Re: Proposed SC on notification of dynamic changes to apage

the page has no way of knowing that the screen is zoomed and that changes are off screen at the moment.

If you mean off screen (scrolled off screen) when not zoomed - then this would be a problem for all users - and not an accessibility problem.


Maybe I don’t understand what you mean - but I think it is out of scope of WCAG one way or the other.  No? 



gregg

> On Jun 27, 2016, at 12:00 PM, Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Jim, David, and all,
> 
> On 6/22/16, Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu <mailto:jimallan@tsbvi.edu>> wrote:
>> Though this might have implications for low vision folks. Thoughts?
>> 
>> Jim
> 
> One thing that would have implications to people with low vision is if
> a change occurs outside of a person's "point of regard" [1]. The
> change needs to be in close proximity.  Maybe something such as the
> following would help.
> 
> "Change of content: Programmatic notification is provided within the
> point of regard for each change in content that indicates an action
> was taken or that conveys information, unless one or more of the
> following is true: (Level AA)"
> 
> Or maybe a separate SC language would be in order:
> 
> "Change of content: Visual notification is provided near each change
> in content that indicates an action was taken or that conveys
> information, unless one or more of the following is true: (Level AA)"
> 
> In addition, I wonder if the second escape clause should be an
> exemption. What about a person with low vision who does not use AT?
> 
> Kindest Regards,
> Laura
> 
> [1] "3.6 Point of Regard and Proximity
> The point of regard is the area that the user is viewing...Proximity
> is the space between items. In user interface generally, proximity is
> about using space to group related content and separate unrelated
> content."
> http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#point-of-regard-and-proximity <http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#point-of-regard-and-proximity>
> 
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com <mailto:david@can-adapt.com>>
>> Date: Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 4:16 PM
>> Subject: Re: Proposed SC on notification of dynamic changes to apage
>> To: ALAN SMITH <alands289@gmail.com <mailto:alands289@gmail.com>>
>> Cc: WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>>
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks Alan
>> 
>> I've provided an update based on discussions with another member.
>> 
>> SC x.x.x.x Change of content: Programmatic notification is provided for
>> each change in content that indicates an action was taken or that conveys
>> information, unless one or more of the following is true: (Level AA)
>> 
>> 1) The change immediately follows the control that triggered it, in the
>> programmatic reading order.
>> 2) There is an accessibility supported programmatic relationship between
>> the new content and the user activated control that triggers it.
>> 3) The primary purpose of the web page is to provide real time updates and
>> there are more than [x] updates a minute.
>> 
>> Note: The 3rd exception needs a bit of work, to get the balance between a
>> site that is bombarding a user with updates vs. helpfully notifying them.
>> Perhaps frequency threshold for the real time update exception could be
>> determined in consultation with a number of blind users.
>> 
>> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Proposed_SC_on_information_added_or_removed_from_a_page
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> David MacDonald
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> *Can**Adapt* *Solutions Inc.*
>> Tel:  613.235.4902
>> 
>> LinkedIn
>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100 <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100>>
>> 
>> twitter.com/davidmacd <http://twitter.com/davidmacd>
>> 
>> GitHub <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald>>
>> 
>> www.Can-Adapt.com <http://www.can-adapt.com/> <http://www.can-adapt.com/ <http://www.can-adapt.com/>>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> *  Adapting the web to all users*
>> *            Including those with disabilities*
>> 
>> If you are not the intended recipient, please review our privacy policy
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>> 
>> On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 1:08 PM, ALAN SMITH <alands289@gmail.com <mailto:alands289@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>>> David,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> This is perfect.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Thank you.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>> for
>>> Windows 10
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *From: *David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com <mailto:david@can-adapt.com>>
>>> *Sent: *Tuesday, June 21, 2016 12:49 PM
>>> *To: *ALAN SMITH <alands289@gmail.com <mailto:alands289@gmail.com>>
>>> *Cc: *WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>>
>>> *Subject: *Re: Proposed SC on notification of dynamic changes to apage
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi Allan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> If text of the page changed above the control there would have to be
>>> notification of that change under this SC. So if they changed the rates
>>> or
>>> something like that on the page when someone answers "yes" to smoking,
>>> notification would have to be made.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> For your second question. I've proposed an interim definition .... and
>>> changed the wording based on Jason's question.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> It now reads:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *SC x.x.x.x Change of content:* Programmatic notification is provided for
>>> changes in content that convey information, or indicate an action was
>>> taken, unless the changes immediately follow the control that triggered
>>> the
>>> change in the programmatic reading order. (Level AA)
>>> Definitions:
>>> 
>>> ·       *Programmatic notification: *Notification by software from data
>>> provided in a user-agent-supported manner such that the user agents can
>>> extract and present this notification to users in different modalities,
>>> without further action by the user, beyond focusing on, or activating the
>>> control which caused the change.
>>> 
>>> ·       *Change of content: *Changes made to a web page after it has been
>>> delivered to the user agent.
>>> 
>>> ·       *Programmatic Reading Order:* The order that a reading device
>>> such as a screen reader would parse the content. Usually, this is the
>>> same
>>> order as the code, and is represented as an accessibility tree. (note:
>>> this
>>> is an interim definition, that needs further tweaks)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> David MacDonald
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *Can**Adapt* *Solutions Inc.*
>>> 
>>> Tel:  613.235.4902
>>> 
>>> LinkedIn
>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100 <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100>>
>>> 
>>> twitter.com/davidmacd <http://twitter.com/davidmacd>
>>> 
>>> GitHub <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald>>
>>> 
>>> www.Can-Adapt.com <http://www.can-adapt.com/> <http://www.can-adapt.com/ <http://www.can-adapt.com/>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *  Adapting the web to all users*
>>> 
>>> *            Including those with disabilities*
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> If you are not the intended recipient, please review our privacy policy
>>> <http://www.davidmacd.com/disclaimer.html <http://www.davidmacd.com/disclaimer.html>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 12:36 PM, ALAN SMITH <alands289@gmail.com <mailto:alands289@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> David,
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Two things:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 1)      Should we also consider “changes in context which could be
>>> additional content that would change the context of the already
>>> understand
>>> or programically available information?”
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Changes in content can change context as noted in the various supporting
>>> documents for WCAG 2.0 3.2.2 On Input.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I see radio buttons that display further questions on health websites
>>> that
>>> not only display new questions but these questions themselves put the
>>> original question in a new context.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Do you smoke? Yes/no. No would not change the context but yes would
>>> because it will change the entire premise of the questions and end result
>>> of the survey and result of the questions due to changes in health rates,
>>> and other items. The previous questions would have been in the context of
>>> just personal information, but this question introduces a change in
>>> context
>>> as it would be indicating changes in coverage or rates, etc.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 2)      Can you also please add a definition of the final part of this
>>> SC?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> “if the changes *do not immediately follow the control *that triggered
>>> the change. (Level AA)”
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Thank you.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986>> for
>>> Windows 10
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *From: *David MacDonald <david@can-adapt.com <mailto:david@can-adapt.com>>
>>> *Sent: *Tuesday, June 21, 2016 12:12 PM
>>> *To: *WCAG <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org <mailto:w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>>
>>> *Subject: *Proposed SC on notification of dynamic changes to apage
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Here's a proposed wording for the dynamic content Success Criterion on
>>> dynamic content
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *=====*
>>> 
>>> *SC x.x.x.x Change of content:* Programmatic notification is provided for
>>> changes in content that convey information, or indicate an action was
>>> taken, if the changes do not immediately follow the control that
>>> triggered
>>> the change. (Level AA)
>>> 
>>> =====
>>> 
>>> *Definitions*
>>> 
>>> *Programmatic notification:* Notification by software from data provided
>>> in a user-agent-supported manner such that the user agents can extract
>>> and
>>> present this notification to users in different modalities, without
>>> further
>>> action by the user, beyond focusing on, or activating the control which
>>> caused the change.
>>> 
>>> *Change of content: *Changes made to a web page after it has been
>>> delivered to the user agent.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Proposed_SC_on_information_added_or_removed_from_a_page <https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Proposed_SC_on_information_added_or_removed_from_a_page>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> It is linked from the WIKI of proposed SCs
>>> 
>>> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/WCAG_2.1 <https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/WCAG_2.1>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> David MacDonald
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *Can**Adapt* *Solutions Inc.*
>>> 
>>> Tel:  613.235.4902
>>> 
>>> LinkedIn
>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100 <http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100>>
>>> 
>>> twitter.com/davidmacd <http://twitter.com/davidmacd>
>>> 
>>> GitHub <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald <https://github.com/DavidMacDonald>>
>>> 
>>> www.Can-Adapt.com <http://www.can-adapt.com/> <http://www.can-adapt.com/ <http://www.can-adapt.com/>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> *  Adapting the web to all users*
>>> 
>>> *            Including those with disabilities*
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> If you are not the intended recipient, please review our privacy policy
>>> <http://www.davidmacd.com/disclaimer.html <http://www.davidmacd.com/disclaimer.html>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator
>> Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
>> 1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
>> voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/ <http://www.tsbvi.edu/>
>> "We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Laura L. Carlson