webinar and that
covers both
<Kathy> A live conference is streaming video with audio for remote
participants (webinar) using Communication Access Real-Time Translation
(CART) to provide users who are Deaf or hard of hearing with speech to
text translation services that can be accessed on a mobile device (this
also helps on-site participants needing captioning).
Kathy: any objections to this text?
<Detlev> +1
Kathy: a live conference and a webinar for remote participants is
streaming...
Jan: a live conference streaming an audio video webinar for remote
participants
<Kathy> A live conference is streaming audio video webinar for remote
participants using Communication Access Real-Time Translation (CART) to
provide users who are Deaf or hard of hearing with speech to text
translation services that can be accessed on a mobile device (this also
helps on-site participants needing captioning).
Kathy: any objections to accepting this as amended?
<Jan> A live conference is streaming audio-video webinar for remote
participants using Communication Access Real-Time Translation (CART) to
provide users who are Deaf or hard of hearing with speech to text
translation services that can be accessed on a mobile device (this also
helps on-site participants needing captioning).
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G20218
G202
<Kathy> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G202.html19
Kathy: we've gone back and forth on this in terms of keyboard interface
in the language that were using. Instead of the keyboard emulator we
change that to keyboard interface. This one gets really into what we are
doing as far as adding definitions for the keyboard interface to clarify
this and using keyboard interface as the term we are using because that
is actually defined already within WCAG
... anything further changed or does anyone think this needs further
discussion?
<Jan> Check that all functionality can be accessed using only the
keyboard or keyboard interface, such as via an onscreen keyboard
controllable by external switches.
Kathy: any objections?
no objections heard
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140929_survey/20
NEW survey https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140929_survey/21
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G2122
G21
<Kathy> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20120103/G21.html23
<http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20120103/G21.html>
Kathy: this is about ensuring that users are not trapped within content
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/66524/20140929_survey/results24
<Detlev> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G2125
Detlev: I thought it worthwhile to make it more general by mentioning
tab key, arrow key, swiping for focus
<Kathy> Ensuring that the keyboard function for advancing focus within
content in a device-supported way (e.g., the tab key, arrow key or
swiping gestures) exits the subset of the content after it reaches the
final navigation location.
<Kathy> Ensuring that the keyboard function for advancing focus within
content in a device-supported way (e.g. via the tab key, arrow key or
swiping gestures) exits the subset of the content after it reaches the
final navigation location.
Kathy: any objections?
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G7826
no objections heard
Kathy: we will accept this one is amended
Detlev: Sentence hard to understand. It may need some rewording to make
it easier to understand
Kathy: suggestions?
... could send this to the working group and see what they say
Detlev: I like examples that show it, but this might not be the place
for that. If they want to reword it to make it clearer I would be good
with that.
Kathy: objections to sending with note about clarifying
G85
<Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/G8527
Jon: if it's not in the test, it's not a requirement
Jan: makes it sound like the author is on the hook to provide the
sounds, vibrations. But actually it's much better to have something in
the markup, and then the user agent decides how to get across in error
... also the was mention of HTML5 examples and that didn't happen
Kathy: I was leaving that up to the HTML5 task force
Detlev: it's quite difficult to grasp what the different methods of
providing error handling -- how they would interact. The classic
scenario is just client-side check and behind that service side checks,
but now you have HTML 5 built in.
... in many cases it's an either or, either something at the top, or
on-the-fly pop-ups. so it often seems to be either or ways of dealing
with missing or erroneous input
Kathy: at another example. It's got a number of examples, one we added.
... second paragraph of description at the end -- what if we just took
out authors are advised...
<jon_avila> I have jump off the call.
Kathy: I'll put this one back on the survey and send it back out
Summary of Action Items28
[End of minutes]
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Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl29
<http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm>
version 1.138 (CVS log30 <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/>)
$Date: 2014-10-02 16:04:57 $
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--
___________________________________________________
Kimberly Patch
President
Redstart Systems, Inc.
(617) 325-3966
kim@redstartsystems.com
www.redstartsystems.com <http://www.redstartsystems.com>
- making speech fly
Blog: Patch on Speech
+Kim Patch
Twitter: RedstartSystems
www.linkedin.com/in/kimpatch <http://www.linkedin.com/in/kimpatch>
___________________________________________________
Received on Thursday, 2 October 2014 16:12:11 UTC