- From: Chris Rogers <crogers@google.com>
- Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2012 10:01:19 -0700
- To: Alistair MacDonald <al@signedon.com>
- Cc: Randell Jesup <randell-ietf@jesup.org>, public-audio@w3.org
- Message-ID: <CA+EzO0mrUHsYqGgJ+MeiJPUOLazmVRg_7R2Pu5PE0Gy5V27-sg@mail.gmail.com>
On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 9:05 AM, Alistair MacDonald <al@signedon.com> wrote: > Randell's 1-5 suggestions are very interesting. > > I would think putting this behavior on the destination node might be odd. > But I wonder if adding this kind of behavior to a something like the gain > node might be useful? > > For example: if I wanted to combine Video-Chat with a DAW (UC-1 & UC3), > then the following issues would be in play... > > 1) If a VOIP stream stops suddenly, the user might think there was a > pop/click in their audio track. Adding a tail/decay would be a solution. > (Randell's Option 3) > 2) Being a DAW, we would need as much CPU as possible. So avoiding the > tail calculation in JavaScript would be ideal. > We should be able to do this today with a fade-out using an AudioGainNode. > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 16, 2012 at 5:31 PM, Randell Jesup <randell-ietf@jesup.org> > wrote: > > On 4/16/2012 4:10 PM, Chris Rogers wrote: > > > > > > > > On Sun, Apr 15, 2012 at 12:22 PM, <lemeslep@free.fr> wrote: > >> > >> On the current Web Audio draft, it is mentionned in §15.2 that "Audio > >> glitches are caused by an interruption of the normal continuous audio > >> stream, resulting in loud clicks and pops. It is considered to be a > >> catastrophic failure of a multi-media system and must be avoided." > >> And I can't agree more with this! > >> I'm currently facing those ugly audio glitches in my project. I'm using > >> Mozilla's Audio Data API at the moment, and I think I know how browsers > >> could help me to mitigate this problem. > >> > >> The clicks and pops are happening because if the audio buffer is > underrun > >> by the javascript app, the audio card is not feeded anymore, and so the > card > >> output goes straight from the value of the last sample played to 0. > >> What would be needed is, perhaps as an option in the Javascript audio > node > >> (?), to have the browser automatically feed the audio card by > sustaining the > >> last sample the javascript application sent, when the audio buffer is > >> underrun. > >> > >> That would really go a long way towards minimizing this critical issue. > > > > > > Hi Philippe, I don't think this will help with the glitches. Using this > > approach, an under-run will still be quite audible. And it's not a good > > idea to send a constant (non-zero) value out to the audio hardware since > > this represents a "DC offset" and can cause even worse problems. > > > > > > Since underruns may happen no matter what you do (especially if > main-thread > > JS is involved), it's best to minimize the impact of them. On an > underrun, > > the primary options are: > > > > 1) send 0's (which generally is the audio device default if you don't > feed > > it) - clicks/pops > > 2) repeat last sample - classic lost-packet basic VoIP technique; works > ok > > in most cases; requires blending at start/end to avoid click/pop. Often > > done at a reduced volume which makes it less noticable. > > 3) decay - take last sample and decay it to silence to avoid click/pop - > > more useful if you expect continued lack of source. Can be variant of #2 > > where you progressively decay each missing frame. > > 4) fancier VoIP-style packet loss concealment - better than #2; may tend > to > > be voice-centric > > 5) fancier loss concealment using non-voice centric prediction (waving > hands > > here; I'm sure such things exist for good CD/DVD/etc players). > > > > -- > > Randell Jesup > > randell-ietf@jesup.org > > > > -- > Alistair MacDonald > SignedOn, Inc - W3C Audio WG > Boston, MA, (707) 701-3730 > al@signedon.com - http://signedon.com >
Received on Tuesday, 17 April 2012 17:01:55 UTC