ALReq Weekly Meeting, 7 March 2017: Telecon Minutes

Minutes from the meeting today available here:
https://www.w3.org/2017/03/07-alreq-minutes.html

Text snapshot follows.

-Behnam


                   ALReq Weekly Meeting, 7 March 2017

07 Mar 2017

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2017/03/07-alreq-irc

Attendees

   Present
          najib, behnam, mostafa, ebrahim, r12a

   Regrets
          shervin

   Chair
          Behnam

   Scribe
          mostafa

Contents

     * [3]Topics
     * [4]Summary of Action Items
     * [5]Summary of Resolutions
     __________________________________________________________

   <r12a>
   [6]https://w3c.github.io/i18n-drafts/articles/typography/justif
   ication.en

      [6] https://w3c.github.io/i18n-drafts/articles/typography/justification.en

   <scribe> ScribeNick: mostafa

   <behnam>
   [7]https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track/
   actions/open?sort=owner

      [7] https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track/actions/open?sort=owner

   Mostafa: Started collecting images for action-48. Will upload
   them when I’m done with more images.

   Najib: I have some examples for action-81. I’ll upload them
   when I have more examples.

   Behnam: You can also upload them to the other repository.
   ... Instead of just our issue comments.

   Najib: +1

   <r12a> [8]https://github.com/w3c/type-samples

      [8] https://github.com/w3c/type-samples

   Najib: Which one is the preference?

   <r12a> [9]https://w3c.github.io/type-samples/

      [9] https://w3c.github.io/type-samples/

   Richard: You can upload examples of typography here.
   ... A few things to remember: One is to not swamp the
   repository with similar things.
   ... Two is to link to or embed images here from our ALReq repo
   so that people will be able to find them.

   <najib>
   [10]https://w3c.github.io/i18n-drafts/articles/typography/justi
   fication.en

     [10] https://w3c.github.io/i18n-drafts/articles/typography/justification.en

   [11]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/pull/89

     [11] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/pull/89

   Mostafa: This PR includes several updates to the character
   tables.

   [12]http://static.kolah.ir/alreq/#characters-tables

     [12] http://static.kolah.ir/alreq/#characters-tables

   scribe: Some are stylistics. Some are related to the content,
   like not excluding ASCII characters.

   I also checked including country codes in my locales, but the
   change was having European digits.

   scribe: I also checked including country codes in my locales,
   but the change was having European digits.
   ... So, I removed that change.
   ... Also, I changed the alt text of character images to
   character names, so we don’t have control characters in your
   documents any more. Some validator warnings will go away with
   this.

   Najib: I see some letters that are not used in Arabic: Arabic
   Hamza above, for example.
   ... Also, less-than sign, equal sign, should also be marked for
   Arabic.
   ... And the same for controlc characters like RTL, …. .

   Richard: I think we have two separate issues: format issues and
   content issues. The format part looks good now.
   ... The content part is discussed by Najib.
   ... I suggest we merge it now, so that we have it.
   ... And keep the discussion for further changes.

   Behnam: +1

   Mostafa: +1. We can keep our discussion in our issue,
   Shortcomings of Characters Table.

   [13]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/49

     [13] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/49

   <najib> +1

   <behnam> action Najib to review Characters Table for AR
   language

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-87 - Review characters table for ar
   language [on Najib Tounsi - due 2017-03-14].

   <behnam> action+ Najib to review Characters Table for AR
   language

   <behnam> +1

   Behnam: I’m moving issue #49, shortcomings of characters table,
   to the review section of our drafting table.
   ... In the diacritics table Fatha, Damma, are marked as
   auxiliary, but Fathatan, Dammatan are marked as used.

   Mostafa: This comes from CLDR. I guess it is because Fatha,
   Damma, can be removed without affecting text.
   ... But Fathatan, … are part of some words and can not be
   removed from a word.

   <najib>
   [14]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/wiki/Arabic-numerals-(Draft)

     [14] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/wiki/Arabic-numerals-(Draft)

   <behnam> [15]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/projects/1

     [15] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/projects/1

   <behnam> [16]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/62

     [16] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/62

   <behnam> [17]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/59

     [17] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/59

   <behnam> [18]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/85

     [18] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/85

   <najib> [19]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/62 points to
   [20]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/wiki/Arabic-numerals-(Draft)

     [19] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/62
     [20] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/wiki/Arabic-numerals-(Draft)

   <najib> only 62

   Behnam: What is the place of this new numeral draft in the
   document?
   ... In which section?

   <najib> section 3.8 Arabic numbering

   Mostafa: Maybe section 3.8, “Arabic numbering”?

   Behnam: Creating a new issue to track drafting this section.
   ... This is different from #62, because that only concerns a
   bidi issue.
   ... This is now issue #101.
   ... Still working on issue #97.
   ... Najib, are you interested in #59 as part of the numeral
   section?

   <najib> Yes, I already put some comments there.

   Behnam: Taking issue #82 as I’m already working on the joining
   section.

   <behnam> [21]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/101

     [21] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/101

   <behnam> [22]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/82

     [22] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/82

   <behnam> [23]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/99

     [23] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/99

   Behnam: A discussion about spacing is whether increase the
   space after the period.
   ... This also comes up around other punctuations.
   ... These are some of the issues that we want to talk about.

   Mostafa: Wondering if this topic is too detailed for the scope
   of our document.
   ... Specially that these are general typography discussions,
   not specially about Arabic.

   Richard: I’m wondering what will be useful for someone
   implementing CSS parts.
   ... Some languages have special deals with spaces, for example
   in Urdu and CJK we had that.
   ... These are the kind of things that might be useful.
   ... I’m also wondering if some of these are about different
   styles of different writers.

   Behnam: We don’t have a tool in CSS now for controlling space
   after a period.

   <ebrahim> Sorry for being late guys

   Behnam: I agree with Mostafa that this concerns a lot of other
   languages too.
   ... But even if we have the same practice as, say, Latin, we
   can just say that we can follow that practice from another
   script here.

   Najib: I have the same concern as Mostafa. Also, there are some
   language-based rules about punctuations.
   ... In Arabic it is common to use period instead of space
   between numbers to avoid bidi problems.
   ... I have some examples of that in my numbers draft.
   ... It is a more general typographic problem.

   <r12a> [24]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/99

     [24] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/99

   Mostafa: I was just concerned about this being one of the many
   typographic details that we can talk about. But it is not a
   very objective thing. No objection to including this.

   Behnam: We can think more about it. Specially about
   recommending narrow space for Persian.
   ... I’ll try to expand it and get more questions that we can
   answer.

   <behnam> [25]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/100

     [25] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/100

   <behnam_> [26]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/100

     [26] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/100

   Behnam: Is issue #100 something that we want to track in our
   projcet?

   Richard: I think we talked about math before and decided that
   are not including it for the time being.
   ... So I think this can use a “future” label.

   <ebrahim> I was away for some weeks, so on a side discussion,
   was there any progress on finding clues on why Arabic-Indic
   digits direction is different from Extended Arabic-digits
   digits?

   <behnam_> [27]https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/85

     [27] https://github.com/w3c/alreq/issues/85

   <behnam_> Bidi Category of numbers are different #85

   Ebrahim: There was a question about bidi category of different
   digits sets.
   ... I was wondering if there was any progress on that in the
   recent weeks.

   <r12a>
   [28]https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track
   /actions/open?sort=owner

     [28] https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track/actions/open?sort=owner

   <behnam_>
   [29]https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track
   /actions/75

     [29] https://www.w3.org/International/groups/arabic-layout/track/actions/75

   Richard: Shervin has action-75 for answering this.

   <ebrahim>
   [30]https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/persian-computing/6
   02gqTIrlPQ

     [30] https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/persian-computing/602gqTIrlPQ

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

   [End of minutes]