Re: Follow up: Clinical Observations Interoperability Telcon @ Tue Oct 30

Hi Vipul,

We may be thinking of the same thing, but our language differs.

I would make the distinction be between an information model and a  
domain model.

A domain model is something that corresponds to something in the  
world. So when we use a term from a domain model ontology such as  
"liver", we mean livers.

An information model describes a data structure. Here we would talk  
about things like records with fields and the values that fields can  

Often this distinction is blurred, which lands up generating  
confusion. Further blurring things is that there is something in  
between - Observations, namely things that doctors say that may or  
may not be true (because doctors don't have complete information).

The practice of linking a field or a field value to a term from a  
domain model, as SDTM does and as Tom described, is an attempt to  
link the two. To what extent that is effective, I don't know. I  
suspect that it goes some, but not all the way, towards addressing  
Kersten's concerns.

I don't know if you've had a look at a short paper I was a coauthor  
on [1]. In it we distinguish between the record level, the statement  
level, and the domain level. I think that the situation in clinical  
informatics might be similarly partitioned. The domain level  
corresponds to actual things that happen to patients. The statement  
level corresponds to observations, and the record level corresponds  
to information model.



On Nov 2, 2007, at 4:33 PM, Kashyap, Vipul wrote:

> Kerstin,
> Thanks for your response. After reading your message carefully, I  
> realized that
> you are heading into the heart of the issue related to the  
> interrelationship
> between an information model and a terminology.
> At some level, the approach taken by the SDTM is similar to the  
> approach
> taken by the DCM folks. The commonality is that a structure/class  
> is modeled to
> represent a Vital Sign and then a code from a controlled  
> terminology is inserted
> to give meaning to that data structure. The difference is that SDTM
> models an abstract class called VSTEST and DCM models each of these  
> vital signs,
> such as BloodPressure as different classes. This actually will lead
> to changing the spreadsheet. Will send it to you after I update it.  
> Some other
> comments are inserted inline.
>> Slide 1-3 visualise the concept structure in NCIt for Diastolic Blood
> Pressure, Pregnancy Test and Postpartum Hypertensions
>> - Slide 1: the concept with the preferred term Diastolic Blood  
>> Pressure as a
> sub-concept of Personal Attribute.
>> - Slide 2: the concept with the synonym Pregnancy Test as a sub- 
>> concept of
> Laboratory Procedure.
>> - Slide 3: the concept with the preferred term Postpartum  
>> Hypertensions as a
> sub-concept of Finding.
> VK> This is interesting as each of the concepts and relationships  
> in the NCI
> terminology have to be aligned with each of the classes in the DCM  
> model and the
> concepts in Snomed as well. This alignment has to be at the global  
> rather than
> the local level.
> The information transmitted in this electronic communication is  
> intended only for the person or entity to whom it is addressed and  
> may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review,  
> retransmission, dissemination or other use of or taking of any  
> action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities  
> other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received  
> this information in error, please contact the Compliance HelpLine  
> at 800-856-1983 and properly dispose of this information.

Received on Saturday, 3 November 2007 07:52:30 UTC