W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-lod@w3.org > April 2009

Re: "humane" query editors for the data web?

From: Mike Bergman <mike@mkbergman.com>
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 21:24:46 -0500
Message-ID: <49EFD16E.1000608@mkbergman.com>
To: David Huynh <dfhuynh@alum.mit.edu>, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com>
CC: public-lod@w3.org
This has been a classic case of Cool Hand Luke and a failure to 
communicate.  Indeed, it happens all of the time in this forum.

David comes from a perspective of usability and user interfaces, 
granted with a JS bias.  Most all of us have recognized his 
genius for quite some time, and he is a leading innovator in such 
data presentation.

Kingsley has been a passionate advocate for data connectivity and 
overcoming all things "silo".  Middleware is his game (and OL's). 
  Data and manipulating data is his perspective, and we know the 
superior infrastructure that his personal and then corporate 
commitments to these issues have brought.

Benjamin notes today the difference in perspective.  Does it 
begin with the user experience, or does it begin with the data?

The answer, of course, is Yes.

David with JSON and MQL and other things FB might be criticized. 
  As he knows, I have done so personally offline and directly.

Kingsley might be criticized for facile hand-waving at UI and 
usability questions; he, too, knows I have made those points 

I truly don't know what our "community" really is or, if indeed, 
we even have one.  But I do know this:

All of us work on these issues because we believe in them and 
have passion.  So, I have a simple suggestion:

Keep looking outward.  We need to talk and speak to the 
"unaffiliated".  In that regard, David has the upper hand because 
presentation and flash will always be easier to understand for 
the non-cognescenti.  But, David, you know this too:  your job is 
easier if the nature of the data and its structure drives your 

There are HUGE, HUGE advantages of data driving interfaces and 
usability that neither of you are discussing.  Let's next turn 
our attention there and gain some major wins at no cost.


David Huynh wrote:
> Kingsley,
> Thanks for the resources and the detailed explanation! Looks like all 
> the pieces are there!
> David
> Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>> David Huynh wrote:
>>> Thanks for the link, Juan.
>>> Just curious, even if I know SPARQL, how do I (as a new user) know 
>>> which properties and types there are in the data? And what URIs to 
>>> use for what?
>> David,
>> Not speaking for Jaun, but seeking to answer the question you posed.
>> Our iSPARQL interface takes the view that:
>> 1. You lookup vocabularies and ontologies of interest before 
>> constructing triple patterns since the terms need to come from somewhere
>> 2. You then you use the ontology/vocabulary tree to drag and drop 
>> classes over Subject  and Object nodes
>> 3. Do the same thing re. properties by selecting them and dropping 
>> them over the connectors (predicates)
>> 4. Repeat the above until you've completely painted an SPO graph of 
>> what you seek.
>> BTW - the pattern in steps 2-4 above originated from RDF Author, and 
>> we simply adopted it for SPARQL (following a skype session I had with 
>> Danbri years ago re. the need for SPARQL QBE). Note: RDF Author 
>> allowed you to write Triples directly into RDF information resources 
>> via their URLs. Which means the same UI works fine for SPARUL (writing 
>> to Quad Store via its internal Graph IRI or Web Information Resource 
>> URL).
>> Links:
>> 1.  http://rdfweb.org/people/damian/RDFAuthor/Tutorial/ -- RDF Author
>> Kingsley
>>> David
>>> Juan Sequeda wrote:
>>>> You may want to check out a tool that we are working on: SQUIN
>>>> http://squin.informatik.hu-berlin.de/SQUIN/
>>>> Juan Sequeda, Ph.D Student
>>>> Dept. of Computer Sciences
>>>> The University of Texas at Austin
>>>> www.juansequeda.com <http://www.juansequeda.com>
>>>> www.semanticwebaustin.org <http://www.semanticwebaustin.org>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 22, 2009 at 9:18 PM, David Huynh <dfhuynh@alum.mit.edu 
>>>> <mailto:dfhuynh@alum.mit.edu>> wrote:
>>>>     Hi all,
>>>>     Admittedly this is somewhat of a tease and shameless
>>>>     self-promotion :-) but I think there are a few interesting
>>>>     concepts in the query editor for Freebase that I've been working
>>>>     on that can be very useful for querying and consuming LOD data 
>>>> sets:
>>>>       http://www.freebase.com/app/queryeditor/about
>>>>     Or maybe I missed it totally--is there anything similar for
>>>>     writing SPARQL queries over LOD?
>>>>     Cheers,
>>>>     David


Michael K. Bergman
CEO  Structured Dynamics LLC
Received on Thursday, 23 April 2009 02:25:33 UTC

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