Minutes of IETF/W3C Liaison Call, 2011-06-13

IETF/W3C Liaison Call, June 13, 2011

Attendees: Mark Nottingham, Stephen Farrell, Peter Saint-Andre, Robert
Sparks, Pete Resnick, Russ Housley, Gonzalo Camarillo, Thomas Roessler,
Philippe Le Hagaret, Alissa Cooper, Hannes Tschofenig, Sean Turner

Regrets: John Klensin, Alexey Melnikov

- Choose scribe

Scribe: Peter Saint-Andre

- Agenda bashing

Alexey suggested HTTP Authentication BoF
Peter suggested vCard4

- HTTP-AUTH BoF [ Peter ]

Ongoing discussion for years; might be helpful to have a BoF NOT about
starting a working group at the IETF, but to get issues on the table,
become clear on the problems to be solved. Mark: done deal? Peter: BoF
Coordination call is on Thursday, so will know soon; seems to be general
agreement (e.g., among Apps and Security ADs) that it'd be productive.

- W3C Identity in the Browser Workshop summary  [ Thomas ]
  <http://www.w3.org/2011/identity-ws/>
  http://www.w3.org/QA/2011/06/workshop_tackles_the_hard_prob.html

Summary from Thomas. Major outcome: crypto APIs in the browser, concrete
proposal from Mozilla. Also some discssion about integration of identity
technologies into browser (how can expose through JavaScript API),
identity support in HTML Forms (e.g., prepopulate username from IDP),
private browsing, cookies, even security indicators.

Question from Mark regarding HTTP authentication: are the browser
vendors involved? Peter: would need to double-check list traffic, and if
there is interest in moving forward then we would need to make sure that
those folks are involved.

- RFC 3536bis [Pete]

Internationalisation terminology document update, follow-on to IDNA
work. Currently in AD  evaluation, will go in for IETF Last Call soon.
Thomas: please forward the Last Call to the liaison list so we can make
sure that W3C folks are on board with consistent terminology.

ACTION: Pete to send notice of RFC3536bis Last Call to the public list,
mailto:public-ietf-w3c@w3.org

- TAG/IAB meeting summary / outcomes  [ PLH ]

Informational, one-hour meeting last week, mostly a meet-and-greet. (TAG
was meeting in person, brought in IAB via phone.) Desire to work
together more in the future. Topics discussed briefly: (1) versioning
and extensibility (2) security (3)  privacy. Next steps: (1) try to have
a joint face-to-face meeting at some point, (2) come up with a set of
recommendations about what TAG and IAB should focus on going forward.

Thomas asked: any ideas on what those topics should be? Mark: I think a
face-to-face conversation would be much more productive than trying to
figure that out here. PLH: also need to see list of topics that are
discussed by each group so that we can compare and contrast.

ACTION: liaisons on both sides to gather list of current activities /
interests in prep for discussions in Quebec City.

- HTML5 Last Call  [ PLH ]
  <http://www.w3.org/2011/02/htmlwg-pr.html>

Last Call started on May 24. Deadline for comments August 3. Expect a
lot of feedback. Group is still working through open issues of its own,
outside of additional comments. Any comments not received by August 3
might not be considered before early 2012, so important that people
provide feedback during the comment period. Relevant for HTTPBIS WG,
RTCWEB WG, perhaps others.

ACTION: Mark to circulate HTML5 LC to appropriate IETF groups.
ACTION: PLH to supply list of sections that TAG is reviewing to the IAB.
Related item: task force on HTML/XML. Report forthcoming in next month
or so.

- IETF IRI WG  [ Peter ]

Peter: Chairs and some participants have discussed coming up with a
tightly scoped subset of work that could be used as a reference by the
HTML WG at W3C. The  larger effort for 3987bis will take more time, but
there's a strong desire to get something done to be referenced by HTML.
Hopefully we can get something finished; work ongoing before and at
Quebec, but it'll be tight. It would be a very small spec covering
limited topics.

Thomas: What are the risks? How can we help? What's your feeling as to
how likely it'll succeed?

Peter: As always, the main risk is that we don't have enough people who
know the issues. We've worked to get browser folks involved; the draft
coming out soon is more practical (not so much discussion of the "big"
issues). Getting feedback from browser vendors is very helpful, risk is
losing their attention. Regarding the chances of success, it'd be
helpful to  have a discussion about what we'll do if we can't get it
finished. We need to look at what is referenced now in HTML5 and what it
needs to say if we don't have success.

PLH: The text in the HTML spec will need a refresh in any case, I think.

ACTION: Peter to talk with IRI WG Chairs, look at HTML5 spec. Set up a
call very soon to discuss in more detail.

ACTION: PLH to loop in W3C HTML5 participant.

- IETF RTCWeb WG / W3C RTCWeb  [ Gonzolo / PLH ]
 <http://rtc-web.alvestrand.com/w3c-activity>

Meeting in Quebec City. Problem so far has been scheduling. Proposed
Friday at end of IETF meeting, not ideal. Working with scheduling people
to see if  we can get a room on Saturday before IETF meeting, or perhaps
sometime on Sunday. Decision in next few days.

Actually a W3C meeting, workshop could be attended by anyone as long as
they register (not IETF registration, but separate registration). Held
near IETF to encourage involvement. Mark: Is there a W3C working group
now?  PLH: yes. Mark: seems like liaison relationship is working well
here, good coordination.

- IETF HYBI / W3C WebSockets API  [ Peter / PLH ]

Peter: Updated version of the protocol draft was published about a week
ago. There's been lots of feedback; open issues are narrowed. Desire for
LCs soon (weeks, not months). Lots of personal coordination between the
Ian Fette (protocol I-D) and Ian Hickson (API document). Alexey Melnikov
has volunteered to help IanF with editing, to move forward quickly.

PLH: Editor has been fixing bugs in the API document, but we still have
some open issues, with discussion. Not quite ready to move to LC, but
moving forward.

Mark: I did have one concern earlier about a bit of a mismatch between
the capabiltilies of the protocol vs. the API, but it seems that
coordination has been occurring and this is being worked out.

- IETF WebSec WG / W3C Web Security WG  [ Peter / Thomas ]

Thomas: Current status on W3C group is that we have firm commitments on
Chairs, some  small suggestions on charter from the incoming chairs, AC
vote likely in a few weeks.

Peter:  Not a lot of activity in WebSec WG, will be a meeting in Quebec
City. Have been several reviews of draft-ietf-websec-origin, will likely
move forward first (possibly after a bit more editing). Longer term
framework stuff is still quiet, HSTS is quiet for the moment, will
likely follow same-origin.

ACTION: Peter to send reminder for feedback about same-origin to
mailto:public-ietf-w3c@w3.org

- John Kemp's security work  [ Larry ]
  <http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/02/security-web.html>

Mark: might there be an appropriate home for this work in the IETF or
elsewhere? Perhaps would be relevant for the long-standing work item on
the security properties of HTTP within the HTTPBIS WG.

ACTION: Mark to follow up on finding a home for this work.

- W3C Tracking Privacy Workshop summary [ Thomas ]
  <http://www.w3.org/2011/track-privacy/report>

Thomas: shopping around a charter proposal; likely also to charter an
interest group.

Stephen: would DNT HTTP header be developed at W3C? Thomas: Yes.

Peter: from coordination perspective, would want to get input from IETF
folks at the appropriate time.

Stephen: One question was, is this an "evil bit"? Basing policy on a
fiction, perhaps. But not a liaison issue.

- vCardbis

Peter: Previous discussion with Portable Contacts, OMA, etc. The two WG
documents (draft-ietf-vcarddav-vcardrev and
draft-ietf-vcarddav-vcardxml) are now in the RFC Editor queue.

Thomas: contacts API has been out in a working draft for a while, we
would want to make those folks aware of the vCard4 progress.
Mark: does that document reference the Portable Contacts schema?

Thomas: need to check.

PLH: we've been talking about recharting this group. Also concern about
lack of engagement from browser vendors.

- W3C Staff at IETF Quebec City

Mark: some folks will be at IETF 81. PLH Sunday and Monday. Mark has
asked for scheduling of HTTPBIS meeting on Monday. Yves Lafon will
probably be there as well. Perhaps also Francois regarding RTCWEB.

Thomas: my suggestion would be to hold the meetings that require input
and coordination on Monday (e.g., IRI).

- Next call planning  [ Mark ]

ACTION: Mark to schedule meeting, probably on July 18.

END