- From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
- Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2012 06:46:21 +0000
- To: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
- Cc: HTML Accessibility Task Force <public-html-a11y@w3.org>, Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com>, James Craig <jcraig@apple.com>, Michael Smith <mike@w3.org>, Henri Sivonen <hsivonen@iki.fi>
- Message-ID: <CA+ri+VmVCVHrBXyOsg312uV214pwYqYebkDTtLhOpaJBAzoCxg@mail.gmail.com>
Hi Maciej, >I'm pretty convinced by your data. Nevertheless, I think the suggested changes would make the <main> spec even stronger. I agree and will respond in detail to the suggestions. regards steve On 3 December 2012 00:49, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com> wrote: > > <chair hat off> > > I'm pretty convinced by your data. Nevertheless, I think the suggested > changes would make the <main> spec even stronger. > > Regards, > Maciej > > > On Dec 2, 2012, at 3:10 PM, Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com> > wrote: > > Hi all, > > have been analysing some of the data I collected previously [1]. Of 50 > pages [2] I have looked at so far (from the set of 400+ pages[3] that I > have added styles to provide easy visual identification of elements > with id=main|content) > 90% of elements with an id=main|content do indeed > contain content that excludes header/nav/footer type content. > > you can see the results and source pages for your selves: > > > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlVP5_A996c5dHozOW14RkF4NEdEUFRvemxCZ2I4Z3c > > I think this is a reasonable indication (please point out if my analysis > is incorrect0 that there is a common concept of what is considered the main > content area of a document and that fears of misuse of an element based on > this concept are over emphasised. > > Do I need to analyse more of the data set or is this enough? > > [1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Oct/0109.html > [2] starting from 296 in the list [RDS.ca<http://www.html5accessibility.com/tests/HTML5-main-content/www.rds.ca/index.html> > ] > [3] http://www.html5accessibility.com/tests/HTML5-main-content/ > > regards > SteveF > > On 2 December 2012 19:10, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com> wrote: > >> >> On Dec 1, 2012, at 6:39 PM, Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 12:19 PM, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com> wrote: >> >>> >>> I think this will be a lot more effective at limiting the harm from >>> potential improper use of <main> than a conformance error. A conformance >>> error is a discouragement for some authors, but most content is >>> non-conforming. Meanwhile, implementation behavior can avoid incorrectly >>> identifying the main content even in the face of authors who do not >>> prioritize document conformance. >>> >> >> >> Could that also include a rule as to what to do in case there is both a >> <main> and a role="main" on the page? While it's a conformance error, >> browsers still need to decide which one to expose to AT. So, maybe in this >> case it would be best to expose the element with role="main" only? >> >> >> Yes, I think it would be good to have rules to disambiguate cases like >> this. It probably makes the most sense for explicit role=main to win, but I >> could also imagine having whichever appears first win. >> >> >> >> I agree with this suggestion. I would also like to see "Scooby Doo" >>> documented properly. I do wonder, however, since (if?) it is only >>> accessibility related, whether it should be in the HTML spec, or in the >>> mapping spec of Stever, or in a WCAG spec. >>> >>> >>> I think a "find the main content" algorithm has non-accessibility uses >>> as well, for example for data mining tools, or for "readability" style >>> tools or browser features. >>> >> >> Right. So it should indeed be part of the extension spec, and thus >> ultimately of HTML, right? >> >> >> If the <main> extension ended up integrated in the HTML spec, then I >> think the HTML spec would clearly be the right place for a "find the main >> content" algorithm. >> >> Regards, >> Maciej >> >> >> >> > > > >
Received on Monday, 3 December 2012 07:50:11 UTC