- From: Tatsunori Uchino via GitHub <noreply@w3.org>
- Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2025 14:27:43 +0000
- To: public-css-archive@w3.org
> That is a fault on operating system and browser vendors, it has no relation to how system-ui should behave. NOPE. Windows users may run extremely old apps like an antique. It may expect MS UI Gothic or Meiryo UI, which are former Japanese UI fonts. Windows platform has too many old or even rotten (proprietary) applications to let users choose the system font. > Still not an issue with W3C definition. There are too many premises to utilize the current `system-ui` effective: 1. The language of text should match to that of `lang` attribute. (causes unified han shape mismatch issue) 2. If the OS vendor do not want to cause the problem 1., it has to produce a huge CJK unified font like Source Han Sans/Serif or Noto Sans/Serif CJK. It places a significant burden on OS vendors. 3. The text should not be too long. Short label text or its description is ideal. 4. It does not assure that the allocated font is the most beautiful or readable even in, or mostly optimized for long text in the system (except for OSes made by Apple). Those who abuse `system-ui` will not know them and we should warn them in the specs (or MDN). > developers and designers want to mimic the original feel of the user's operating system (with or without user preference), and that is definitely a valid use case to discard the notion of deprecating or removing system-ui. Agree. I wish designers of frameworks understood it. > any font that has ”UI“ in its name is intended and designed to be used for short labels etc. within the user interface and not for longer, multi-line text Segoe UI may be the _only_ exception but I wonder why it is so fervently worshipped because it looks relatively condensed compared to Arial, Open Sans, and Roboto. I wonder if someone have compared it with Arial Nova or Neue Haas Grotesk (unfortunately neither are built in Windows for CJK languages by default). I haven't seen font family definitions that adopt Arial Nova or Neue Haas Grotesk as OS Latin fonts. > using system-ui can lead to display issues for some user-agents We should mention "especially long text like documents or blogs". system-ui is sufficient in short UI labels to some extent. Also, We may have to mention the words "Electron" or "WebView" to raise expected use cases, too. -- GitHub Notification of comment by tats-u Please view or discuss this issue at https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/3658#issuecomment-3303279878 using your GitHub account -- Sent via github-notify-ml as configured in https://github.com/w3c/github-notify-ml-config
Received on Wednesday, 17 September 2025 14:27:44 UTC