Media Subteam Teleconference Minutes for 13 July

Minutes from the 13 July teleconference of the HTML-A11Y Task Force
Media Subteam are provided below in text and are available as hypertext
at:

http://www.w3.org/2011/07/13-html-a11y-minutes.html


   W3C

                                                           - DRAFT -

                                          HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

13 Jul 2011

   See also: IRC log

Attendees

   Present
          Janina, John_Foliot, Sean_Hayes, silvia, frankolivier, Judy

   Regrets
   Chair
          John_Foliot

   Scribe
          Janina_Sajka

Contents

     * Topics
         1. W3C Web & TV Workshop http://www.w3.org/2011/09/webtv/
         2. Paused Media: Continuing Discussion
         3. Hierarchical Navigation: Progress Checkin
         4. Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
         5. Other Business?
         6. be done
     * Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

   <trackbot> Date: 13 July 2011

   <scribe> Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon

   <scribe> Scribe: Janina_Sajka

   <scribe> agenda: this

W3C Web & TV Workshop http://www.w3.org/2011/09/webtv/

   jf: Appears there's a total of 4 days of meeting
   ... 2 days of the Workshop at ComCast, followed by 2 days of the W3C IG on Web & TV
   ... Noting major names attending
   ... Asking if Sean will attend?

   Sean: Not me, but likely someone from Microsoft.

   jf: I'll see about attending
   ... Thinking Chaals may attend

Paused Media: Continuing Discussion

   jf: ARIA-Describedby being proposed for several similar situations

   jf; Had extended conversation about the possibilities during Text Subteam past Monday

   jf: Only way is to render on screen

   janina: But, that can be the result of a user action

   jf: So, we need a scheme that can:
   ... A, Indicate there's more data -- discoverability
   ... B: Render that additional data on screen on user action --- perhaps right click?

   <JF> http://blog.ginader.de/dev/jquery/longdesc/examples/webaim/index.php

   jf: jf: This example renders an icon in the corner, clicking on it pulls descript into an iframe
   ... This isn't the answer for us, but it illustrates the kind of thing we need

   janina: So, going back to our old ARIA-Describedby solution,
   ... Can we use something like that, perhaps via right-mouse click?

   jf: We need a way to make the availability of that info discoverable. Second, we need a way for users to choose to
   consume that info.
   ... Whatever the solution, we need a rich solution, we need to support markup in the content
   ... So, it's very similar to the longdesc situation
   ... So, notmeaning to put anyone on the spot, Frank any thoughts?

   fo: No thought yet

   <silvia> I maintain to think that the solution is a kind of shadow dom

   <silvia> http://glazkov.com/2011/01/14/what-the-heck-is-shadow-dom/ <- explains the feature nicely

   jb: Noting some good discussions with W3C team around these issues recently

   jf: Noting the note from Dmitri posted by Silvia
   ... Asking for a quick recap

   <silvia> "Welcome to the twilight DOM — a chunk of document that’s accessible by traversal but not rendered on the
   page."

   sp: Think it explains exactly what we want
   ... He's doing it through js, but I'm pretty sure we can do it in the browser
   ... Believe our ARIA-Describedby strategy will eventually work
   ... But, this isn't a problem with the spec, the problem is implementation

   janina: The spec piece is the markup we're proposing, if we're confident browsers can make that discoverable and show
   it on screen when users ask for it, we're good

   jf: The key is that it needs to become text on screen

   sp: But screen readers are already processing things that are not on screen
   ... Think the same mechanism should work here
   ... Don't think we can pinpoint any issues until we have implementations to look at

   jf: Noting again the similarities with longdesc and noting my long post about to go to list about that, inviting
   people's feedback

   zkim, next item

Hierarchical Navigation: Progress Checkin

   jf: Not sure where we stand

   janina: I was unable to get Marcus to today's call, still an action on me
   ... Also, we had the discussion whether or not a level attribute was needed

   jf: Trying to understand our two proposals
   ... One is nested list

   <silvia> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13184

   jf: And, I think Frank and Sean are proposing the level attribute

   sp: Don't particularly care how we solve it, we do now have the bugs I just pasted in, so we're awaiting an editor
   response
   ... Suggest we just wait at this point
   ... Philip did suggest an algorithm

   fo: Philip did a good job of summarizing, I'm satisfied with that
   ... Question now on how this looks inside the file

   jf: So, if I understand ... Either scheme works, let's see what emerges as the proposal from the editor and respond?
   ... I'm not concerned how we solve, just that a solution is available and articulated in the spec
   ... It's important that this is in the HTML 5 spec, else I've no problem waiting.

   <silvia> algorithm is explained in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Jul/0119.html

   jf: Is that where we're going?

   fo: Sounds right

   jf: Is there any indication of when we might hear from the editor?

   sp: Believe there's a deadline for response on bugs. We should track the bugs.

   jf: Noting there are no keywords on this bug, we should add a11y, a11ytf, and media
   ... I'll do that
   ... sp: Is the issue open?

   janina: #163 was closed without prejudice

   sp: Could file a bug suggesting this approach

   <silvia> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12794

   sp: Perhaps should be annotated with our additional info

   janina: Yes, that there's a way to know that additional data is available for a particular video
   ... And a way to display that additional data on screen on user request

   jf: Last comment was June 14, but we've made progress, and we should show that in the bug tracking

Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open

   jf: Think we're good
   ... Old action #109 on Sean, can you check?

   sh: OK

   janina: Asking if we expect agenda next week?

   jf: We should check in on our open issues, even if our meetings go a bit short
   ... We can decide early next week, Monday?

   janina: sounds good

   jf: Any other business?

   <silvia> note, this is also related: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12228

   jf: Perhaps should look at Bugzilla for media keyword, just to make sure we're not missing something

   janina: good idea

   jf: Perhaps we should ask Thursday's call if Bug Subteam can check for any remaining media bugs

   janina: good

   jf: Anything else?

Other Business?

be done

Summary of Action Items

   [End of minutes]
     __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Found Scribe: Janina_Sajka
Present: Janina John_Foliot Sean_Hayes silvia frankolivier Judy

-- 

Janina Sajka,	Phone:	+1.443.300.2200
		sip:janina@asterisk.rednote.net

Chair, Open Accessibility	janina@a11y.org	
Linux Foundation		http://a11y.org

Chair, Protocols & Formats
Web Accessibility Initiative	http://www.w3.org/wai/pf
World Wide Web Consortium (W3C)

Received on Wednesday, 13 July 2011 22:28:33 UTC