Re: Proposal to close ISSUE-19: Adressing more error cases, as is

On 6/5/13 12:39 PM, Erik Wilde wrote:
> that's a lot of generic cut/paste content, but still no concrete 
> answer to the concrete question at hand: how would a client with no 
> prior knowledge of LDP find out how to interact with an LDP resource, 
> using its hypermedia affordances?

By understanding that LDP is not about hypermedia affordances solely. It 
is about hypermedia and entity relationship semantics affordnaces. BTW 
-  instead of using the mysterious "affordances" word, what's wrong with 
the words like  "facilitates" or "enable" -- which are generally 
understood my the majority of folks?


Hypermedia is part of the picture, not the picture in its entirety.

Facts:

The Web fused Hypermedia and TCP/IP.

RDF based Linked Data adds First-order logic based entity relationship 
semantics to the mix.

Everything is Related. The only thing in question are:

1. relationship participants -- entity identifiers
2. relationship type -- Web Linking (<link/> and/or "Link: " header) 
tells you (clearly) that links denote relations (these are sets of 
relationships)
3. relationships -- what an RDF triple represents.

Do cut and paste my example to a file, then follow-your-nose to what the 
Web was always supposed to be. It was never an un-semantic Web it was 
always a Semantic Web where entity types, relationship participants, and 
relationship semantics would evolve.

Please don't make reference to "cut and paste" if you haven't actually 
performed the act. I provided that example for a reason.


Kingsley


> given that you haven't explained how that works so far, i'll go with 
> henry's response, which said that this wasn't possible and indeed, a 
> client would need to have built-in knowledge of LDP to be able to 
> interact with LDP resources. cheers, dret.
>
> On 2013-06-05 4:41 , Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>> On 6/5/13 1:13 AM, Erik Wilde wrote:
>>> hello kingsley.
>>>
>>> On 2013-06-04 15:17 , Kingsley Idehen wrote:
>>>> On the assumption that we both agree there is no such thing as
>>>> unstructured data:
>>>> HTTP (Hypertext Transfer Protocol) transfers Data.
>>>> RDF (Resource Description Framework)  enables you describe and
>>>> understand Data.
>>>> RDF based Linked Data enables you describe, understand, and refer to
>>>> Data by combining the items above.
>>>
>>> now that sounds really great, but it really is a bit generic. would
>>> you mind spelling out for alexandre and me how a client that has no
>>> prior knowledge of LDP will, when it encounters text/turtle LDP
>>> resources, be able to figure out which links to follow with which
>>> interactions (GET/PUT/POST/PATCH), what to send as request payload,
>>> and what that is going to do in terms of LDP protocol semantics? 
>>> thanks!
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>>
>>> dret.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Simple, bearing in mind the assumption that LDP means "Linked Data
>> Platform" i.e., the principled approach outlined in TimBL's meme about
>> Linked Data applies.
>>
>> Steps:
>>
>> 1. denote (name or "refer to") entities using HTTP URIs.
>> 2. create a document at a Web Addresses (an HTTP URI/URL) so that entity
>> names (from #1) can resolve to the content of these documents.
>> 3. use the RDF model (a W3C standard) to create document content that
>> describes the named entities (from #1) i.e., describe these entities
>> using RDF statements re., document content.
>> 4. make your entity descriptions richer (and more useful) by adding
>> relations that associate them with other entities .
>>
>> #4 means: keep on adding more RDF statements to your entity description
>> as you discover more about the entity you are describing.
>>
>> The text/turtle matter:
>>
>> RDF (Resource Description Framework) is a composite comprised of:
>>
>> 1. Model -- First-order logic foundation
>> 2. Syntax -- note, this is the grammar of the model
>> 3. RDF Data Expression Notation -- this is where Turtle comes into play
>> 4. Actual RDF Data Serialization -- Turtle also plays here.
>>
>> An RDF based system that also supports Linked Data principles MUST
>> assume that text/turtle content is either RDF expression (meaning: text
>> to be post processed en route to manifesting an RDF graph) or that its
>> actually a serialization of an RDF graph).
>>
>> Every Relation (these are entities denoted by URIs too) in RDF is
>> denoted by URI. The Relation entity plays the predicate role in an RDF
>> statement (another entity). The predicate is the relationship
>> facilitator comprised of a Subject and an Object.
>>
>> # Turtle Notation (describing entities using a collection of RDF
>> statements/relationships) #
>>
>> <>
>> a <#Document>;
>> <#describes> <#StatementX>, <#subject>, <#object> .
>>
>> <#StatementX>
>> a <#RDFStatement> ;
>> <#subject> <>;
>> <#object> <#Document> ;
>> <#describedBy> <>.
>>
>> # Turtle end #
>>
>> Now, barring any typos, you can cut an paste the above into a document
>> and then publish the document to the Web using then  file create, save,
>> and share pattern. Share the URL of the document, then based on the
>> rules outlined you will be able to follow-your-nose (via HTTP URI
>> de-reference) through the graph that manifests.
>>
>> Everything is related. The only question is how? This is what RDF based
>> Linked Data is all about i.e., denote entities using URIs such that URIs
>> resolve to their meaning via RDF based content that describes the URI's
>> referent.
>>
>> This is ultimately a game of true or false since each Relation is a
>> function. Thus, publishing the Turtle content above is enough to prove
>> or disprove my claims. We don't need lengthy wordy arguments for 
>> that  :-)
>>
>


-- 

Regards,

Kingsley Idehen 
Founder & CEO
OpenLink Software
Company Web: http://www.openlinksw.com
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