- From: Thierry MICHEL <tmichel@w3.org>
- Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2015 20:08:10 +0100
- To: "public-digipub-ig@w3.org >> W3C Digital Publishing IG" <public-digipub-ig@w3.org>
Hi all,
The minutes of the Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
dated 2015-03-02 are now available at
http://www.w3.org/2015/03/02-dpub-minutes.html
These public minutes are also linked from the dpub wiki
http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Meetings
Also find these minutes in a text version following, for your convenience.
Best,
Thierry Michel
----------------------------------------------
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
02 Mar 2015
[2]Agenda
[2]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub-ig/2015Mar/0000.html
See also: [3]IRC log
[3] http://www.w3.org/2015/03/02-dpub-irc
Attendees
Present
Alan Stearns (Stearns), Tzviya Siegman (tzviya), Brady
Duga (duga), Charles LaPierre (clapierre), Dave Cramer
(dauwhe), Nick Ruffilo (NickRuffilo), Ivan Herman
(ivan), Peter Kreutzberger (pkra), Karen Myers (Karen),
Deborah Kaplan (dkaplan3), Julie Morris (Julie_Morris),
Bill Kasdorf (Bill_Kasdorf), Ayla Stein (Ayla_Stein),
Thierry Michel (tmichel), Ben De Meester (bjdmeest),
Paul Belfanti (pbelfanti), Markus Gylling (Markus), Mike
Miller (MikeMiller), Tim Cole (TimCole), Vladimir
Levantovsky (vlad), Kawakubo (kwkbtr), Shinyu Murakami
(murakami), Laura Fowler (lfowler), David Stroup
(david_stroup), Liza Daly (liza),+1.585.217.aaee,
+1.617.426.aaaa, +1.217.300.aabb,
+1.781.970.aacc,+1.646.336.aadd.
Regrets
Luc Audrain, Phil Madans, Heather Flanagan
Chair
Tzviya Siegman (tzviya)
Scribe
Nick Ruffilo
Contents
* [4]Topics
1. [5]Houdini
2. [6]call for comments from CSS WG on CSS fragmentation
module level 3
3. [7]epub3.1 work plan
4. [8]IDPF Workplans
* [9]Summary of Action Items
__________________________________________________________
<trackbot> Date: 02 March 2015
<NickRuffilo> What are the dial-in instructions again?
<NickRuffilo> OK i found it, thanks
<NickRuffilo> Anyone know a web-based way to dial in to the
call?
<ivan> scribenick: NickRuffilo
<tzviya> scribenick: NickRuffilo
<ivan> scribe: Nick
I may have to quickly exit, as I have contractors working on my
heating system, if so, I'll type "!!!!!!"
Otherwise I'll be scribe for today
Any notes as first-time scribe? just write what people say?
Ivan, I'm here
TY
<astearns> NickRuffilo: summarize, and don't be shy about
telling people to shut up so you can catch up
scribe: Scratch Nick from Regrets list
<tzviya> [10]http://www.w3.org/2015/02/23-dpub-minutes.html
[10] http://www.w3.org/2015/02/23-dpub-minutes.html
Tzviya: "review the minutes from last week, any comments? Alan
posted something on the list about packaging"
...: "Minutes approved..."
Houdini
...: "Turn over to Alan and Dave. The magic of CSS + Houdini.
VINI VIDI VICI"
"I was at the houdini meeting. Goal is to extend CSS. Cover big
black box where stuff goes in, stuff comes out. If magic isn't
what you want, it is difficult to make changes"
"goal of houdini is to make a script to make it easier to
understand how a browser lays things out."
"Lots of things about properties and exposing the parser..."
<ivan> s/"I was"/Alan: "I was"/
"Script to be able to handle the new stuff. Also more
complicated things like exposing where things are being drawn
in a more robust way than we are doing so far. Also letting
scripts determine where things will be drawn, or letting
scripts change the way things are handled. Custom layouts..."
<astearns>
[11]http://www.mail-archive.com/dev-servo@lists.mozilla.org/msg
01131.html
[11]
http://www.mail-archive.com/dev-servo@lists.mozilla.org/msg01131.html
scribe: "Simon Sapin gave a great introduction (link above)
summarized each of the documents the task for will be working
on."
... "The sense I got was - bunch of enthusiasm, no public NOs,
but lots of private skeptisism"
... "This is a thing to keep track of, to make sure people
aren't going overboard, but probably less than 1/2 of what was
discussed will see movement in the next year or so"
... "Hopefully I will find others who are interested in pushing
the little bits and plumbing related items."
Charles: ? "Red flag - was there any talk of accessibility in
any of thisLaPierre "
Alan: "It was discussed, some of this stuff could be useful for
accessiblity. One message posted to the list yesterday, was
allowing in custom-layout, having custom line-break. More
sophisticated outline for better line measures. People are
doing this today - on canvas - so it loses accessibility."
...: "If there is a way to hook into the actual drawing of the
text, it can make the text displayed nicer with more
accessibility. But it's always something to consider. Custom
boxes need to be full citizens with full access, etc..."
Tzviya: "Dave/alan - can you give us an idea of how this might
affect digital pub - near/long term."
<tzviya> vivliostyle summary of Houdini:
[12]http://vivliostyle.com/2015/02/sydney
[12] http://vivliostyle.com/2015/02/sydney
Alan: "Near term there is a new - vivliostyle - that is looking
to put pagination on top of existing browser using scripting.
Some of the low-level elements are what they need in order to
make a 'nice' reading experience in the browser. They were in
the meeting and will be involved. Their work will be
accelerated if the lower-level work gets going"
....: "Longer term, it may be that some engines that do not
immediately support a paginated view, but allow a paginated
view through custom scripts, etc. Some engines may go that
route."
Peter: ? "Is the following helpful: I'm in the process of
organizing in the MathML group - how can MathML move closer to
other standards? There is lots of duplication. Are these useful
use-cases for this group that could be related? Altmetrics? API
has there been any discussion on that?"
<dauwhe> Peter Linss reports on the Houdini meeting to the TAG:
[13]https://github.com/w3ctag/meetings/blob/gh-pages/2015/telco
ns/02-26-houdini-minutes.md#css-extensibilityhoudini
[13]
https://github.com/w3ctag/meetings/blob/gh-pages/2015/telcons/02-26-houdini-minutes.md#css-extensibilityhoudini
Alan: "Going over what voids what MathML needs is a terrific
topic for the Houdini group. If there are extensions to CSS
that MathML needs, thats useful. On FontMetrics? that is the
one document I'm on the hook for, so I'd really like to see
your requirements about what measurments you'd need from the
fonts. Also, where you'd need the used-font-info to be used."
<david_stroup> I'm 585.217
Alan: "All the info in the world isn't useful if you don't know
what the browser is actually using. And where they're drawing
the fonts in the font box."
Peter - ** Action item - send MathML interests to be discussed
with the Houdini group
<tzviya> action gather font metric info from MathWG for Houdini
<trackbot> Error finding 'gather'. You can review and register
nicknames at <[14]http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/track/users>.
[14] http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/track/users
<ivan> action pkra to gather font metric info from the MathWG
for Houdini
<trackbot> Created ACTION-48 - Gather font metric info from the
mathwg for houdini [on Peter Krautzberger - due 2015-03-09].
Tzviya: "Question to all - what would you like from DPUB going
forward?"
Alan? : "If any of you are involved with scripting projects
that do custom layouts/drawing, that CSS doesn't do today, if
there are problems/hacks, please let us know/post them to
Houdini. Will help guide the work that we are doing."
...: "Microsoft group is heavily interested in Pagination... As
with DigiPub..."
Ivan: "Question is - what kind of time do you expect before we
will see a result that the publishing world can directly use?
Taking into account the real-interest from the core
web-engine/browser vendors..."
Alan: "Too early to guess. Hasn't been movements on the
documents since the meeting ended. Best scenario is some
movement on custom properties in the next few months. The
adoption will make CSS polyfills MUCH easier to create."
...: "Then might see some movement on other items, like
FontMetrics, but those are the only ones we'll see adoption in
the next year or so. The rest are long-term planning."
... "I'm being pessimistic..."
Dave: "One more possibly helpful thing - if people see some of
these ideas as being useful to them - talk to the iBooks team
couldn't hurt anyway.
...: "Would get webkit to work on some of these features..."
... "Also note that Houdini was discussed at the tags meeting
as well."
... "IRC logs for that meeting [can someone post link?] might
provide some useful perspective"
call for comments from CSS WG on CSS fragmentation module level 3
Tzviya: "Next time - call for comments on Working Draft of CSS
Fragmentation Module Level 3"
<tzviya> [15]http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-break/
[15] http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-break/
<pkra> bedtime reading.
!!!!!! - have to go, scribe out
<ivan> scribenick: tzviya
<ivan> scribenick: liza
<tzviya> volunteers to review and comment: brady, liza
<ivan> scribenick: tzviya
<liza> SOUNDS THRILLING
ivan: how does this relate to Houdini?
astearns: Rossen sees a need for additional breaking
opportunities, but needs to fill in what that need is
tzviya: will the fragmentation spec serve as a stop-gap?
astearns: Frag spec includes some really good information for
how to break pages, etc. But, Brady's use cases have many more
requirements
... such as letting a script know where a page starts
... this will be filled in by Houdini in the Fragment Tree doc
<dauwhe> scribenick: dauwhe
<ivan> scribenick: dauwhe
epub3.1 work plan
IDPF Workplans
tzviya: this came up at edupub meeting in sunny Arizona
<Ayla_Stein> Wait until May/June
<ivan> scribenick: NickRuffilo
<dauwhe> scribenick: NickRuffilo
<pbelfanti> Apologies, I need to drop
<ivan> Markus' slides from the meeting:
[16]http://bit.ly/1AwoYW4
[16] http://bit.ly/1AwoYW4
Tzviya: "Epub 3.1 was released severl months ago. Bug fixes,
and ISO wording + backwards compatibiliyt. Marcus opened up
floor for next version. There was lots of discussion about what
might be done, no formal decisions. 3d format as a core media
type. Migration of epub type to role attribute. Expression
extended presentations from doc..."
...: "One example - using the filmstrip to see what document
looks like on the inside. Some possible deprication of things
for epub - such as switch tag. No discussion on timeline, so
not sure when work is getting started."
<pkra> yes.
...: "Goal of ePub 3 is to go in a webby-ier direction. So the
work is towards a convergence."
Brady: "At this point, we're still trying to decide what the
direction of 3.1 is, so if you have a voice, we can hear it.
Gathering requirements is now. Not sure on direction as we're
listening."
Tzviya: If you think something is missing, please comment. CSS
Profile?
... Contact Marcus with your thoughts/suggestions. No official
timeline
<david_stroup> Apologies, I need to drop as well...
Bill_Kasdorf_Kasdorf: Instead of providing ways to embed more
and more metadata within the epub, be able to embed a link to
an authoritative service [nick - such as DOI, etc]
...: One reason I bring this up, is that it relates to recent
identifiers work
... Grand total of 1 volunteer for Identifier work, so if you
want to help PLEASE do
Ivan: "Was on the road + Thierry was on vacations. I will work
with you."
Thierry: "I have created the Identifier wiki : Link below:"
<tmichel> the identifiers wiki is linked from the wiki main
page
<tmichel> [17]http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Main_Page
[17] http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Main_Page
<tmichel> and is available at
[18]http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Task_Forces/identifiers
[18] http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Task_Forces/identifiers
Julie: "Are there clear timelines on the taskforce page as to
when they are starting?"
Tzviya: "Cleanup is needed, we need to work on this. "
...: " This is the beginning of conference season, but we
should work on updating timelines and making sure that data on
the wiki is accurate"
... " Maybe next meeting have a check-in with task forces to
ensure updated data."
Summary of Action Items
[End of minutes]
__________________________________________________________
Minutes formatted by David Booth's [19]scribe.perl version
1.140 ([20]CVS log)
$Date: 2015-03-02 19:00:49 $
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[19] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
[20] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
Scribe.perl diagnostic output
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[21] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
FAILED: s/"I was"/Alan: "I was"/
Succeeded: s/Simone? Sipan/Simon Sapin/
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ScribeNicks: NickRuffilo, tzviya, liza, dauwhe
Present: Ben_De_Meester
WARNING: Fewer than 3 people found for Present list!
WARNING: Replacing previous Regrets list. (Old list: Heather, Nick, Phil
)
Use 'Regrets+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the lis
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such as: <dbooth> Regrets+ Luc
Regrets: Luc
Agenda: [22]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub-ig/2015M
ar/0000.html
[22]
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub-ig/2015Mar/0000.html
WARNING: No meeting chair found!
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<dbooth> Chair: dbooth
Found Date: 02 Mar 2015
Guessing minutes URL: [23]http://www.w3.org/2015/03/02-dpub-minutes.html
People with action items:
[23] http://www.w3.org/2015/03/02-dpub-minutes.html
[End of [24]scribe.perl diagnostic output]
[24] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/%7Echeckout%7E/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
Received on Monday, 2 March 2015 19:08:20 UTC