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[Minutes] 2015-02-02Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference

From: Thierry MICHEL <tmichel@w3.org>
Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2015 19:06:27 +0100
Message-ID: <54CFBCA3.1090902@w3.org>
To: "public-digipub-ig@w3.org >> W3C Digital Publishing IG" <public-digipub-ig@w3.org>
Hi all,

The minutes of the Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference 
dated 2015-02-02 are now available at


These public minutes are also linked from the dpub wiki

Also find these minutes in a text version following, for your convenience.


Thierry Michel



       [1] http://www.w3.org/

             Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference

02 Feb 2015

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2015/02/02-dpub-irc


           Markus Gylling (Markus), Julie Morris (Julie_Morris),
           Bill Kasdorf (Bill_Kasdorf), Shinyu Murakami (murakami),
           Thierry Michel (tmichel), Ben de Meester (bjdmeest),
           Heather Flanagan (HeatherF), Tzviya Siegman (tzviya),
           Ivan Herman (Ivan),  Kawakubo (kwkbtr), Mike Miller
           (MikeMiller), Charles LaPierre (clapierre), Nick Ruffilo
           (NickRuffilo), Dave Cramer (dauwhe), Deborah Kaplan
           (dkaplan3), Karen Myers (Karen_Myers),Peter Kreutzberger
           (pkra), Alan Stearns (Stearns), Liam Quin (Liam), Peter
           Linss (plinss), Paul Belfanti (pbelfanti), Tim Cole
           (TimCole), Rego Casasnovas (rego), Luc Audrain
           (laudrain), Brady Duga (duga), Phil Madans (philm),
           Ralph Swick (Ralph), Bert Boss (Bert), mihnea, iank.



           Peter, Karen.


      * [3]Topics
      * [4]Summary of Action Items

    <trackbot> Date: 02 February 2015

    <HeatherF> I'm having trouble dialing in to the zakim bridge
    today. It's not letting me reconnect.

    <tzviya> scribenick: pkra

    see what i did there

    mgylling: start off: objections to approving last week's

    <ivan> scribenick: pkra

    mgylling: none. Thanks.
    ... first part: EPUB-Web next steps.

    <tzviya> minutes:

       [5] http://www.w3.org/2015/01/26-dpub-minutes.html

    <tzviya> and I forgot to write a summary!

    mgylling: second part: short update from TFs

    <HeatherF> My IP calling to the zakim bridge is failing
    miserably this morning - I will email my update re: i18n info.

    mgylling: back in november, Ivan, mgylling published the white
    paper epub-web

    <ivan> [6]White paper

       [6] http://w3c.github.io/epubweb/

    mgylling: discussed in Santa Clara, some feedback otherwise.
    ... paints a vision for a future scenario of digital
    ... modernized view of portable documents, in the context of
    ... how does it related to OWP, epub etc? Online and portable
    are not distinction but just states.
    ... to be clear: white paper, first attempt at future vision.
    No rec-trac, WG etc.
    ... what it's trying to get to: work on topics raised in the
    paper, functional requirements, use cases etc.
    ... then make informed decisions for next steps.
    ... after publication in November, will be co-published of IDPF
    and W3C with more exposure
    ... update is drafted right now

    <ivan> [7]Issue tracker

       [7] https://github.com/w3c/epubweb/issues

    mgylling: accompanying article to discuss prerequisites,
    business case etc is being worked on by Bill McCoy etc
    ... please review and provide feedback. Use the issue tracker.

    <tzviya> -->issue tracker:

       [8] https://github.com/w3c/epubweb/issues

    mgylling: Also: this Spring we want to start making informed
    decisions. This means getting the right stakeholders to the
    ... W3C and IDPF are not all there is. Would like to attract
    ... @group: how can you help us with outreach?
    ... first step is co-published version. Then bring it with us
    to LBF, BEA etc.

    <laudrain> How do you see relation with future version of EPUB3

    Nick: paper is well done already, very good mission statement.
    What is the intended goal for publishing the paper? Just bring
    more ppl to the table or other expected methods of
    communication? E.g., webinar to work through paper, online
    discussion etc.

    mgylling: re goals. Clarify: outreach or the work?

    Nick: is the goal of the paper to educate ppl in the group,
    bring in new ppl, something else?

    mgylling: find out how many organizations are interested in
    realizing the work.
    ... before starting work, it would be good to be in touch with
    the functional requirements. Right now "shallow" and we want to
    add more depth in terms of requirements.

    Ivan: re outreach. That's something we are discussing
    ourselves. So we're happy to get suggestions there as well.
    ... once we have the separate article, we will try to publish
    it somewhere, make more noise about it.
    ... then there are several events where we want to talk about
    ... with tzviya will be in Toronto. Ivan in Paris in March
    ... perhaps something for IDPF conf in NYC.
    ... if you have ideas, please share with us.
    ... webinar is something we should think about. But perhaps for
    a later point.

    Paul: is it on target for edpub in Phoenix?

    mgylling: no dedicated session but part of planning session.

    <Karen> +1 webinar; high-level or technical level

    dauwhe: would like to stress outreach to browser makers.
    Implementation challenge will exist. Getting feedback as early
    as possible would be wise.

    <tzviya> +1

    Ivan: yes, critical. we'll be using W3C contacts.

    tzviya: in background we've been discussing how the work we've
    been dealing with in the group touches this. In particular, the
    TF work.

    <ivan> +1 to Bill

    Bill_ in terms of outreach / evangelization: keep expectation
    management in mind, in particular with publishers. Ppl might
    think "this is the next epub" or "I better wait for this"

    scribe: we don't want that to happen.

    <Ralph> +1 to Bill

    scribe: if they see a new packaging spec in the W3C, then ppl
    shouldn't think "that's vs IDPF packaging" but rather: "these
    will converge"

    mgylling: important to provide joint timeline.

    Ivan: we're aiming exactly for something like that.

    Julie: comment: BISG should be able to help in various ways for
    outreach. E.g. content structure committee. I wonder if
    distilled version would be feasible. "10 things you need to
    know about epub-web now" with points that are important for
    publishing etc.

    <Karen> +1 higher level take-aways

    <clapierre1> +1

    Bill_ thanks, yes.

    laudrain: re new versions of epub3. How will e.g. epub3.1 be
    positioned vs epub-web?

    mgylling: next epub3 update is short term update, small
    iteration, backward compatible. Very distinct.

    tzviya: as mentioned in discussion: IDPF hoping to iterate epub
    while W3C iterates its work, and the two converge.

    <laudrain> +1

    TimCole: often when you want to take a package off the web (as
    portable) you decide what package to take. Re 3.7 user
    customization. Can the user decide what they'll take?

    mgylling: yes, there'll be that kind of customizability. Or
    rather: not prevented, building blocks for content
    personalization. Good use case.
    ... Second part: consequences for the IG.
    ... we've been working on use cases and functionality
    requirements. The paper includes many references.
    ... we could look at various TF efforts, reflecting parts of
    the requirements gathering, building of solutions. But moving
    forward, should we create one or more TFs to better understand
    the problem?

    <mgylling> ach mgy


       [9] http://w3c.github.io/epubweb/#achieving-convergence-work-areas

    mgylling: e.g., from problem list. Lots of these we already
    have activities working towards.
    ... generic archive format, metadata,
    styling/layout/pagination, presentation control,
    personalization etc
    ... but not complete "coverage"
    ... what should we focus on sooner rather than later?

    tzviya: we might need a few ppl working on packaging. Maybe not
    a whole task force

    Ivan: relative high priority. Should flow into the relevant WG
    from the start.
    ... we're coming in at the right moment and we must make use of

    mgylling: right now mgylling, tzviya, Liza, brady
    ... one activity: understand requirements from publishing
    perspective. Assert that the needs are met.
    ... streamability not the only requirement for a package.

    tzviya: can offer 1 publisher perspective.

    <Ralph> Tzviya++

    mgylling: another big one: document&fragment identification.

    <Bill_Kasdorf> s/assert/ascertain

    mgylling: we need something here. Don't know if the problem is
    well enough described in the white paper.

    <Bill_Kasdorf> +1

    mgylling: maybe good fit for metadat TF?

    Bill_Kasdorf: yes.

    tzviya: also overlaps with packaging.

    Ivan: re identifier/linkage ppl who worked on metadata are
    usually sensitive to the needs.
    ... metadata TF's work is now at equilibrium so sounds like a
    good idea.

    mgylling: rumor last year for media fragments WG (?)
    ... that would be great fit if it happens.
    ... next example: security & privacy models. Everybody wants
    it, everybody worried. We would love more input.

    <Bill_Kasdorf> note that the fragmentation issue also includes
    the issue of inheritance of metadata, which is another fit for
    the Metadata TF

    mgylling: if you have suggestions for ppl, do let us know.

    Karen: might make sense to have briefing with domain lead Wendy
    Seltzer (?) about liaison with Technology and Society Domain
    Staff about Security and Privacy and WebCrypto WGs rechartered.
    ... should get together with Wendy's group.

    <Karen> s/Zelter/Seltzer

    mgylling: end of Feb. publication.
    ... tie additional work to this.
    ... additional efforts on packaging, doc identifier.
    ... second part: updates from TFs please
    ... first off Deborah and Charles.

    Charles: met with number of ppl twice a week. Started to work
    on WCAG spec and techniques, go through them, taking on chunks,
    identifying relevance.
    ... about a dozen main topic areas.
    ... left now: client side scripting, common failures, parts of
    HTML-specifics. The rest we've reviewed for digipub.
    ... the reviewers have classified with comments.
    ... will focus on WCAG first. Had George Kerschner and ??? to
    offer directions
    ... after finishing first round: bring it to wiki format.
    ... identify what's limiting for digital publishing and what's

    <tzviya> s/Charles(Jeanne Spellman)/clapierre

    Charles: identify what's missing from these documents wrt
    digital publishing.
    ... many volunteers but not many able to be active.
    ... we could use extra help.

    <Karen> Scribenick: Karen

    Peter: We are scheduled...

    some last-minute feedback on surveys to work in

    scribe: plan to send survey to a first group of people who were
    ... We have this longer list to send the survey to
    ... It is still open if you have some good contacts, please
    send me an email
    ... Don't put email on the public Google doc
    ... unless people are comfortable with public email
    ... Question I have
    ... go through question in batches
    ... maybe first 10-15 people to have wider set of testers
    ... My questions is should we aim for a more public run later
    ... after we survey the people we have identified
    ... Should we do anything more public?
    ... to amass more data
    ... Not sure if necessary or useful
    ... but I wanted to ask

    Markus: Maybe we will be in a better position to answer that
    after the first run

    <ivan> +1 to markus

    Peter: that makes sense
    ... if good people don't provide good feedback, then we would
    not have...
    ... Yes, let's go ahead with that

    Tzviya: This is a formal action item
    ... Have you sent survey out; can we close it?

    Peter: No, I will do it this week

    Tzviya: We can close action 34

    Peter: look forward to that
    ... want to work out a couple of bugs and hopefully send out

    Tzviya: Thank you

    <pkra> mgylling: ARIA / struct. semantics

    <pkra> tzviya: we've been working with ARIA DPUB TF.

    <ivan> scribenick: pkra

    Tzviya: shifting the terms into ARIA notations.
    ... heated discussion for footnotes

    mgylling: first editor draft end of Feb.

    tzviya: first draft of digipub vocab as ARIA module.

    mgylling: link to repo?

    Ivan: will add it.

    mgylling: up next: i18n review.

    Ivan: Heather couldn't get on the call due to Zakim problems.
    Liza not here either.

    mgylling: postponed.

    <ivan> [10]the structural semantics document

      [10] http://w3c.github.io/dpub-content-and-markup/

    <HeatherF> I did post an update to the public digipub list

    mgylling: next up: houdini cluster

    <HeatherF> Hopefully that will give folks something to think
    about before the next call.

    Brady: not much since last time. Feedback into the Wiki page.

    mgylling: are we approaching a point where we can ask for more
    widespread review?

    Brady: yes. Needs more widespread review.
    ... need feedback from implementors.

    mgylling: will get some from IDPF
    ... re personalization. We said last week. We'll collect and
    collate what's in the wiki (it's spread out) clean up.
    mgylling, tzviya and Liza working on that. Please add yourself.
    ... as TimCole pointed out, scope of content should be in

    pkra: MathWG has put out a note on speech annotation for
    ... please provide feedback. pkra will post link to group.

    Ivan: for whitepaper, plz send all comments on digipub list.
    And I mean all of them.

    <clapierre1> Thanks Peter

Summary of Action Items

    [End of minutes]

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