- From: Gregg Kellogg <gregg@kellogg-assoc.com>
- Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 12:04:49 -0400
- To: Brian Peterson <publicayers@verizon.net>
- CC: "public-linked-json@w3.org" <public-linked-json@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <D52EA4F0-0E86-4034-A905-D8786437415D@kellogg-assoc.com>
On May 30, 2011, at 10:37 PM, Brian Peterson wrote: I ended up rolling up multiple values into a JSON array. So if I had multiple phone numbers, then it would be phoneNumber : ["123-555-6789", "111-222-3333"] Values in arrays can be strings, URIs, or nested objects for other those resources. Arrays are not be used as values themselves. This limitation has had no practical impact for us because we aggressively avoid RDF lists. Other simplifications that we use: - Only simple literals, no language tagging and no datatyping. - URIs appeared as simple literals. Our developers were very much against embedding structure within JSON strings, which ruled out tags, datatypes, and angle-bracketing URIs. These simplifications will rule out many RDF use cases, but it was quite evident that the advantages outweighed the drawbacks. I hope to use rdf:domain and rdf:range assertions on the vocabulary (or perhaps in the profile) to help mitigate the drawbacks. This is where the @coerce in JSON-LD can come in handy. When serializing an RDF graph with typed literals I can create @coerce mappings so that the actual values are just plain strings. If you were to come up with a standardized profile (like a remote @context), you could add information such as this so that the semantic representations could be inferred. For the common case where plain literals in a JSON serialization might have a common language, @coerce might be extended to coerce particular properties to have a language, e.g.: { "@context": {"@coerce": "en-us" : ["dcterms:title", "dcterms:description"]}} .. } On the "link" objects: I originally had just "profile" on the root object, but talked myself into treating it like another web link, analogous to the HTML link elements (I think the RDFa profile reference appears in a link element). So other links for the resource would also end up in that structure rather than mixing with the RDF properties of the resource: link : { profile : {...}, next : {...} ... } With a hypothetical change to JSON-LD, should could be something like the following: { "@context": "http://link-to-remote-profile" ... } which could have the same semantics as a locally defined profile, but it allows for a remote (and exhaustive) definition of term and @coerce mappings. Each mapping in the link object maps to another object, one modeled along the lines of the Web Links RFC (http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5988). I like the symmetry with XHTML links, the generality of treating the profile as another link, and keeping these links separate from the RDF properties on the resource; however, I do like the simplicity of a simple "profile" mapping on the root object. I'm also not sure it was worth trying to model the Web Links in the RFC. Brian -----Original Message----- From: public-linked-json-request@w3.org<mailto:public-linked-json-request@w3.org> [mailto:public-linked-json-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Richard Cyganiak Sent: Monday, May 30, 2011 7:44 PM To: Brian Peterson Cc: public-linked-json@w3.org<mailto:public-linked-json@w3.org> Subject: Re: experiences promoting a JSON format for RDF +1 This resonates with my experience when negotiating with JSON developers. I would quite like to have a well-defined format like this. I find the link/profile/rel/anchor thing a bit complicated (why not just profile:"http://..." on the root object?) and would like to see how to deal with multi-valued properties. Best, Richard On 30 May 2011, at 23:10, Brian Peterson wrote: I work in a group within a much larger organization. Part of my job in this group is to promote the adoption of Linked Data as an enterprise-wide architecture, including supporting RDF. Manu asked (in a previous posting) for some feedback and suggestions for a JSON format. I thought I'd contribute an overview of the JSON format that we came up with to help promote Linked Data throughout our enterprise. It is easy enough to convince other development groups to adopt REST and to use URIs to identify their web resources. It was impossible to convince Javascript developers to adopt RDF. An initial JSON format for RDF that included URIs or CURIEs for properties went nowhere. Javascript developers would never chose to work in that format, and service developers consuming JSON would never choose to use it; consequently, services would never include support for it. They would always end up with custom JSON that had little relation to RDF. We still wanted to eventually get to where RDF was supported throughout the enterprise. So the challenge was to design a JSON format that encoded RDF without looking like RDF, without requiring developers to lean and understand RDF. I know most people look at RDF from the perspective of graphs. I started looking at RDF and promoting it as a formalization of hypermedia links, and as a pattern for designing resources - a resource has properties, and these properties have values (SPO - a triple). Looking at RDF more as a resource description framework (not intended to be flippant) and less as a vehicle for logical semantics and graph models made it much easier for system engineers, architects and developers to understand and utilize. This helped focus the role of RDF in the day-in-a-life of a developer to something they could work with. Suddenly RDF was so scary and confusing. I then took a lesson from the RDFa specification for vocabulary profiles. I haven't looked at the RDFa 1.1 specification recently, but at one time the idea was to use profiles to make keywords to URIs. This was exactly what I needed to make an RDF+JSON accessible to regular Javascript and service developers. Our RDF+JSON started looking like this: { uri : "http://ex.org/hr/people/123", name : "Brian Peterson", phoneNumber : "123-555-6789", address : { street : "123 Sesame St", city : "New York", state: "NY" }, link : { profile : { rel : "profile", anchor : "http://ex.org/vocabs/hr/profile" } } } The "uri" is the URI for the resource. The "link" mapping was intended to be analogous to the link element in XHTML, mapping from the link type to an object representing the link. The "profile" link is to the vocabulary profile for the resource. That profile would map the tokens "name", "phoneNumber", "address", "street", "city", and "state" (and possibly others) to their vocabulary URIs (I this case, probably a mix of FOAF and maybe others). So except for the "uri" and the "link" elements, this would look almost exactly like what a developer would have designed themselves without thinking about RDF. However, the use of those profiles and the standard usage of uri and link.profile keywords, we can generate RDF from this JSON when we need it. I understand that this style of RDF+JSON would not fit all use cases for RDF in JSON, but it makes it a lot easier to get other non-semantic-web groups to start using RDF in their linked data architecture. So we also have another format that looks much more like RDF (looks kind of like the JSON-LD) that is available for use cases that need it. So perhaps having several formats would be useful. The simple format for the simple cases and to help adoption, then another more traditional RDF for the hard core cases. Brian
Received on Tuesday, 31 May 2011 16:05:55 UTC