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Re: TAG feedback on Web Audio

From: Ehsan Akhgari <ehsan.akhgari@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2013 18:10:33 -0400
Message-ID: <CANTur_6y+CGeMLEGuc3DUEEBcTTp5rb=tqakBsP=KBXPGgHQ9Q@mail.gmail.com>
To: Chris Wilson <cwilso@google.com>
Cc: Noah Mendelsohn <nrm@arcanedomain.com>, Anne van Kesteren <annevk@annevk.nl>, Olivier Thereaux <Olivier.Thereaux@bbc.co.uk>, "robert@ocallahan.org" <robert@ocallahan.org>, Alex Russell <slightlyoff@google.com>, "public-audio@w3.org" <public-audio@w3.org>, "www-tag@w3.org List" <www-tag@w3.org>
On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 6:04 PM, Chris Wilson <cwilso@google.com> wrote:

> I'm just saying "race condition" is a general term for a situation where
> output is dependent on the sequence or timing of other events.  Racing is
> inherent in an async platform with entropy in it; that doesn't make it bad.
>  If this is explicitly about multithreaded unsynchronized data variable
> access, that should be stated.
>

Race conditions and data races are different although there is an overlap.
Please see <http://blog.regehr.org/archives/490>.  I know that this
terminology has caused massive confusion in this thread, and I'm sorry
about that, but unfortunately I can't think of better terminology here.  :/

--
Ehsan
<http://ehsanakhgari.org/>




> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 2:45 PM, Ehsan Akhgari <ehsan.akhgari@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 1:43 PM, Chris Wilson <cwilso@google.com> wrote:
>>
>>> In addition, I'd ask that you be more explicit than calling this problem
>>> "data races", because there's clearly some explicit effect you're trying to
>>> prevent.  Any asynchronously-programmable or event-driven system can enable
>>> developers to introduce race conditions.
>>>
>>
>> This problem is known as data races in the common multi-threaded
>> terminology, but I'm personally not attached to that name, whatever other
>> name which conveys what we mean is fine.  :-)
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ehsan
>> <http://ehsanakhgari.org/>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 10:09 PM, Noah Mendelsohn <nrm@arcanedomain.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 7/29/2013 7:05 PM, Anne van Kesteren wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Jul 27, 2013 at 9:22 AM, Noah Mendelsohn<nrm@arcanedomain.com>
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> >Again, I have no informed opinions on the specific merits, just
>>>>>> suggesting a
>>>>>> >useful role the TAG might play to clarify for the many members of the
>>>>>> >community who are less expert on this than you are. Thank you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>  I'm not sure we call out data races anywhere, it's something we just
>>>>> don't do.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Well, my recollection may be faulty, but I think that one of the
>>>> reasons the TAG took the trouble to formalize things like the architecture
>>>> document was the belief that it's easier to ask skeptics to stick to rules
>>>> that have been written down, and especially those that have garnered formal
>>>> consensus through something like the Recommendation track.
>>>>
>>>> Whether it's worth taking a guideline on data races all the way to Rec
>>>> I'm not sure, but it seems that it would be worth setting it down formally,
>>>> perhaps in a TAG Finding/blog post/Recommendation or whatever will get the
>>>> right level of discussion, consensus building, and eventually attention.
>>>>
>>>> Certainly, of the many things that have come up recently relating to
>>>> APIs, this one seems deeply architectural and very much within the TAG's
>>>> remit.
>>>>
>>>> Noah
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
Received on Wednesday, 31 July 2013 22:11:42 UTC

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